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Rueckzugsoffensive

English translation: retreat offensive

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
German term or phrase:Rückzugsoffensive
English translation:retreat offensive
Entered by: Steffen Walter

20:08 Apr 2, 2002
German to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Military / Defense / military
German term or phrase: Rueckzugsoffensive
"As a sergeant, I participated in the Rueckzugsoffensive of March 1918..."
Thank you!
EJBaumann
(1) retreat following the spring offensive of 1918; (2) (ironic/sarcastic): victorious retreat
Explanation:
(1) [German] retreat following the failed spring offensive of 1918; (2) (ironic/sarcastic): victorious retreat

The reference may well be to the German retreat in the west following later in 1918 after the ultimately failed, last great German spring offensive launched in March 1918.

A more or less literal translation such as _retreating offensive_ would be relatively meaningless to most readers. It would probably also be inaccurate, since the offensive came first, with considerable tactical successes, then ran out of steam, before the Germans ultimately retreated – in the face of a subsequent Allied counteroffensive.)

In the only two Google hits found with this term, below, the expression is used sarcastically/ironically. A fairly common and valid translation used in such a context (or in a different war situation) is _victorious retreat_. (In Vietnam, one top US advisor -- I think it was Kissinger -- finally advised the US cabinet “Let's declare victory and go home".

Such an ironic/sarcastic reference may be intended here – though it does not seem to fit well with the German retreat in 1918: The German military collapse at the time was catastrophic, complete and final, and I’m not sure whether the retreat was being propagandized much as a success (as in _erfolgreich vom Feinde abgesetzt_, a term Nazi propagandists favored during the German defeats, especially in Russia, during WW II)

Incidentally, in 1918 things were actually going quite well for the Germans in the east, thanks in part to the Russian October Revolution. In the south, the last offensive at the Piave was turned into a rout, but this was mostly an Austrian battle with the Italians.

Google:

Your search - Rückzugsoffensive "März 1918" - did not match any documents.

Your search - 1918 Rückzugsoffensive OR Rückzugsoffensive - did not match any documents.

Searched the web for Rückzugsoffensive OR Rückzugsoffensive. Results 1 - 2 of 2. Search took 0.22 seconds.

BerlinOnline: Südkoreas Staatspräsident Kim in Bedrängnis / ... - [ Translate this page ]
... fliegen sollten. Und das Massenblatt "Joong Ang Ilbo" verlangt am Wochenende Aufklärung
über die realen Motive Nordkoreas für diese Rückzugsoffensive. ...
www.berlinonline.de/wissen/berliner_zeitung/archiv/2001/ 1015/politik/0033/ - 14k - Cached - Similar pages

Warum die Zukunft Bill Joy nicht braucht - [ Translate this page ]
... preisen. Letzte Woche nun startete Frank Schirrmacher eine bemerkenswerte Rückzugsoffensive.
Der "Faz"-Herausgeber schrieb über Joys Wurzeln: Science-fiction ...
www.welt.de/daten/2000/08/07/0807ku183921.htx - 38k - Cached

Searched the web for German retreat offensive "March 1918". Results 1 - 10 of about 420. Search took 0.30 seconds.

1918 - Operation Michael
... Wood on 28th March 1918, the morning after they ... and forced to retreat. German troops
then rapidly ... days since launching the offensive, German troops were ...
www.awm.gov.au/1918/battles/michael.htm - 7k - Cached - Similar pages

Spring Offensive
... captured during the offensive at Passchendaele. At ... the battle, the exhausted German
soldiers were forced to retreat. ... Daily Express (22nd March, 1918) An ...

