uccelli neri - rail species (coot, moorhen, water rail, etc) - waterfowl ( translation glossary) bird species cited in a graphic novel,Other,Art/Literary

« nell’opera di tutel...

Return to KudoZ list

fattispecie »

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

Italian term or phrase:	uccelli neri
English translation:	rail species (coot, moorhen, water rail, etc) - waterfowl
Entered by:	Rachel Fell

Options:
- Contribute to this entry

14:43 Apr 21, 2006

Italian to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Other / bird species cited in a graphic novel

Italian term or phrase: uccelli neri

This is a character speaking in a graphic novel, saying: "Mio padre caccia lepri, fagiani, beccaccini, beccacce, uccelli neri."

Research so far suggests this is a descriptive term, i.e. literally birds which are black, but this seems odd when all the others are distinct species. Is it an equivalent to "merlo" (blackbird) or does it suggest a particular type/group of birds?

Lzz KudoZ activity Questions: 15 (all closed) (1 without valid answers) Answers: 0 United Kingdom
Local time: 15:25

Clarification request(s) and response

Elisabeth Rossato: 14:56 Apr 21, 2006: Forse l'autore fa una precisa scelta stilistica e introduce questo elemento "uccelli neri" per dare una connotazione nefasta, oppure una precisa scelta di colore. Tanto più che si tratta di una graphic novel. -

rails - maybe - see below

Explanation:
found this, where it says uccelli nere are water fowl/rails, including coots, moorhens and water rails.

Don't know why they'd be called "nere", although coots and moorhens are black - water rails aren't though

Da ottobre fino a febbraio marzo si camminava con gli stivali a coscia nei "segati", su terreno infido, badando di appoggiare i piedi su cesti di giunco e guadando con circospezione stretti fossi che dividevano ampi spazi di terreno paludoso, dove beccaccini ed uccelli neri trovavano abbondanza di cibo negli acquitrini.
Mi è capitato, diverse volte, di "abboccare " un po' d'acqua con gli stivali e qualche volta è capitato pure di sprofondare fino alla vita nella melma e nella torba, anche in pieno inverno....

La ricetta (per quattro persone)

Prendendo come base la famosa ricetta delle "Folaghe alla Puccini" io utilizzo indifferentemente i vari uccelli neri (folaga, gallinella, porciglione, ecc.) per preparare un sugo di base da risotto o, con l'aggiunta di pomodoro, per condire delle pappardelle.
Gli uccelli d'avanzo potranno essere serviti su crostoni di pane tostato bagnati con il sugo ottenuto senza aggiunta di pomodoro. In pratica si prepara primo e secondo in una sola volta.

http://www.ilcacciatore.com/ricordi_e_ricette/folaghe.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2006-04-21 17:08:01 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

about rails
http://blx1.bto.org/birdfacts/grptexts/rails.htm

Selected response from:

Rachel Fell
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:25

Note from asker to answerer

Thanks! Your example seemed pretty conclusive, and also 'waterfowl' flowed nicely within the context as an example of game birds.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

4 +3

black birds

KayW

4 +3

blackbirds

Katherine Zei

rails - maybe - see below

Rachel Fell

Answers

52 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +3

black birds

Explanation:
Crows, ravens etc. are all members of the crow family. Blackbirds are not, they are members of the Icterinae family. Since the original is ambiguous, I would translate it literally as "black birds" (2 words).

KayW
Italy
Local time: 16:25
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 16

2 hrs confidence:

rails - maybe - see below

Rachel Fell
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:25
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 32

Note from asker to answerer

Thanks! Your example seemed pretty conclusive, and also 'waterfowl' flowed nicely within the context as an example of game birds.

8 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +3

blackbirds

Explanation:
They refer to a specific type of bird (ravens, grackles, etc.) . Hold on, i'll get some reference for you.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 15 mins (2006-04-21 14:58:30 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

from a scientific paper:
http://www.wind.appstate.edu/reports/OVERVIEW.DOC

"Birds in the winter season in the mountains tend to be clumped rather than randomly distributed as they are during the breeding season. Mixed flocks of chickadees, titmice, nuthatches, and woodpeckers forage together, as do mixed flocks of sparrows. Most starlings, **blackbirds**, and thrushes (Eastern Bluebird, American Robin) also travel and forage as flocks rather than individuals. Birds are often found in higher concentrations on southern slopes as well. Shields and Grubb (1974) found that bird preference for southern aspects ..."

http://www.nal.usda.gov/awic/pubs/Birds/dis.htm

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 3 hrs (2006-04-21 18:20:57 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Not to split hairs here, but I've seen blackbirds (all one word) for both the Icterinae and non-.

Anyways, it's up to you I think. If it's a graphic novel and not scientific, to be honest I don't think it actually matters that much whether you put the space or not.

Ever heard of the rhyme, "Sing a song of sixpence, a pocket full of rye/ Four and twenty blackbirds, baked in a pie"? Probably have if you live in the U.K.

http://www.famousquotes.me.uk/nursery_rhymes/sing_a_song_of_...

.... that brings up something that I'd like to start a forum about...
If your translation of a term is technically wrong but suits the context better (because of a cultural marker or similar), should you stick to the technical or go with the cultural? I do banking and financial, so 99% of the time I stick to the technical.

Katherine Zei
Ireland
Local time: 15:25
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 8

Return to KudoZ list

Italian: uccelli neri

English translation: rail species (coot, moorhen, water rail, etc) - waterfowl