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Geistesgeschichtlich

English translation: in the history of thought

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10:29 Sep 20, 2010

German to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - Religion

German term or phrase: Geistesgeschichtlich

I am unsure of Geistesgeschichtlich here. Would I incur translation loss by simply saying historically?

Kernaussagen einer protestantischen Ethik der Rechtsordnung bestehen darin, die kulturelle Befriedung zu fördern, zum fairen Ausgleich unterschiedlicher Interessen beizutragen und es zu unterstützen, dass auf der Ebene des staatlichen Rechts konstruktive Kompromisse erzielt werden. Geistesgeschichtlich ist dieses Anliegen protestantischer Ethik auf die Zweireichelehre zurückzuführen, die sich am weltlichen Recht, an der weltlichen Vernunft, der Einzelfallgerechtigkeit und der Billigkeit orientierte.

FionnaL

English translation:in the history of thought

Explanation:
... or ideas, but I would prefer thought

Selected response from:

Jutta Scherer
Germany
Local time: 18:40

Grading comment

Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

3 +4

in the history of thought

Jutta Scherer

3 +1

intellectual roots

Nesrin

In terms of Geistesgeschichte

Jim Tucker

4 -3

From the perspective of clerical history..

Kristian Madar

Summary of reference entries provided

geistesgeschichtlich

Bernhard Sulzer

Answers

2 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

in the history of thought

Explanation:
... or ideas, but I would prefer thought

Jutta Scherer
Germany
Local time: 18:40
Native speaker of:

German
PRO pts in category: 4

Grading comment

Selected automatically based on peer agreement.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Benedetta Bronz

23 mins

-> Thanks, Benedetta

agree

mill: or simply historically as the asker suggested // for readability and stylistic reasons

28 mins

-> Thanks. Probably a possibility - but why say "dog" when you mean "poodle"? :-)

agree

Michael Wetzel: 100% correct, however, I would tend to "history of ideas" in the general sense used here and use "history of thought" when there is a specific object involved (for example: history of economic thought) ... not sure either ("I would tend...")

33 mins

-> Thanks, Michael. So you think "thought" should be used when referring to a specific area? Not sure about that...

agree

Clive Phillips: I agree, Jutta. Nesrin's rendering comes a close second in my book. The Zwei-Reiche-Lehre is part of theological history (as expressed by Martin Luther and others): http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zwei-Reiche-Lehre.

1 hr

-> Thank you, Clive, also for your insights. I had suggested the term simply because I recently came across it in a book translation

7 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): -3

From the perspective of clerical history..

Explanation:
an idea

Kristian Madar
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:40
Native speaker of:

Slovak

35 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

intellectual roots

Explanation:
I think you can translate this as "This finds its intellectual roots in...", i.e. you focus on the "Geistes-" bit, while the surrounding text "this finds its... roots in..." will take care of the "geschichtlich" bit.
I think if you just say "historically" you would incur a translation loss as there may be other historical roots for the current attitude (historical events e.g.)

Examples:

Part II analyzes how LatCrit theory finds its intellectual roots in Chicana/o Studies scholarship. In this analysis, we establish the ...
papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=244677

This book tells the full story of the Fourth Amendment's complex history leading up to its ratification, including its intellectual roots in ...
www.oxfordscholarship.com › Home › Subject index › Law

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Note added at 38 mins (2010-09-20 11:07:34 GMT)
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Sorry, just a few more examples found on the web, which I find relevant:

Discourse analysis which finds its intellectual roots in the work of Michel Foucault and Jacques Derrida can be broadly understood “as a post-positivist ...
research.allacademic.com/meta/p100860_index.html?PHPSESSID...

The prevailing dogma, which finds its intellectual roots in the gradualist ideas put forth by geologist Charles Lyell, was that the Earth was modified over ...
books.google.co.uk/books?isbn=008044198X...

Nesrin
Local time: 17:40
Works in field
Native speaker of: Arabic
PRO pts in category: 4

19 mins confidence:

In terms of Geistesgeschichte

Explanation:
Educated English texts simply use the German term, as here:

http://books.google.de/books?id=oD0dBqGDNscC&pg=PA1535&lpg=P...

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Note added at 20 mins (2010-09-20 10:50:11 GMT)
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cf. also http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geistesgeschichte

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Note added at 1 hr (2010-09-20 11:30:35 GMT)
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@ Michael: "Billigkeit" is a key notion within "Geistesgeschichte" - hence I would take the term in its true sense.

Jim Tucker
United States
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

neutral

Nesrin: This is sure to confuse a lot of (educated) English readers though...

11 mins

-> Any reader conversant in history will know the word.

disagree

Michael Wetzel: Same as Nesrin ... Interesting, but nuance of specialist terminology seems irrelevant here. The DE is plain (vs. G.gesch. as EN) ... DE term here used for "intellectual history" anyway ("Zweireichelehre"), not G.g.-concept in Wikipedia article

22 mins

-> It's really quite a broad field in itself, and there is no English word for it. See here specifically "It is a largely untranslatable term sometimes used synonymously with Problemgeschichte.": http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geistesgeschichte

agree

Johanna Timm, PhD: http://shortify.com/11081

6 hrs

neutral

Cilian O'Tuama: maybe appropriate in certain circles - not sure I know any monolingual English-speaker who'd understand.

12 hrs

Reference comments

14 hrs peer agreement (net): +2

Reference: geistesgeschichtlich

Reference information:
in terms of Geistesgeschichte

I think that the text the asker presents does indeed refer to the concept of Geistesgeschichte, relating to ideas or ideology and history (historical application).
And yes, there is no established term in English other than the German "Gesistesgeschichte".
Of course, the layman reading this would want to know what geistesgeschichtlich/in terms of Geistesgeschichte means here.
So a short explanation should be added. But therein lies the difficulty. How do you describe this concept in a couple of words?

probably more than a couple:

http://www.jstor.org/pss/775427
history of ideas/ intellectual history / history of the human mind

these definitions are too short and can be easily misunderstood

I believe the definition given at answers.com is good. Maybe explain Geist as realm of thought/ideas/metaphysical realm
(see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geistesgeschichte)

http://www.answers.com/topic/geistesgeschichte

It attempts to exemplify the abstract Geist of a given epoch on the basis of a broad cultural conspectus involving religious, philosophical, social, as well as artistic, musical, and literary studies.

Although the text I cite below is not always 100% perfect English and has its reference mistakes, such as MM Griesebach is called a he, there are some good descriptions of what Geistesgeschichte is.

MM Griesebach sets up Geistesgeschichte as an independent sphere and applies the method in the context of Geistesgeschichte as a combination of ideas and history. ...Geistesgeschichte is nothing but a

joining procedure between the ideology as the purpose of ideas themselves and the practicality as the basis and ingredient of history.

What we usually call historical change or transition procedure can be given an appropriate meaning only after filtering through ideas or synthesis. In this viewpoint, we may say that Geistesgeschichte is originally located at the point where ideas and history, which can be easily combined, are so naturally harmonized.

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Note added at 16 hrs (2010-09-21 02:50:24 GMT)
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forgot the link; here it is:
http://s-space.snu.ac.kr/bitstream/10371/62904/1/seoul_j_02_...

Bernhard Sulzer
United States
Works in field
Native speaker of:

German
PRO pts in category: 12

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Geistesgeschichtlich

English translation: in the history of thought

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Geistesgeschichtlich

English translation: in the history of thought

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KudoZ™ translation helpThe KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases.

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