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jeunes non scolarisés et déscolarisés

English translation: youth who do not attend (or have never attended) school and drop-outs

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GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
French term or phrase:jeunes non scolarisés et déscolarisés
English translation:youth who do not attend (or have never attended) school and drop-outs
Entered by: Yolanda Broad
Options:
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08:03 Jul 5, 2003
French to English translations [PRO]
French term or phrase: jeunes non scolarisés et déscolarisés
Led groupes ciblés par cette composante sont surtout ceux qu sont les plus vulnérable dans le context du pays. Il s'agit notamment des jeunes (garçons et filles) scolarisés, les jeunes non scolarisés et déscolarisés.

(Project about HIV/AIDS prevention)
I am finding it difficult to indicate the difference between the terms "non scolarisé" et "déscolarisé"
Paula Price
Local time: 21:52
youth who do not attend (or have never attended) school and drop-outs
Explanation:
I once had to deal with this in a translation, too.
Selected response from:

Gayle Wallimann
Local time: 22:52
Grading comment
Thanks a lot!
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
5 +10youth who do not attend (or have never attended) school and drop-outs
Gayle Wallimann
5young people who have had no schooling or have been taken out of schoolmargaret caulfield
4 +1children not provided with schooling/education or forced to leave school
gradiva
4 +1young people who are not enrolled in any school and those who have dropped out of schoolCaroline Mackay-Sim
4Specifically, the country's young adults/teenagers/youth)...
Carolingua
4young people without schooling or involved in ( some form of) deschoolingHelen D. Elliot
3not registered for school / dropoutRHELLER
4 -2non-scholarized and descholarized
Nerzh


  

Answers


17 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +10
youth who do not attend (or have never attended) school and drop-outs


Explanation:
I once had to deal with this in a translation, too.


    schools.monterey.k12.ca.us/~mcoemig/html/i_r_msds.html - 18k
Gayle Wallimann
Local time: 22:52
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 1213
Grading comment
Thanks a lot!

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  1964
44 mins

agree  mercado
1 hr

agree  Gabi François
3 hrs

agree  xxxIanW: Yes, but "youths" rather than the singular "youth". Personally, I would use "young people" as it sounds much more natural.
4 hrs

agree  Louise Dupont
5 hrs

agree  danyce
7 hrs

agree  Jane Lamb-Ruiz: this is fine
7 hrs

agree  Monica Alves
8 hrs

agree  xxxntouzet
9 hrs

agree  roneill
10 hrs

disagree  margaret caulfield: One thing is not "attending" to school, another is not having the possibility to do so.
10 hrs

agree  Сергей Лузан: young people (teen-agers/ underaged perhaps)
15 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -2
non-scholarized and descholarized


Explanation:
non-scholarized = who are not going to school;
descholarized = no more going...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-07-05 10:29:40 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

... Americas, integrate their traditional knowledge and values, and develop programmes
of integral formation, with special regard of non-scholarized sectors and ...
environment.harvard.edu/cumbre/eng/syn-en0005.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-07-05 10:36:23 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Sorry: for \"descholarized\", I only found this:

The master in the fathers and in ecclesial tradition - The ... - [ Traduire cette page ]
... The reflections on the \"master\" by Thomas Aquinas and Bonaventure of Bagnoregio
would be \"descholarized\" first but always within the sphere of the scholastic ...
www.stpauls.it/studi/maestro/ inglese/pierini/ingpie02.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-07-05 19:10:35 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

might help:

http://www.awid.org/hiv-aids-ywl/msg00011.html

Nerzh
Local time: 22:52
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 28

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Gayle Wallimann: These words don't exist in English.
1 hr
  -> Would you please look at harvard.edu?

disagree  Jane Lamb-Ruiz: this is for SCHOLAR; NOT scolarisé; NOT THE SAME THING!!
6 hrs
  -> No need shouting! I know it: it's why I said "I only found this" for the second existing word. For the 1st one, please tell me if it is for scholar or "scolarisé"?
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3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
not registered for school / dropout


Explanation:
I think the difference refers to

1) those young people who are not registered for school (parents move around too much, homeless, parents have given up) in the 14-18 year old range.

