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zugerechnete Stimmrechte

English translation: eligible (allocated/aggregated) voting rights

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20:51 Mar 9, 2008
German to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Accounting
German term or phrase: zugerechnete Stimmrechte
Der General (Bermuda) Limited zu gerechnete Stimmrechte werden dabei über folgende von der General (Bermuda) Limited kontrollierte Unternehmen, deren Stimmrechtsanteil jeweils
3 Prozent oder mehr beträgt, gehalten:
Kathy Gingras
Local time: 07:50
English translation:eligible (allocated/aggregated) voting rights
Explanation:
I think "zu gerechnet" should be one word but let's see ...

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Note added at 19 mins (2008-03-09 21:10:34 GMT)
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"eligible" is not the way to go and please ignore ...
Selected response from:

David Hollywood
Local time: 08:50
Grading comment
Great~
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +2Voting rights granted to.../Entitled to cast...
Kaiya J. Diannen
3 +2eligible (allocated/aggregated) voting rights
David Hollywood
4 -1certified suffrage / right to vote
Andre Conradie


Discussion entries: 1





  

Answers


16 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
zu gerechnete Stimmrechte
eligible (allocated/aggregated) voting rights


Explanation:
I think "zu gerechnet" should be one word but let's see ...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 19 mins (2008-03-09 21:10:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"eligible" is not the way to go and please ignore ...

David Hollywood
Local time: 08:50
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 106
Grading comment
Great~

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  RobinB: Think "attributable" and you've got it right. This is all to do with the *attribution* (Zurechnung) of voting rights under section 22 of the WpHG. It is a standard set of disclosures in all listed German companies' financial reports.
11 hrs

agree  Steffen Walter: With Robin: "voting rights attributed to...".
11 hrs

neutral  Kaiya J. Diannen: Doesn't correspond to the actual definition "to consider as a quality or characteristic of the person, thing, group; to regard as produced by or originating in the time, period, place, etc., indicated; credit; assign". Of these 'synonyms' assigned is best
12 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
zu gerechnete Stimmrechte
Voting rights granted to.../Entitled to cast...


Explanation:
I agree with the first answerer, that this is actually supposed to be one word.

One frequent translation is of course "assigned", but in this case it could also be "granted (to)"
Examples:

http://www.secinfo.com/dScRa.72Z1.htm
"Generally, all matters to be voted on by stockholders must be approved by a majority (or, in the case of election of directors, by a plurality) of the votes entitled to be cast by all shares of Class A Common Stock and Class B Common Stock present in person or represented by proxy, voting together as a single class, subject to any voting rights granted to holders of any preferred stock. "

http://sec.edgar-online.com/2005/12/07/0001104659-05-059420/...
"The voting rights granted by this Section 3(C) shall be in
addition to any other voting rights granted to the holders of the Series A Junior Participating Preferred Stock in this Section 3."
----
If you would like to rephrase, a construction very frequently used in English is "entitled to", you could phrase it for example as:

"The votes that General (Bermuda) Limited are entitled to cast..." similar to the above example, and

http://sec.edgar-online.com/2001/01/12/17/0000898430-01-0001...
"Voting Rights. The holders of the Common Stock are entitled to cast 30 votes per share, and the holders of the Class A Stock are entitled to cast one vote per share, on all matters presented to stockholders, including election of directors."

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Note added at 12 hrs (2008-03-10 09:30:50 GMT)
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(rather frustrating to not be able to edit out typos and deleted words that didn't quite get deleted! of course below should read "is normally used")

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Note added at 19 hrs (2008-03-10 16:02:29 GMT)
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Attribute vs. ...

We seem to have developed quite a little debate here on the finer points of certain English terms.

I just wanted to state for the record that I personally looked up the definition of "attribute" in both Merriam-Webster and at Dictionary.com - it happens to post several dictionary references at once - before posting my "neutral" commentary above.

And now I have just checked the Cambridge Advanced Learner's Dictionary Online.

My *only* issue with the words "attribute" and "attributable" is that they apparently have more of a meaning of implication of origin and cause than of actual possession (Cambridge):

attribute sth to sb (QUALITY) phrasal verb
to think that someone or something has a particular quality or feature:
I wouldn't dream of attributing such a lack of judgment to you.

attribute sth to sb/sth (RESULT) phrasal verb
to say or think that something is the result or work of something or someone else:
The doctors have attributed the cause of the illness to an unknown virus.
To what do you attribute this delay?
Most experts have attributed the drawing to Michelangelo.

attributable adjective [after verb]
caused by:
Do you think that these higher-than-average temperatures are attributable to global warming?

attribution noun [U]
The usual attribution of the work to Leonardo is now disputed by several experts.

