Szukam programu MT dla tlumaczen PL>RU Thread poster: Oleg Prots
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| | Jerzy Czopik 
Germany
Local time: 15:57
Member (2003)
Polish to German
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| Oleg Prots
Ukraine
Local time: 16:57
English to Ukrainian
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TOPIC STARTER | Dziekuje, Jerzy, ale... | Mar 24, 2004 |
Mam SDLX i bardzo mi sie podoba. Ale kolega nie szuka CATa, tylko programu MT...
Czy moze sa jakies dodatki do SDLXa o ktorych nie wiem?
| | | | Jerzy Czopik
Germany
Local time: 15:57
Member (2003)
Polish to German
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| Not that I know | Mar 24, 2004 |
And to be honest, MT for a Slavic language?
Even good CAT has it´s problems with "Kowalski/Kowalska" or "red wire" vs "red brick" or similar...
How could MT handle this?
Sorry, I cannot be of any help on this, as I do not know any machine translation tools.
Regards
Jerzy
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Andrzej Lejman
Poland
Local time: 15:57
Member (2004)
German to Polish
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Nawet, jeśli byłby taki program, wyniki będą katastrofalne; w innych zestawieniach językowych często były powodem wesołości na tym forum. Spotyka się nieraz witryny internetowe tak tłumaczone, jest też na przykład tłumaczenie EN>DE w guglu. Można tym przetłumaczyć od biedy pojednyncze, proste zdania, nic więcej.
Na przykład www.ectaco.pl tłumaczy tak:
Ala ma kota ==> Has cat Al... See more Nawet, jeśli byłby taki program, wyniki będą katastrofalne; w innych zestawieniach językowych często były powodem wesołości na tym forum. Spotyka się nieraz witryny internetowe tak tłumaczone, jest też na przykład tłumaczenie EN>DE w guglu. Można tym przetłumaczyć od biedy pojednyncze, proste zdania, nic więcej.
Na przykład www.ectaco.pl tłumaczy tak:
Ala ma kota ==> Has cat Ala.
A cokolwiek bardziej złożonego?
To właśnie dlatego ciągle mamy nadzieję, że nie zabraknie nam pracy...
Andrzej ▲ Collapse
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I'm afraid there is no such software as IMO Polish, Russian and other Slavonic languages are too difficult for machine translation.
And I hope there will never be any. Otherwise, how would you earn your money if a machine could replace you ?
[Edited at 2004-03-24 13:11]
| | | | Jeff Allen
France
Local time: 15:57
Multiplelanguages
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| machine translation and noun compounds | Dec 11, 2004 |
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
And to be honest, MT for a Slavic language?
Yes, it has been done with good results in the past. See:
ALLEN, Jeffrey and Christopher HOGAN. 1998. Expanding lexical coverage of parallel corpora for the Example-Based Machine Translation approach. In Proceedings of the First International Language Resources and Evaluation Conference (LREC98), 28-30 May 1998, Granada, Spain. Vol. 2, pp. 747-754.
http://www-2.cs.cmu.edu/afs/cs.cmu.edu/user/chogan/Web/lre98.zip
Jerzy Czopik wrote:
Even good CAT has it´s problems with "Kowalski/Kowalska" or "red wire" vs "red brick" or similar...
How could MT handle this?
The example of "red wire" vs "red brick" in a Translation Memory (TM)-type system is usually handled by 1) examples, and 2) contextual distance statistics. This can be a limitation of such systems.
Rule-based (RB) and Knowledge-based (KB) MT systems automatically handle such combinations based on part of speech combinations.
Variant forms of words can be handled by the alternative form feature in current MT desktop software programs:
http://www.multilingual.com/allen50.htm
MT systems have more difficulty with identifying part of speech in a short phrase or sentence for items that have multiple parts of speech, such as:
"Handle with care" (is it "(you should) handle with care" or "(a) handle with care".
To a human, the answer is obvious.
Also, MT systems have difficulty with multi-word noun compounds that are not already in the dictionary. Examples of noun compounds:
"town hall"
"noun compound"
"machine translation"
"blade lever"
"paper cutter"
"electronic speed switch"
etc....
Yet, when non-native speaking end-users of manuals are required to read 5+ word noun compounds (very common in mechanical and electronic fields), it results in a similar problem. This was one of the main reasons for implementing MT systems (and reworking technical writing style guidelines for translation) in corporate environments during the past 15 years.
These types of issues are described in:
Jeffrey Allen: 2004. Case Study: Implementing MT for the Translation of Pre-sales Marketing and Post-sales Software Deployment Documentation at Mycom International. pp 1-6. In Robert E. Frederking, Kathryn Taylor (Eds.): Machine Translation: From Real Users to Research, 6th Conference of the Association for Machine Translation in the Americas, AMTA 2004, Washington, DC, USA, September 28-October 2, 2004, Proceedings. Lecture Notes in Computer Science 3265 Springer 2004, ISBN 3-540-23300-8
http://www.informatik.uni-trier.de/~ley/db/conf/amta/amta2004.html#Allen04
Revised version of submitted article at:
http://www.geocities.com/mtpostediting/Jeff-Allen-AMTA2004-paper_v1.01.pdf
and also in my new article providing a step-by-step procedure on terminology identification and dictionary coding for MT tools. In the "Guide to Translation" supplement of MultiLingual Computing & Technology, January/February 2005.
https://216.18.156.115/multilingual/downloads/screenSupp69.pdf
(Screen optimized)
2-3 Mb
https://216.18.156.115/multilingual/downloads/printSupp69.pdf
(Print optimized)
25-30 Mb
Hope that helps.
Jeff
http://www.geocities.com/jeffallenpubs/localization.htm
http://www.geocities.com/mtpostediting/
[Edited at 2004-12-29 13:20]
[Edited at 2004-12-30 11:21]
| | | | Jeff Allen
France
Local time: 15:57
Multiplelanguages
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| Machine translation not to replace translators | Dec 11, 2004 |
Andrzej Mierzejewski wrote: I'm afraid there is no such software as IMO Polish, Russian and other Slavonic languages are too difficult for machine translation. And I hope there will never be any. Otherwise, how would you earn your money if a machine could replace you ?
The focus of Machine Translation desktop software and implementations over the past 15 years has been as a computer-aided translation tool and decision-making software program, not just as a simple human translator replacement strategy. I've written a lot on this topic. See my MT postediting page (http://www.geocities.com/mtpostediting/) and my localization page (http://www.geocities.com/jeffallenpubs/localization.htm), notably the thread topics about "misconceptions about MT".
Jeff
http://www.geocities.com/jeffallenpubs/
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| Machine translation not to replace translators, I hope. | Dec 13, 2004 |
Jeff,
thanks for your input. I promise to read.
On the other hand: there is a very basic Polish sentence "Ala ma kota". This means: The girl named Ala has a cat. As long as Babylon translates this into English as "Has cat Ala", I can work (and sleep) with no fear .
Best regards
Andrzej Mierzejewski
| | | | Jeff Allen
France
Local time: 15:57
Multiplelanguages
+ ...
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