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Тонкие штучки

English translation: (alternatives)

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12:24 Jan 20, 2004
Russian to English translations [PRO]
Marketing / Brand name
Russian term or phrase: Тонкие штучки
Так называется российская фирма, которая занимается ювелирными изделиями.

Подождите, не пишите сразу ответ. Сначала прочитайте, что именно мне нужно.
Это очень трудная задачка, я уже второй день над ней думаю.

Нужно перевести это на английский, но ФРАНЦУЗСКИМИ СЛОВАМИ.
Есть немало слов, которые пришли в англ. язык из французского. Так вот, перевести надо французскими словами, но чтобы они были понятны любому английскому Native speaker.
xxxVera Fluhr
Local time: 22:41
English translation:(alternatives)
Explanation:
I think the 'French ring' does not necessarily need French *words*. Using 'la/le/les' or 'de/du/d'/des', or word endings like '-esse' means unequivocally 'French' all over the world.

OTOH it may be a French word/phrase that does not necessarily exist in English, but is perfectly intelligible nonetheless - like, for instance, 'd'or'.

Here are some 'LEGO blocks':

gadget, pièces (it's the accent grave that makes the word 'French'), chic (sounds like 'chick' in English, which may be good if the target audience is teen/young women), style, finesse, vignette, bijou, carat, svelte...

... and some LEGO constructions :)

Gadget d'Or
(Les) Pièces (du) Chic (IMO only 'Pièces Chic')
Bijouland (if it's rather a mass sales business)
La Piècerie (resembling 'pâtisserie' ;)
Chic d'Or
Les Gadgets Sveltes
Le Style Gadget

Style Finesse
La Finesse
Vignette d'Or
La Vignette
Chic d'Or
Maison de Svelte (a bit more traditional)
Maison Carat
Sveltesse d'Or
Les Gadgets Sveltes

Of these, I'd prefer the first group. The point is, "Тонкие штучки" has the kinda informal, a bit provocative, teen audience ring to me... don't know why, I happen to think of Tatu :)

Methinks, those who should take the ultimate decision are the marketing folks at that company. In the development of a trade name, especially for a foreign market, the specific marketing strategy of the company is of utmost importance. It is a matter of evaluating fairly subtle connotations on the basis of knowing both the target market specifics and the company objectives, so the decision should be taken from a marketing, *not* from a lingustic point of view. The linguist can only be a consultant in the process.

Vera, I'd suggest that you write down a dozen of ideas for them (maybe even in 'LEGO form' ;) then explain the connotations and leave it at that. In fact, it's them who will take the decision anyway, so don't try to come up with a single, ultimate solution. They will certainly find it much more helpful if you provide various - yet focused enough - alternatives.

MHO, of course...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs 24 mins (2004-01-20 20:49:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

BTW don\'t hurry to ditch \'d\'Or\' - even if they\'re not exactly into gold jewellery. It might still work well as a common symbol of jewellery, prestige, high class etc.
Selected response from:

invguy
Bulgaria
Local time: 23:41
Grading comment
Клиент так и не ответил.
Так что я не знаю, что он выбрал.
Лично мне наиболее полезным был ответ invguy, его и выбираю.
Большое спасибо, invguy, и большое спасибо всем за прекрасные ответы.
Я прощаюсь со всеми Вами и видимо, навсегда.
Я только что получила извещение, что меня исключили из членов ProZ. Причины мне неизвестны.
Прощайте, и еще раз спасибо за помощь и сотрудничество
Vera Fluhr
vera.fluhr@wanadoo.fr
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +7Objet d'ElegancexxxJulia Vaynzo
5 +1Tonkie shtuchki
Alexander Onishko
4 +1(alternatives)
invguy
4Finesse
Yakov Tomara
4delicate, and more suggestions below
olganet
4beau bibelot
Natalie Sanadze
3une biznes delicate
Sergey Gorelik
3chic accoutrements
oldnick
3Objets fines
David Knowles
2возможно, ляпну глупость
Maria Dobrianskaya
1doodah delicate
Levan Namoradze


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


3 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Tonkie shtuchki


Explanation:
вообще-то названия фирм не переводяться ...

или вам нужно Tonkie shtuchki (перевод для справки) ?