It was decided to attack Allied forces at three points along the front-line: Arras, Lys and Aisne. British soldiers became disillusioned when all the land captured during the offensive at Passchendaele. At first the German Army had considerable success and came close to making a decisive breakthrough. However, Allied forces managed to halt the German advance at the Marne in June, 1918. After suffering 168,000 casualties during the battle, the exhausted German soldiers were forced to retreat.
www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWspring.htm - 56k - Cached - Similar pages

The First World War: Chronology
... Co-ordinator in France, 29th March, 1918. ... German retreat at the Marne, 20th July,
1918. Amiens Offensive, 8th August, 1918. Allied breakthrough at ...
www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWchronology.htm - 45k - Cached - Similar pages
[ More results from www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk ]

The 2nd Division, 1914-1918
... Operations on the Ancre. The German Retreat to the Hindenburg Line. The First ... the
Scarpe (fourth phase of the Arras Offensive). ... into 2 MG Bn 4 March 1918). ...
www.1914-1918.net/2div.htm - 25k - Cached - Similar pages

Böhm-Ermolli
... too - had to retreat as well, but German ... The Austrian and German troops advanced
to ... border where the offensive came to an ... the Ukraine in March 1918. When this ...
www.ku.edu/~kansite/ww_one/bio/e/ermolli.htm - 8k - Cached - Similar pages


1918 (good chonological summary of 1918!)
... 28 March 1918, French counter-attack, A ... 30 May 1918, Allied retreat, German troops
reach the River ... June 1918, The Gneisenau Offensive, German troops mount an ...
homepage.tinet.ie/~tipperaryfame/wwar1005.htm - 30k - Cached - Similar pages

The Accrington Pals | Ayette, 27th March 1918
... On 21st March 1918, the German Seventeenth ... day of the offensive; 21,000 British ... troops
of the German Eighteenth Army, June ... still the retreat continued. On 25th ...
www.btinternet.com/~a.jackson/ayette.htm - 10k - Cached - Similar pages

The Great War: Program Highlights from Collapse
... The March Offensive. Jay Winter, Cambridge ... twenty-first of March, 1918. ... Soon the elite
German storm troopers were a ... Germany in Retreat. Trevor Wilson, University ...
www.pbs.org/greatwar/episodes/collapse.html - 17k - Cached - Similar pages



Searched the web for German Somme offensive "March 1918". Results 31 - 40 of about 599. Search took 0.31 seconds.

The Lys Offensive
... the end of the Somme offensive, Ludendorff turned to the ... The second German offensive
of 1918 had ... the beginning of Ludendorff's offensive on 21 March 1918. ...
212.67.202.71/~johnwhal/timeline/lys.htm - 6k - Cached - Similar pages

Strathconas 1914 to 1918
... a conspicuous part in pursuit of the retreating enemy on the Somme front. ... During the
last great German offensive, in March 1918, the regiment fought mounted ...
www.nucleus.com/~ldsh/lsh14-18.htm - 5k - Cached - Similar pages

HTH Tom

Selected response from:

Tom Funke
Local time: 00:48
Grading comment
I'm most grateful for all the answers which proved to be very instructive. I picked the easiest one out of Tom Funke's extensive research material. (I also really liked Kim Metzger's contribution!) I owe everybody an apology: of course, I should have mentioned that the term Rueckzugoffensive was not the point of the story. The point was that he lost a friend during the offensive and that he was still suffering from nightmares because he blamed himself for his friend's death. With many thanks to everybody, Edith
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +4retreating attack
Martina Ley
4 +1Advancing to the rear
Kim Metzger
4 +1strategic withdrawal
Dr. Fred Thomson
5offensive retreat (or withdrawal)
Dr. Fred Thomson
4attacking retreat
Klaus Dorn (X)
4counter-offensive
ingot
4(1) retreat following the spring offensive of 1918; (2) (ironic/sarcastic): victorious retreat
Tom Funke
2 -1rearguard action
jkjones


Discussion entries: 2





  

Answers


9 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
attacking retreat


Explanation:
basically, a retreat that's an attack at the same time...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 20:39:35 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

[An impressive attacking retreat, it creates the nasty threat ...

http://www.chess.gr/tourn/2000/kasparov-kramnik/analysis/rou...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 20:41:46 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Normally after the attacking retreat (or fake in some instances)you will be in perfect range to attack again.

http://www.guardimpact.com/faqs/files/Kilik_Fetz_v1.html

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 20:43:50 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Select Consider Attacking and add Retreat From Ground Troops?

http://www.cryogenius.com/games/myth/howtosin.txt

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 20:45:06 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Star Captain Stone began an attacking retreat, his reinforcements would arrive in less than ten minutes. He ducked and weaved jumping here and there. Leaping from building to building he saved his Gauss ammunition and used his ER medium lasers.

http://www.dropshipcommand.com/jp/authors/stories/AftertheSt...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 20:49:23 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

I think we need to look at the true meaning here - basically, it is a retreat (the Germans were retreating in 1918), but they were attacking all the way back, so the adjective (attacking) needs to come before the noun (retreat), isn\'t it?

