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11:05 Apr 1, 2011
French to English translations [PRO] Law/Patents - Retail / Franchise agreement for fashion house
French term or phrase:emballages versus conditionnement
Yes, I know this question has come up before...but I have so many types of packaging in one sentence I don't know what to do with it all. The previous question link is here: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/french_to_english/transport_transp...
The conclusion was that conditionnement was individual packaging, perhaps with a protective function, whereas emballage was general outer packaging of, for example, several items in a box.
My sentence is below:
X s'engage à fournir au Franchisé *les emballages (papier d'emballage, sacs, boîtes, etc...), conditionnements, packagings destinés aux Produits et dont l'usage est obligatoire*, les outils nécessaires à la vente et au matériel de publicité sur le lieu de vente (ci-après la "P.L.V.") (cintres, mannequins, posters…) et au matériel promotionnel, étant précisé que les conditions d’utilisation de ces éléments figurent edans le General Guidelines que le Franchisé s’engage à respecter strictement et que les conditions de la participation financière du Franchisé sont régulièrement redéfinis par X qui les tient à disposition du Franchisé.
I have come across "trade dress" in Termium for "emballage" - I basically have 3 types of packaging. One is probably Point of Sale, one is the protective (individual) packaging and the other is....? Trade dress seems an uncertain concept and I wonder whether it might be unwise to incorporate it. I would appreciate the views of others as to how they would translate this.
that it applies to all three types of packaging unless I discover something to the contrary later. Thanks for your help and will keep the question open until I have finished.
Yes, it can be read that way too, "packaging (qui sont) destinés à..."
In fact that makes the whole potentially ambiguous, but unless there is much differentiation elsewhere in the doc it is probably of no importance!
Thanks for your entries. I've realised that I was applying the adverbial phrase "destines aux produits" to "packagings" only and Nikki, you are applying it to "emballages" and "conditionnements" as well. What was bothering me was why it was the 3rd "packagings" only where use was compulsory as this is not point of sale packaging but shipping (outer) packaging IMO. I think that Emma has also interpreted the compulsory part as only applying to "packagings". To be honest, the French is not categorical in this respect either way but if the adverbial phrase does apply to all three instances of packaging, it certainly makes it more straightforward.
I wonder if they really are referring to three different things, or whether they just put a list of synonyms in an effort to be perfectly clear (!) and to cover all eventualities. In any case, I'm pretty sure that the fact that they say it is compulsory to use the packaging means that it refers to "outgoing" packaging eg when an item is sold, it has to be handed to the customer in the "house" box and bag, (as opposed to any old white plastic or brown paper).
packaging is not just packaging here. The franchisor is to supply the items, (as listed), then goes on to state that outer packaging and other types of packaing will be sent and must be used. The point to get the grasp of here, as I see it, is that :
- the various types of packaging are being supplied
- items thereof are listed
- inner packaging (or individual packaging) for "condtionnement"
- outer packaging for "emballages"
The outer and generic are represented in your original by the same term. You have to decide what terms tyou are going to use to mark the distinction adn then stick to them.
What I don't understand is if 'packaging' is indeed just 'outer packaging', it seems very strange that the franchisor is specifying that its use by the franchisee is compulsory, given that it is the franchisor who will be packaging the items and sending them to the franchisee. The franchisee will simply open it and then display it in his shop.
Automatic update in 00:
Answers
8 mins confidence:
wrapping vs packaging
Explanation: The examples given for "emballage" suggest they are referring to how the customer takes the item away (rather than how it arrives in the store). So in this case, I think wrapping would be appropriate.
Emma Paulay France Local time: 21:01 Specializes in field Native speaker of: English PRO pts in category: 53
Explanation: The above terms are ones I have used in the past in order to distinguish two types. They are used, may not be the customary terms, but they are clear.
I suspect that within the context of your text, if you set yourself a clear distinction between theses two types, intermediary and other terms can still find their place.
Suggested rendering :
"X shall undertake to supply the franchisee with items of packaging (paper, bags, boxes, etc…), outer packaging and inner packaging for the products and which must be used…
Explanation: My suggestion is packaging for emballages and formats for conditionnements. See the WordReference discussion (cited in Example Sentences / References) as well as this "Brand Republic" article:
Consumers fail to recognise newer POS formats: study
Media Asia, 01 July 2005, 09:31AM
New research has revealed that traditional in-store advertising formats attract more attention than the newer designs.
[...] In particular, the research found that conventional in-store advertising -- such as displays at the end of the aisle, store leaflets/magazines and product packaging -- get noticed by 63 per cent of respondents across the region.
Ads on check-out counters, however, are the least noticed at only 34 per cent, while ads on trolleys or baskets, at entrances of carparks, and on in-store TV all scored relatively low.
source: http://www.brandrepublic.com/news/482652/Consumers-fail-reco...
Example sentence(s):
Answer: Conditionnement, I often discover, means (e.g.) "packed in boxes of six", or "delivered on a pallet of 24" [...]
Question: [...] conditionnements disponibles : barquette libre service, caisse ou fillet // different packaging: self-service basket, box/ crate/ box, net // il s'agit de moules Answer: I might say: "formats available."
The translation workplace 