Alexander Onishko
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian, Native in UkrainianUkrainian
PRO pts in pair: 2355

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  manana: да, а перевод модно было бы лать в скобках, как пояснение...
2 hrs
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8 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
une biznes delicate


Explanation:
Прошу прощения, во французском не силен (-:

Sergey Gorelik
Local time: 22:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 361
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22 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 1/5Answerer confidence 1/5
doodah delicate


Explanation:
брррр... :-)

Levan Namoradze
Georgia
Local time: 00:41
Native speaker of: Native in GeorgianGeorgian
PRO pts in pair: 561
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22 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
Тонкие штучки
chic accoutrements


Explanation:
Very French, very English, but must be a ltl bit preplexing for a Russian speaker

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 24 mins (2004-01-20 12:49:33 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

2) de luxe - but we are straying away
3) exquisite accoutrements

oldnick
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 22

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Yakov Tomara: also the link to jewelry is too vague...
19 hrs
  -> Link to jewellry very ТОНОК, НЕ СКРОЮ :)
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17 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5
Тонкие штучки
возможно, ляпну глупость


Explanation:
слаба во франйузском, но все же.... не судите строго
pieces elegantes, pieces raffinees или pieces d'elegance, (аксанты не могу расставить)


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 20 mins (2004-01-20 12:45:25 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

или может так?
pieces sophistiques

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 25 mins (2004-01-20 12:49:58 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

что касается \"штучек\", пока не могу придумать ничего кроме \"pieces\", хотя, конечно, смысл они не совсем точно передают, но вспомнить другие подходящие заимствовавния на данный момент не получается:((, я ж говорю, что во французском полный ноль

Maria Dobrianskaya
Ukraine
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 42
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46 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
beau bibelot


Explanation:
как вариант

Natalie Sanadze
Local time: 00:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian, Native in GeorgianGeorgian
PRO pts in pair: 52

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Leah Aharoni: I am not sure that an average American will know what this is
7 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +7
Objet d'Elegance


Explanation:
sounds good to my ear


    Reference: http://www.dvercity.com/catalog_objet_d_elegance.html
xxxJulia Vaynzo
Local time: 21:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Maria Dobrianskaya: sounds perfect!
2 hrs

agree  Leah Aharoni: excellent
6 hrs

agree  David Lavie: It's the one.
7 hrs

agree  xxxOleg Pashuk: shonuff
13 hrs

agree  Natalia Olshanskaya Robinson
17 hrs

agree  oldnick: GOOD
19 hrs

agree  Rusinterp
1 day13 hrs
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
Тонкие штучки
Objets fines


Explanation:
Pretty literal, definitely French and easy to understand!

I quite like "objets d'elegances" but it's a bit long for the English taste.

David Knowles
Local time: 21:41
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in pair: 4905

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  xxxJulia Vaynzo: I wrote "Objet d'Elegance", not objets delegances...
10 mins

neutral  Yakov Tomara: Sorry for perhaps a silly "non-native" remark, but couldn't an English speaker be easily confused by "fines" bearing in mind the meaning "penalties"?
18 hrs
  -> Not a connotation I'd have thought of! I think it's OK, because of "Fine Arts" and "Objets d'Art"

agree  Alexandra Rusakevich: It is the most accurate translation IMHO
1 day4 hrs
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7 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
delicate, and more suggestions below


Explanation:
I like the word "Delicate" and "ornament"

Delicate
: pleasing to the senses: a : generally pleasant <the climate's delicate, the air most sweet -- Shakespeare> b : pleasing to the sense of taste or smell especially in a mild or subtle way <a delicate aroma> <a robust wine will dominate delicate dishes> c : marked by daintiness or charm of color, lines, or proportions <a delicate floral print> <an ample tear trilled down her delicate cheek -- Shakespeare> d : marked by fineness of structure, workmanship, or texture <a delicate tracery> <a delicate lace>
Main Entry: 1or·na·ment
Pronunciation: 'or-n&-m&nt
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Old French ornement, from Latin ornamentum, from ornare
Ornament
Date: 13th century
1 archaic : a useful accessory
2 a : something that lends grace or beauty b : a manner or quality that adorns
3 : one whose virtues or graces add luster to a place or society
4 : the act of adorning or being adorned
5 : an embellishing note not belonging to the essential harmony or melody -- called also embellishment, fioritura


my suggestions:
Delicate excellence
delicate elegance,
savoir-faire finenesse
ornament elegance
ornament delicate
ornament excellence
bijou elegance
vis-a-vis elegance
rendez-vous elegance

and any combination of these words


One entry found for bijou.
Main Entry: bi·jou
Pronunciation: 'bE-"zhü
bijou
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural bijous or bi·joux /-"zhü(z)/
Etymology: French, from Breton bizou ring, from biz finger
Date: 1668
1 : a small dainty usually ornamental piece of delicate workmanship : JEWEL
2 : something delicate, elegant, or highly prized
- bijou adjective



olganet
Local time: 16:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 428
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

8 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Тонкие штучки
(alternatives)


Explanation:
I think the 'French ring' does not necessarily need French *words*. Using 'la/le/les' or 'de/du/d'/des', or word endings like '-esse' means unequivocally 'French' all over the world.