Well, I\'m not retreating as of yet...

Klaus Dorn (X)
Local time: 07:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Eva Blanar: Attacking retreat is fine, if the retreat is covered by an attack (as generally is). This was not the case of WWI, where the point was that it was only called an "Offensive", but was a clear retreat. (More movement of the troops than attacks.)
1 hr
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18 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +4
retreating attack


Explanation:
It is precisely the other way round ...

See e.g.

The road not travelled - www.ezboard.com
... moves, Lassiterr shall lose the first arrow and if he can, another. If he sees
an avenue of escape, Lassiterr will take it using a retreating attack. ...
pub38.ezboard.com/fkingdomsoftelgardwildernessmirg.showMessage?topicID=22.topic - 38k - Cached - Similar pages

Poetry
... constant is emotion, beneath the tiring slap, slap, slap of light waters retreating
attack the dust and grime are washed away, only opaque, blue smiles remain ...
neon.airtime.co.uk/users/maestro/poetry.htm - 8k - Cached - Similar pages

The Prince's Memoirs Book III Part 4
... attack on Keith and was ready to call it a draw. Shrugging, he called for a retreating
attack. He was not too surprised to see that Sincline did not follow. ...
www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Temple/6027/memthree4.html - 47k - Cached - Similar pages

Mail me!
... postions and managing to wrench herself free, uses the hidden snowball to make a
retreating attack upon his chest. "Tis a fault indeed if it distracts you...". ...
www.geocities.com/Area51/Corridor/4786/lanaewen.html - 15k - Cached - Similar pages
[ More results from www.geocities.com ]

VOOM Raiden FAQ
... off two bursts of double lasers. This attack is strictly designed as a retreating
attack. When you need to get behind cover to recollect yourself and you need ...
homepages.ihug.com.au/~phong_n/ACA/library/r_guide.htm - 38k - Cached - Similar pages

Sowdon of Babylon (Part 1 of 5); (English Charlemagne romance) ( ...
... slew end then nearly mad pledge in every way done (the Romans) supposing retreating
/ attack main tower (keep) line of defense device their then shut dun (dark ...
icg.harvard.edu/~chaucer/special/litsubs/romances/sowdon-1.htm - 68k - Cached - Similar pages

Google Search

Regards.
Martina



Martina Ley
Local time: 06:48
Native speaker of: Native in CzechCzech

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Klaus Dorn (X): well, if we're counting hits, see above...
18 mins
  -> Um Gottes Willen, Zahlen vergleichen ist mir egal, ich wollte nur untermauern ...
agree  Eva Blanar
46 mins
agree  Dr.G.MD (X)
3 hrs
agree  Steven Sidore
4 hrs
agree  Endre Both
13 hrs
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33 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Advancing to the rear


Explanation:
I wanted to give you this famous quote from the Korean war.

The unflappable General Oliver Smith's magnificent reply to a question about the retreat entered Marine Corps legend: "Gentlemen, we're not retreating," said Smith. "We are just advancing in a different direction." And technically he was right: there was no rear.

Kim Metzger
Mexico
Local time: 22:48
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 249

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Martina Ley: Well, that was no attack ...
2 mins
  -> I think it's possible the term is being used ironically!
agree  Jack Doughty: I think it may well be an ironic novel in the style of "Der brave Soldat Schwejk".
26 mins
neutral  Eva Blanar: The term was quite famous in Austro-Hungary, in the sense "retreating attack" and the context does not look very ironical to me.
45 mins
  -> What context, madam?
agree  Endre Both: Thanks, Kim! Great quote, whether it fits with the context or not.
12 hrs
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46 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): -1
rearguard action


Explanation:
Could it be similar to a Ruckzugsgefecht?


