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ilmi siyaset

English translation: religiously informed diplomacy

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18:07 Jun 26, 2007
Turkish to English translations [PRO]
Religion
Turkish term or phrase: ilmi siyaset
I've heard this used mainly in a religious context, and as far as I can understand it's something to do with adapting your subject matter/ instruction style to the person you're trying to educate. Or something. When used in an everyday context, would the phrase "informed diplomacy" be too vague and off-target? I'm curious as to whether there's an equivalent term and/or concept in English.
Sophie Wedin
Local time: 05:46
English translation:religiously informed diplomacy
Explanation:
"Religion, The Missing Dimension of Statecraft holds lessons not only for government officials but also for religious leaders willing to take initiatives for peace. It should encourage the growth of diplomatically engaged religion as well as religiously informed diplomacy."--Peter Steinfels, The New York Times


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Note added at 2 days22 hrs (2007-06-29 16:26:32 GMT) Post-grading
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I'm glad that it helps you..
Selected response from:

Karahan Sisman
Turkey
Local time: 05:46
Grading comment
This is probably the most explanatory term for the context in which I've been encountering it most frequently. I think "diplomacy" should be used to emphasize that tact is paramount to this concept, as opposed to "politics", which often has rather devious connotations.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

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Summary of answers provided
4 +5art of politics
Özden Arıkan
5 +1political scienceBuray
5Religious Politic
Ali Osman TEZCAN
5Scientific Politics
Taner Göde
4scholarly politics
Mehmet Hascan
3 -1religiously informed diplomacy
Karahan Sisman


  

Answers


56 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5 peer agreement (net): +1
political science


Explanation:
this is the origin of the concept "political science"

Buray
Turkey
Local time: 05:46
Native speaker of: Native in TurkishTurkish

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  abdullah erol: ifadenin aslı . türkçesi siyaset bilimi. tam ve doğru çevirisi
17 days
  -> Teşekkür ederim.
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
Religious Politic


Explanation:
Religious Politic

Ali Osman TEZCAN
Turkey
Local time: 05:46
Native speaker of: Turkish
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1 hr   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5

4 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +5
art of politics


Explanation:
just "diplomacy" might do, as well, but I'd personally prefer the "art of politics" due to the shared connotations of "siyaset" and "politics". it is not "political science" even though it literally translates as such, but it is the art and practice of getting your way in an indirect, calculated, and diplomatic way achieving a perfect balance between power and vested interests (similar to the craft of a con artist maybe ;-). if you read through the story under the title "İlmi Diyanet mi, İlmi Siyaset mi?" in the link below, you'll have a far better understanding of the concept.

one last note: the reason you hear this mainly in religious contexts is probably that a relatively "old" form of language is preferred in those contexts, or that religious texts more often use concepts and terms that are forgotten or dropped by more secularly-oriented writers

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Note added at 4 hrs (2007-06-26 22:58:04 GMT)
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now I realize that "İlmi diyanet mi, ilmi siyaset mi?" is also the main title of the article. the story I was referring to begins after the asterisks, ****, you'll need to scroll down a bit. its first sentence is: " Eski günlerin birinde, çok meşhur bir hoca varmış."


    Reference: http://www.bulentsenver.com/bsakfel/yazilarim/comment.asp?ID...
Özden Arıkan
Germany
Local time: 04:46
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in TurkishTurkish
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Tim Drayton: I don't think there is an exact equivalent in English and the translation will depend on the precise context.
9 hrs
  -> agreed. thank you.

agree  Selcuk Akyuz: What about the definition of politics in Merriam Webster's, politics: the art or science of ... :)
11 hrs
  -> ... of government." distinct enough :-) although politics doesn't have to do with governing only, it includes opposition, too. thanks, btw :-)

agree  ozan karakış
14 hrs

agree  Serkan Doğan: considering the needs and comments of asker, it is real better than politics or science of politics etc
1 day7 hrs

agree  Mansour Pahlevani
1 day21 hrs
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10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
Scientific Politics


Explanation:
Scientific Politics

The idea of a "scientific politics", whereby society was organised and governed in accordance with the "laws of social evolution and development" represents a classically-modernist idea. In essence, it represents the belief that human reason can be applied to understand the fundamental laws of social development and, by so doing, point the way towards an orderly, rational, form of social organisation. This was, of course, in contrast to the disorderly, apparently irrational, forms of society that precede the modern era...

Comte argued that in order to develop a "scientific politics" it was necessary to develop a methodology that allowed people to understand the basic principles (or laws) that governed social development. Just as the laws underpinning behaviour in the natural world were progressively revealed by the application of a (natural) scientific methodology, so too could the laws of social development be revealed by the application of a (social) scientific methodology. This is where a positivist Sociology was required.

The initial basis for a positivist Sociology (at least according to Comte) was the assumption that the social world had similar forms of regular, objective, features to those found in the natural world.

Since the latter was clearly governed by the operation of natural laws, so too, it was assumed, was the social world governed by the operation of social laws.

Just as the task of natural scientists was to discover the laws governing the natural world, the task of social scientists (and sociologists in particular) was that of discovering and elaborating the
laws governing the social world, since once this was achieved it would be possible for society (and in particular, political governance) to be rationally organised.

Given the assumption of a form of correspondence between the natural and social worlds, it's not surprising that Comte argued that the way to discover the laws governing the social world was to adopt the methodology (and methods) of the natural sciences.

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    Reference: http://www.sociology.org.uk/p1mc5n2c.htm
    Reference: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=off&sa=X...
Taner Göde
Local time: 05:46
Native speaker of: Native in TurkishTurkish
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47 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
religiously informed diplomacy


Explanation:
"Religion, The Missing Dimension of Statecraft holds lessons not only for government officials but also for religious leaders willing to take initiatives for peace. It should encourage the growth of diplomatically engaged religion as well as religiously informed diplomacy."--Peter Steinfels, The New York Times


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 2 days22 hrs (2007-06-29 16:26:32 GMT) Post-grading
--------------------------------------------------

I'm glad that it helps you..


    Reference: http://www.amazon.com/Religion-Missing-Dimension-Statecraft-...
Karahan Sisman
Turkey
Local time: 05:46
Native speaker of: Turkish
PRO pts in category: 4
Grading comment
This is probably the most explanatory term for the context in which I've been encountering it most frequently. I think "diplomacy" should be used to emphasize that tact is paramount to this concept, as opposed to "politics", which often has rather devious connotations.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Buray: iyi bari ilm-i tıbba "religiously informed medicine", ilm-i hendese'ye "religiously informed mathematics" diyelim.
17 days
  -> teşekkür ederim yorumunuz için. siz demeyiniz efendim, üzmeyiniz kendinizi yaptığım öneriden dolayı :))
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