OTOH it may be a French word/phrase that does not necessarily exist in English, but is perfectly intelligible nonetheless - like, for instance, 'd'or'.

Here are some 'LEGO blocks':

gadget, pièces (it's the accent grave that makes the word 'French'), chic (sounds like 'chick' in English, which may be good if the target audience is teen/young women), style, finesse, vignette, bijou, carat, svelte...

... and some LEGO constructions :)

Gadget d'Or
(Les) Pièces (du) Chic (IMO only 'Pièces Chic')
Bijouland (if it's rather a mass sales business)
La Piècerie (resembling 'pâtisserie' ;)
Chic d'Or
Les Gadgets Sveltes
Le Style Gadget

Style Finesse
La Finesse
Vignette d'Or
La Vignette
Chic d'Or
Maison de Svelte (a bit more traditional)
Maison Carat
Sveltesse d'Or
Les Gadgets Sveltes

Of these, I'd prefer the first group. The point is, "Тонкие штучки" has the kinda informal, a bit provocative, teen audience ring to me... don't know why, I happen to think of Tatu :)

Methinks, those who should take the ultimate decision are the marketing folks at that company. In the development of a trade name, especially for a foreign market, the specific marketing strategy of the company is of utmost importance. It is a matter of evaluating fairly subtle connotations on the basis of knowing both the target market specifics and the company objectives, so the decision should be taken from a marketing, *not* from a lingustic point of view. The linguist can only be a consultant in the process.

Vera, I'd suggest that you write down a dozen of ideas for them (maybe even in 'LEGO form' ;) then explain the connotations and leave it at that. In fact, it's them who will take the decision anyway, so don't try to come up with a single, ultimate solution. They will certainly find it much more helpful if you provide various - yet focused enough - alternatives.

MHO, of course...

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 8 hrs 24 mins (2004-01-20 20:49:43 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

BTW don\'t hurry to ditch \'d\'Or\' - even if they\'re not exactly into gold jewellery. It might still work well as a common symbol of jewellery, prestige, high class etc.

invguy
Bulgaria
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: Native in BulgarianBulgarian
PRO pts in pair: 40
Grading comment
Клиент так и не ответил.
Так что я не знаю, что он выбрал.
Лично мне наиболее полезным был ответ invguy, его и выбираю.
Большое спасибо, invguy, и большое спасибо всем за прекрасные ответы.
Я прощаюсь со всеми Вами и видимо, навсегда.
Я только что получила извещение, что меня исключили из членов ProZ. Причины мне неизвестны.
Прощайте, и еще раз спасибо за помощь и сотрудничество
Vera Fluhr
vera.fluhr@wanadoo.fr

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  oldnick: good reasoning
12 hrs
  -> Thanks :)
Login to enter a peer comment (or grade)

20 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
Тонкие штучки
Finesse


Explanation:
Sorry for answering in English, have no time to cope with encoding problems. Vera, if anything's unclear in my answer, pls drop me a line by email.

I think I perfectly undestand what you need and in my opinion the main problem is trying to find a two-word version. English and French grammars are too different for such experiments. The solution could be a one-word translation.

Please see the French and English dictionary entries for "finesse":


finesse n. f.

1. Qualitй de ce qui est fin, dйlicat par la forme ou la matiиre. Finesse d'un tissu. Finesse d'une couleur. 2. Qualitй de ce qui est exйcutй avec dйlicatesse. Finesse d'un ouvrage. 3. Aptitude а discerner les moindres nuances dans la pensйe, les sensations, les sentiments. La finesse de l'ouпe. Finesse d'esprit. 4. (Plur.) Subtilitйs. Les finesses d'un art, d'un mйtier.

(Link 1)


Main Entry: fi·nesse
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English, from Middle French, from fin
Date: 1528
1 : refinement or delicacy of workmanship, structure, or texture
2 : skillful handling of a situation : adroit maneuvering
3 : the withholding of one's highest card or trump in the hope that a lower card will take the trick because the only opposing higher card is in the hand of an opponent who has already played

(Link 2)


***********

Yes, not exactly the same but there's a considerable "overlap" in definitions and a good correspondence with the Russian expression.
Though the latter is in plural, I wouldn't recommend to use the plural form of "finesse."

Now let's wait for some native English speakers' feedback :-)




    Reference: http://www.francophonie.hachette-livre.fr/
    Reference: http://www.m-w.com/cgi-bin/dictionary
Yakov Tomara
Ukraine
Local time: 23:41
Native speaker of: Native in RussianRussian
PRO pts in pair: 356
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