    Oxford Duden
jkjones
Local time: 05:48
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Eva Blanar: I think these are different.
17 mins
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
counter-offensive


Explanation:
..?

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2002-04-02 21:37:43 (GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

One is attacked.One retreats.In retreat,one attacks.

ingot
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
(1) retreat following the spring offensive of 1918; (2) (ironic/sarcastic): victorious retreat


Explanation:
(1) [German] retreat following the failed spring offensive of 1918; (2) (ironic/sarcastic): victorious retreat

The reference may well be to the German retreat in the west following later in 1918 after the ultimately failed, last great German spring offensive launched in March 1918.

A more or less literal translation such as _retreating offensive_ would be relatively meaningless to most readers. It would probably also be inaccurate, since the offensive came first, with considerable tactical successes, then ran out of steam, before the Germans ultimately retreated – in the face of a subsequent Allied counteroffensive.)

In the only two Google hits found with this term, below, the expression is used sarcastically/ironically. A fairly common and valid translation used in such a context (or in a different war situation) is _victorious retreat_. (In Vietnam, one top US advisor -- I think it was Kissinger -- finally advised the US cabinet “Let's declare victory and go home".

Such an ironic/sarcastic reference may be intended here – though it does not seem to fit well with the German retreat in 1918: The German military collapse at the time was catastrophic, complete and final, and I’m not sure whether the retreat was being propagandized much as a success (as in _erfolgreich vom Feinde abgesetzt_, a term Nazi propagandists favored during the German defeats, especially in Russia, during WW II)

Incidentally, in 1918 things were actually going quite well for the Germans in the east, thanks in part to the Russian October Revolution. In the south, the last offensive at the Piave was turned into a rout, but this was mostly an Austrian battle with the Italians.

Google:

Your search - Rückzugsoffensive "März 1918" - did not match any documents.

Your search - 1918 Rückzugsoffensive OR Rückzugsoffensive - did not match any documents.

Searched the web for Rückzugsoffensive OR Rückzugsoffensive. Results 1 - 2 of 2. Search took 0.22 seconds.

BerlinOnline: Südkoreas Staatspräsident Kim in Bedrängnis / ... - [ Translate this page ]
... fliegen sollten. Und das Massenblatt "Joong Ang Ilbo" verlangt am Wochenende Aufklärung
über die realen Motive Nordkoreas für diese Rückzugsoffensive. ...
www.berlinonline.de/wissen/berliner_zeitung/archiv/2001/ 1015/politik/0033/ - 14k - Cached - Similar pages

Warum die Zukunft Bill Joy nicht braucht - [ Translate this page ]
... preisen. Letzte Woche nun startete Frank Schirrmacher eine bemerkenswerte Rückzugsoffensive.
Der "Faz"-Herausgeber schrieb über Joys Wurzeln: Science-fiction ...
www.welt.de/daten/2000/08/07/0807ku183921.htx - 38k - Cached

Searched the web for German retreat offensive "March 1918". Results 1 - 10 of about 420. Search took 0.30 seconds.

1918 - Operation Michael
... Wood on 28th March 1918, the morning after they ... and forced to retreat. German troops
then rapidly ... days since launching the offensive, German troops were ...
www.awm.gov.au/1918/battles/michael.htm - 7k - Cached - Similar pages

Spring Offensive
... captured during the offensive at Passchendaele. At ... the battle, the exhausted German
soldiers were forced to retreat. ... Daily Express (22nd March, 1918) An ...