2) dropout
student had little academic success and gave up on school (redoublements)

dropout" status to a "completer" status for the Oregon Dropout Report; this ... Students under the age of 18 who are not registered in a public school should be ...



    Reference: http://www.ode.state.or.us/cifs/ged/gedqanda.pdf
RHELLER
United States
Local time: 14:52
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 1582
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5 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
young people who are not enrolled in any school and those who have dropped out of school


Explanation:
I would avoid the term "dropouts" as it is derogatory and the French does not mean to be so.

The whole sentence to read:" young people who attend school, those who are not enrolled in any school and those who have dropped out of school.

Caroline Mackay-Sim
Local time: 06:52
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 96

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  roneill
5 hrs
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6 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Specifically, the country's young adults/teenagers/youth)...


Explanation:
...whether they are in school, have never been in school, or have dropped out of school.

you could also say:

"...whether they are in the school system or not (and including drop-outs)".

Note that "school system" implies the government-funded K-12 system of education, and "school" could include both public and private methods of schooling.

"Teenagers" or "teens" is a common way of referring to youth in the United States (and applies to ages 13-19).

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2003-07-05 19:58:30 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I think in this context, the author is putting stress on the fact that regardless of schooling, it is the country\'s young population or teenagers who are at risk. Therefore, you could even rearrange the sentence in the following way:

Specifically, it is the nation\'s teens, regardless of their education status (i.e. whether they are currently in school or have graduated, have never been to school, or have dropped out of school).





Carolingua
United States
Local time: 13:52
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench, Native in SpanishSpanish, Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 193
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11 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
young people who have had no schooling or have been taken out of school


Explanation:
This implies that they did not have the opportunity to go to school, or, for whatever reason, their schooling was interrupted.

margaret caulfield
Local time: 22:52
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in pair: 368
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13 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
young people without schooling or involved in ( some form of) deschooling


Explanation:
...young people (male and female students)* with schooling, and those without schooling or involved in (some form of) deschooling.

**possibly "boys and girls" if elementary school


It would be helpful to know the country and level of learning involved. The link between "deschooling," (sometimes called unschooling), and homeschooling is not clear, so without more context, I would stick with "deschooling."


ttp://www.life.ca/hs/

Your complete and original source of articles, resources, books and more, all designed to help you learn everything you need to know about self-directed learning (also known as deschooling, unschooling, homeschooling or child-directed home-based learning).

Here is an article by CAHS founder, self-directed learning pioneer and site host Wendy Priesnitz, which describes self-directed learning – often called "unschooling".


http://www.acdi-cida.gc.ca/cida_ind.nsf/8949395286e4d3a58525...

L'éducation et le développement humain - [ Translate this page ]
... plaidait avec vigueur pour la « déscolarisation » dans

http://www.acdi-cida.gc.ca/cida_ind.nsf/vall/08EA99383DB05A9...
rote forcefully about the desirability of Deschooling Society.


Student Success and Graduation Rates at the College Level (Fédération des cégeps)
Pass rate by grade average in secondary school and by sex
n In both strong and weak categories, fewer male students pass

With an average grade of 70 to 79,
60% of female students
and 41.7% of male students
pass all of their courses during the first semester

****
I have 11 years of translation experience in the field of education and am quite certain of these terms. Again, in context, they may specifically be referring to homeschooling or another form of self-directed learning. We have no way of knowing which is meant.





Helen D. Elliot
Canada
Local time: 16:52
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 407
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3 days15 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
children not provided with schooling/education or forced to leave school


Explanation:
I don't think "drop out" is appropriate as in the context, it doesn't seem they choose to leave school but are rather forced to it one way or another.

gradiva
United Kingdom
Local time: 21:52
Native speaker of: Native in FrenchFrench
PRO pts in pair: 17

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Yolanda Broad: This version describes the conditions of 3rd world educational concitions.
50 days
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