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HAYA ROBADO

English translation: see explanation


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12:05 Nov 25, 2009
Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Linguistics / Andean Spanish - Modality
Spanish term or phrase: HAYA ROBADO
What is the modal difference between:

EL ZORRO NOS HAYA ROBADO
in comparison with
EL ZORRO NOS ROBÓ

I think that the first expresses some level of doubt.
Matt Coler
Local time: 03:23
English translation:see explanation
Explanation:
El zorro nos haya robado - is incomplete

El zorro nos robó = The fox robbed us

Do you have a context for these phrases, Matt? The first uses the subjunctive and, as you say, would usually express some level of doubt, but is incomplete as it stands. You might find it in a sentence like "Puede que el zorro nos haya robado" = The fox may have robbed us (but we don´t know for sure). Or "... al no ser que el zorro nos haya robado" = unless the fox robbed us (it´s a possibility).

Unless you mean "El zorro nos ha robado" = The fox has robbed us.
Selected response from:

la acequiera
Spain
Local time: 03:23
Grading comment
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4 +3see explanation
la acequiera
3 +3may have robbed us
Gilla Evans
3 +1Zorro robbed robbed us! / It must have been Zorro! / Zorro has struck again!Robert Forstag


Discussion entries: 5





  

Answers


2 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +3
may have robbed us


Explanation:
we really need the context of your sentence to see why the subjunctive is being used

Gilla Evans
Local time: 02:23
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
Notes to answerer
Asker: No context, this is a linguisic elicitation from an indigenous language... sorry!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Karen Vincent-Jones: Or 'might have robbed us'
12 mins
  -> yes, again the use of may or might depends on the rest of the sentence
agree  Carol Gullidge: agree that the context is needed, as the answer would vary according to the main clause/verb upon which thie depends
39 mins
  -> indeed
agree  Silvia Killian Özler: I expresses probability, it does not really imply doubt in this case.
17 hrs
  -> thanks Silvia
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16 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +3
see explanation


Explanation:
El zorro nos haya robado - is incomplete

El zorro nos robó = The fox robbed us

Do you have a context for these phrases, Matt? The first uses the subjunctive and, as you say, would usually express some level of doubt, but is incomplete as it stands. You might find it in a sentence like "Puede que el zorro nos haya robado" = The fox may have robbed us (but we don´t know for sure). Or "... al no ser que el zorro nos haya robado" = unless the fox robbed us (it´s a possibility).

Unless you mean "El zorro nos ha robado" = The fox has robbed us.

la acequiera
Spain
Local time: 03:23
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 4
Notes to answerer
Asker: I believe that this distintion exists, but is this evident in my examples here, without the word PROBABLE? Thanks!


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Carol Gullidge: agree that it's incomplete as it stands. You can only give a provosional answer without any context. All this can be found in the grammar books
28 mins
  -> Exactly, thanks Carol :)
agree  Julie Waddington: Sounds more likely to be "The Fox has robbed us" and "The fox robbed us"...
1 hr
  -> Yes, but without knowing where these phrases come from... Thanks, Julie :)
agree  Thayenga: More context would clarify the sentence.
3 hrs
  -> Thanks Thayenga :)
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39 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +1
Zorro robbed robbed us! / It must have been Zorro! / Zorro has struck again!


Explanation:
Yes, some level of doubt, and hence the subjunctive. It has been discovered that money, jewels, etc. are missing. The aggrieved party in his anger cries out....

But in English, the aggrieved party in such an instance would *never* say: "It may have been Zorro" or "Zorro may have robbed us." The nuance here is something peculiar to Spanish, but would not appear in English.

I could also imagine the "future of supposition" being used in Spanish here....

Suerte.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 hrs (2009-11-25 14:12:49 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

ERRATUM:

I must have gotten so exercised by the issue that I repeated the word "robbed" in the first of my suggestions above....

Robert Forstag
United States
Local time: 21:23
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 36

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Fiona Hale
1 hr
  -> Thank you, Fiona.
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Voters for reclassification
as
PRO / non-PRO		Non-PRO (1): Carol Gullidge


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Changes made by editors
Nov 25, 2009 - Changes made by Carol Gullidge:
FieldArt/Literary => Other
Field (specific)General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters => Linguistics


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