ALL of the definitions I have found so far in any dictionary agree with these. I have not found a definition of "attributable" that doesn't deal with the issue of cause or "crediting" something to someone with the implication that the "credit" is potentially arguable.

Merriam:
ATTRIBUTE suggests less tentativeness than ASCRIBE, less definiteness than ASSIGN <attributed to Rembrandt but possibly done by an associate>

---

So the question that I asked myself is, do we think the voting rights are a quality or feature of Company 1? Are they "caused by" Company 1? Are they potentially yet arguably credited to Company 1?

I can understand where the nay-sayers are coming from - I originally looked up the word precisely because I had originally believed as they did, but wanted to see for myself.

I hadn't intended to start a "war of words", I was simply trying to say - in my own humble opinion - that I think some people might have misunderstood the actual meaning of "attribute/attributable", as I myself had before looking it up.

But as with all words, this seems to be open to interpretation.

All I can say is - good for us! We are all using our brains and exercising our talents, and there certainly cannot be a better outcome than that.


Example sentence(s):
  • "...subject to any voting rights granted to holders of any preferred stock."
  • "The holders of the Common Stock are entitled to cast 30 votes per share..."
Kaiya J. Diannen
Australia
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  DC Josephs: "entitled to cast", certainly (although I expect a business journamalist would simply say "held by")
10 hrs
  -> Thanks for that! I agree that "held by" is normally be used, but then in this particular situation you have the issue of "gehalten" later on in the sentence

disagree  RobinB: This is about the upstream + downstream attribution of (direct + indirect) voting rights governed by section 22 of the WpHG, i.e. a very specific instance. I suggest you check there for further details. Also the soon-to-be-published DRS/GAS 15a.
11 hrs
  -> As suggested, I am looking right at sec 22 WpHG (although the asker made no reference to this) and I still don't see how you can bend the *English* definition of attribute/attributable; assigned, granted, allocated, but not attributed/attributable to

agree  Veronika McLaren: check "attribute" as opposed to "allocate" or "grant" in dictionary and you'll find the former closer to the intended meaning
14 hrs

agree  Beatriz Galiano
1 day5 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): -1
zu gerechnete Stimmrechte
certified suffrage / right to vote


Explanation:
I opted for "certified suffrage, right to vote" after having considered some references. I hope this helps!
1. "Normal" suffrage or right to vote : Der Aktionär hat auf der Hauptversammlung einer Aktiengesellschaft ein Stimmrecht, das nach Aktiennennbeträgen ausgeübt wird. Im Normalfall verbrieft jede Stammaktie eine Stimme. ****Das Stimmrecht kann an einen Bevollmächtigten übertragen werden****.
2. Jeder Aktionär kann einen Dritten bevollmächtigen, sein Stimmrecht in der Hauptversammlung auszuüben. ****Vielfach wird die Depotbank zur Ausübung des Stimmrechts ermächtigt****. Rechtsgrundlage ist §134-137 AktG
3. In Scott, Wall Street Wörterbuch, 2000, pp. 433 and 131 one could read up on cumulative suffrage and proxy suffrage.





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Note added at 23 hrs (2008-03-10 19:54:31 GMT)
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I would like to know why RobinB considers my contribution a "random word invention". Each point in my attempt to help was substantiated with a reference.
Secondly, I did not refer to section 22 of the WpHG.
After all, KathyG must decide whether my suggestion of "certified suffrage" or "certified right to vote" was useful or not.
Lastly, if a word does not exist in Google, it should not imply that an erratic invention was tabled - we are dealing with living languages and words and phrases are invented daily - part of our business!


    Reference: http://www.linklaters.com/pdfs/publications/GER_Div/NL_Risik...
    Reference: http://www.anleger-lexikon.de/wissen/vollmachtstimmrecht.php
Andre Conradie
Germany
Local time: 13:50
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
Notes to answerer
Asker: Definitely not "certified suffrage:!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Kaiya J. Diannen: "certified suffrage" doesn't appear to exist (check Google)?!! Suffrage is not generally used to refer to voting stock; I believe the key matter here is what to do with "zu gerechnete", I don't think there is a real question about "Stimmrechte"
9 mins
  -> I tried to do something about zurechnen - see my 3 points!

disagree  RobinB: Random word invention! What has this got to do with section 22 of the WpHG?
10 hrs
  -> Could you be more polite and to the point regarding MY contribution
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Changes made by editors
Mar 11, 2008 - Changes made by Marcus Malabad:
Term askedzu gerechnete Stimmrechte » zugerechnete Stimmrechte


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