It was decided to attack Allied forces at three points along the front-line: Arras, Lys and Aisne. British soldiers became disillusioned when all the land captured during the offensive at Passchendaele. At first the German Army had considerable success and came close to making a decisive breakthrough. However, Allied forces managed to halt the German advance at the Marne in June, 1918. After suffering 168,000 casualties during the battle, the exhausted German soldiers were forced to retreat.
www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWspring.htm - 56k - Cached - Similar pages

The First World War: Chronology
... Co-ordinator in France, 29th March, 1918. ... German retreat at the Marne, 20th July,
1918. Amiens Offensive, 8th August, 1918. Allied breakthrough at ...
www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/FWWchronology.htm - 45k - Cached - Similar pages
[ More results from www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk ]

The 2nd Division, 1914-1918
... Operations on the Ancre. The German Retreat to the Hindenburg Line. The First ... the
Scarpe (fourth phase of the Arras Offensive). ... into 2 MG Bn 4 March 1918). ...
www.1914-1918.net/2div.htm - 25k - Cached - Similar pages

Böhm-Ermolli
... too - had to retreat as well, but German ... The Austrian and German troops advanced
to ... border where the offensive came to an ... the Ukraine in March 1918. When this ...
www.ku.edu/~kansite/ww_one/bio/e/ermolli.htm - 8k - Cached - Similar pages


1918 (good chonological summary of 1918!)
... 28 March 1918, French counter-attack, A ... 30 May 1918, Allied retreat, German troops
reach the River ... June 1918, The Gneisenau Offensive, German troops mount an ...
homepage.tinet.ie/~tipperaryfame/wwar1005.htm - 30k - Cached - Similar pages

The Accrington Pals | Ayette, 27th March 1918
... On 21st March 1918, the German Seventeenth ... day of the offensive; 21,000 British ... troops
of the German Eighteenth Army, June ... still the retreat continued. On 25th ...
www.btinternet.com/~a.jackson/ayette.htm - 10k - Cached - Similar pages

The Great War: Program Highlights from Collapse
... The March Offensive. Jay Winter, Cambridge ... twenty-first of March, 1918. ... Soon the elite
German storm troopers were a ... Germany in Retreat. Trevor Wilson, University ...
www.pbs.org/greatwar/episodes/collapse.html - 17k - Cached - Similar pages



Searched the web for German Somme offensive "March 1918". Results 31 - 40 of about 599. Search took 0.31 seconds.

The Lys Offensive
... the end of the Somme offensive, Ludendorff turned to the ... The second German offensive
of 1918 had ... the beginning of Ludendorff's offensive on 21 March 1918. ...
212.67.202.71/~johnwhal/timeline/lys.htm - 6k - Cached - Similar pages

Strathconas 1914 to 1918
... a conspicuous part in pursuit of the retreating enemy on the Somme front. ... During the
last great German offensive, in March 1918, the regiment fought mounted ...
www.nucleus.com/~ldsh/lsh14-18.htm - 5k - Cached - Similar pages

HTH Tom




    see above
Tom Funke
Local time: 00:48
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8
Grading comment
I'm most grateful for all the answers which proved to be very instructive. I picked the easiest one out of Tom Funke's extensive research material. (I also really liked Kim Metzger's contribution!) I owe everybody an apology: of course, I should have mentioned that the term Rueckzugoffensive was not the point of the story. The point was that he lost a friend during the offensive and that he was still suffering from nightmares because he blamed himself for his friend's death. With many thanks to everybody, Edith
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
strategic withdrawal


Explanation:
This is what we called it in WW II when we had to retreat but wnated it to llok like something else. Usually, it was because we din't want the folks at home to realize that things weren't going so well.

Dr. Fred Thomson
United States
Local time: 22:48
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 61

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  gangels (X): That's best. "Frontbegradigung" was another euphemism. I thought of "forward retreat", but yours is best
1 hr
  -> Thanks, Klaus.
neutral  Endre Both: The German term "strategischer Rückzug" exists and is (in my view) slightly different from "Rückzugsoffensive", althought they are both just euphemisms for the same old thing.
10 hrs
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19 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
offensive retreat (or withdrawal)


Explanation:
This is of course called an oxymoron, because the one term contradicts the other. The German term is an equivalent oxymoron that leaves the reader wondering what the dickens the writer is talking about.
My suggested translation should produce the same perplexity.

Dr. Fred Thomson
United States
Local time: 22:48
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 61
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