16:16 Oct 30, 2011 

Thanks for explaining your decision :)

15:59 Oct 30, 2011 

Thank you everyone for the excellent discussion and suggestions. After consultation "patency" was the term preferred by the client in this case, as it denotes the "degree of openness" of the foramina. In my view, the intended meaning is also addressed by "narrowing"... I see them as converging on the same concept from different directions. In this case the client rules. Muito obrigada a todos e espero ser util sempre que precisem...

12:56 Oct 26, 2011 

Excuse me for butting in, I hope fvasconscellos contributes, but this problem has appeared on other language forums. In medical terminology "permeability" and "patency" mean two different things, as "permeabilidade/permeabilidad/permeabilité" (Port/Sp/Fr) can be translated as one or the other, depending on context.
Inflammation - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inflammation
Increased permeability of the blood vessels results in an exudation (leakage) of plasma proteins and fluid ..... a b Stedman's Medical Dictionary (Twenty-fifth ed. ...

patency - definition of patency by the Free Online Dictionary ...
www.thefreedictionary.com/patency
pa•ten•cy (p t n-s ). n. 1. The state or quality of being obvious. 2. Biology The state or quality of being open, expanded, or unblocked. ...
So, it is not about editing here, but about what the translator understands from the context and how "permeabilidade" fits in here.

Kindly note I am not an expert in Portuguese in any shape or form, but merely comment because my general experience elsewhere.

12:45 Oct 26, 2011 

The discussion here seems to revolve around the question of whether the translator should translate the author's text or make technical corrections to it. I appreciate the argument that probably the author meant to talk about narrowing, as it makes more sense in the context. But he didn't mention narrowing, he used a word which, as far as I can discover, only permits one translation - "permeability".

So, should we translate or should we be technical editors of source text? I'm not an expert on the theory of translation, but so far I understand that, when the author's text is clear and unambiguous (even if technically wrong!), we should translate what he said. Comments would be welcome! There is always more to learn...

12:08 Oct 26, 2011 

Por outro lado, uma pesquisa rápida do “narrowing” neste contexto deixará muito claro (pela imensa quantidade de trabalhos encontrados) que este é o termo mais usado pela comunidade científica para se descrever o fenômeno de estenose do foramina inter-vertebral. A esmagadora maioria dos autores descreve a descrita “redução da permeabilidade” como “narrowing,” o que corrabora, e muito, a sua adequação ao seu contexto e sua aceitação.
Pois bem, em relação ao seu outro trecho, em que não há estenose, não há estreitamento e, portanto, as dimensões internas estão preservadas. Eu, neste caso traduziria o termo como “intervertebral foramina dimensions/sizes were normal.” Mais uma vez um grande número de citações podem ser encontradas, o que corrobora a sua aplicabilidade ao seu contexto.
Espero que ajude,
Adriana

12:02 Oct 26, 2011 

Bom, em primeiro lugar a questão da escolha do termo não é puramente linguística, mas também conceitual...Foramina intervertebral é uma estrutura óssea que, portanto, não permite que outras substâncias fluam livremente através de seus poros, tais como fluidos, líquidos, gases...
O contexto do trecho citado é de "redução da dimensão” do forame intervertebral , que causou estenose direita e que pode vir a comprometer os nervos da região afetada...Houve uma alteração morfológica e visível, detectável por exames do foramina inter-vertebral. Assim, embora seja mesmo tentador se traduzir o termo literalmente como “permeability,” ele carece de sentido neste contexto. Um exemplo disso é que não são citados trabalhos em inglês em que este termo foi aplicado neste contexto, o que leva mesmo a crer que ele não é adequado. Quando ocorrem citações que envolvem o termo “permeability” foramina inter-vertebral, ele está ligado a anestesias ou outros meios líquidos/gasosos. O que, certamente não é o caso aqui...

09:47 Oct 26, 2011 

Essentials Of Orthopaedics And Applied Physiotherapy - Google Books Result
books.google.com/books?isbn=8181472152...Jayant Joshi, Jayant Joshi - 1999
The disc separates the vertebral end plates, maintaining the patency of the spinal canal and the intervertebral foramina. Therefore, any impairment in the ...

09:15 Oct 26, 2011 

Just post the question and we'll find a nice-sounding translation for some word that the author should have used! ;-)

02:09 Oct 26, 2011 

I should clarify.. my previous comment refers to another part of the spine.. where there's no stenosis, ie narrowing.

02:03 Oct 26, 2011 

Ok, concordo que permeability doesn't sound as idiomatic as "narrowing" -- mas entao o que fazer com "Esta contudo mantida a permeabilidade dos foramina inter-vertebrais. Let me guess... there's no narrowing of the intervertebral foramina? :))

21:35 Oct 25, 2011 

Not only does it sound bl**dy awful - nobody (except 1 source I found) uses it.

21:29 Oct 25, 2011 

I agree! ;)

21:28 Oct 25, 2011 

I think 'reduction in permeability of the...' sounds bl**dy awful, whereas 'narrowing of the...' sounds pretty sweet.

21:22 Oct 25, 2011 

I agree...I think the word "permeabilidade" should not have been used in the source text in the first place...

21:15 Oct 25, 2011 

To me, the problem here is that the author is not very precise but mixes radiological and physical findings.

21:06 Oct 25, 2011 

Yes, the mechanism which causes the reduction is an interesting question, but the term to be translated is the "concomitant reduction of the permeabilidade...". It may be reduced by narrowing or by some other factor. But at the end of the day, permeability is permeability, in any situation! :-)

21:03 Oct 25, 2011 

Your reference is about anesthesia -where the term "permeability" fits perfectly. It is not related to hernia....("Epidurography in the continuous peridural anesthesia technic in geriatric surgery]

20:59 Oct 25, 2011 

Looking at the sentence from the original PT text, the answer could be one of the following:

"a REDUCTION in the permeability of the intervertebral foramina"

OR

"narrowing of the intervertebral foramina"

with the same result, depending on which way you want to look at it.

20:52 Oct 25, 2011 

...but if you can reduce permeability, i.e. if you can reduce the rate of flow of a liquid, you could do so BY the process of "narrowing the intervertebral foramina".

I see a definite link between Adriana's answer of "narrowing" here and the original phrase of "permeabilidade". And I think she's right.

20:48 Oct 25, 2011 

OK. But if it cannot be applied here, why does the medical article I found and cited refer to "the permeability of the intervertebral foramina"?

20:45 Oct 25, 2011 

This is probably because you are literally relating “Redução da permeabilidade” to “permeability.” Permeability cannot be applied here, as this context does not concern a “movement of fluids and molecules between the vascular and extravascular compartments.” The text describes an intervertebral disc hernia phenomena, in which vertebral foramina (a canal for the protection of the medulla spinalis) had its dimension reduced, its right side stenosed and nerve roots compressed (“admitindo-se compromisso do respectivo radicelo”). This is a typical description of a “narrowing of the intervertebral foramina” process.