| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8] > | Commentary on rates by job poster(s) in their posts Thread poster: Henry Hinds
|
|---|
Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
|
Suggestion # 1: An Ethical Committee or Peer Comments
| May 21, 2006 |
Dear all,
It is clear now that Proz.com needs to make any and all possible changes to serve the interests of freelance translators, since many pay a membership and have a voice as to what to expect of this community.
I've been posting two-line, sharply critical messages about this site for a few months now. Changing the tone, this time I'm going to elaborate as clearly as possible on all my ideas for improvement without any sarcasm (apologies!), since I do appreciate this community ... See more Dear all,
It is clear now that Proz.com needs to make any and all possible changes to serve the interests of freelance translators, since many pay a membership and have a voice as to what to expect of this community.
I've been posting two-line, sharply critical messages about this site for a few months now. Changing the tone, this time I'm going to elaborate as clearly as possible on all my ideas for improvement without any sarcasm (apologies!), since I do appreciate this community and believe it can be improved.
The purpose of these suggestions is to give translators a stronger negotiating point. Some are only further thoughts to what many colleagues have already said in this thread while others are audacious and drastic measures that could be taken. I'm not sure myself whether some of them are feasible, but I'll have a clearer conscience once I've encouraged a debate about them among all members and users in general and the site's staff and moderators in particular. In some cases, these ideas greatly contradict each other, so I don't expect them all to be implemented, but rather offer a choice of what can be done.
Now, let's go on to suggestion number one:
Many people have said the tone of the job posting concerned is offensive (I agree) and Henry has already said something will be done about it, so I trust there will be improvements on this issue.
The problem is, this case is an extreme example of blatantly racist thinking (European quality), which is one of the things that disturbed so many people and if any change has been made on it it's because at least fifteen people have complained. Now, what about all those other postings that imply discrimination and unprofessionalism in a more subtle way?
Furthermore, a second reason for not accepting a posting (that hasn't been discussed yet in this thread) is not merely that the texts seems to be written by an exploitative agency, but that it evidences they've no clue as to what this profession is about. A clear example is that posting in which a translation was required into a no-language like Brazilian Spanish, believe me, it's actually happened, and apparently, the poster did know what language is spoken in Brazil, but he or she repeated the mistake many times in a few lines. This also brings a poor image to the site, although it's not a direct case of exploitation, but as Rubén Berrozpe suggested (sorry if I misquote, I'm saying it off the top of my head), the site belongs in a way to all those who pay and they have a right to demand their expected standards.
Having said this, I think a few guidelines should be put in written, with bullet points and everything, and enforced to decide what is and isn't a minimally acceptable posting, similar to the article in the knowledge database about when to squash a kudoz question.
A delicate issue though it may be I think it would even be more controversial decide who is allowed to do that.
Who would belong to the Ethical Committee? Moderators and/or site stall only? People who have already gained experience in this site, as happens with those over 500 points who can squash questions?
Or could a job be squashed if a certain number of people have formally "disagreed" with it?
Could a poster be banned if several of his jobs have been squashed? These last audacious possibilities could create an extremely inimical atmosphere, which I don't think the site staff would like. But, I didn't say it's going to be easy. I'm sure this can be improved with the suggestions of other people. Please, do think about it. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Suggestion # 2: Agree with Viktoria Gimbe (Further Comments) | May 21, 2006 |
Forbid to mention anything about rates in job postings, I wholeheartedly agree. If Proz.com is supposed to be neutral, ie, not favour either bidders or job posters, it is not the case the way things are now.
Alas, there is a big however: after posting a job with no mention about rates, nothing prevents the poster from sending a private message to the 120 bidders asking them to bid again saying they don't have time to read all CVs and therefore they'll ask to bid again only to those who are... See more Forbid to mention anything about rates in job postings, I wholeheartedly agree. If Proz.com is supposed to be neutral, ie, not favour either bidders or job posters, it is not the case the way things are now.
Alas, there is a big however: after posting a job with no mention about rates, nothing prevents the poster from sending a private message to the 120 bidders asking them to bid again saying they don't have time to read all CVs and therefore they'll ask to bid again only to those who are willing to charge 300 euros for that 20,000-word highly technical job. What I've just described happened to me exactly as I'm writing it. (The poor soul begged not to answer if we disagreed with the rate, lest her feelings should be hurt).
Too many translators are as unassertive as to accept those conditions, and unfortunately, I'm sure some did. But at the end of the day, I do think this would be a productive measure because when the poster replies, a negotiation has already been started, the bidder is free to accept meekly, but I think a few wouldn't tolerate that the agency offers very different terms to those of the translator. There is a thick line between this situation and simply accepting what the job poster said in the first place, in the latter case any attempt at negotiating is out of the question. It's high likely that the agency gets away with it, but the more people who demand good standards, the better for everyone else. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Suggestion # 3: Mentoring | May 21, 2006 |
This is probably the easiest thing to implement. I don't even think the site's staff has to be involved, but it could rather be a spontaneous initiative from many seasoned translators who would use this site as a venue (that word again) to find their mentees. I've actually seen a thread with that purpose with more than a hundred replies in another site. Why hasn't it happened here?
There are many kinds of mentoring. It can be one-to-one, a mentor can be in charge of a group of half a dozen... See more This is probably the easiest thing to implement. I don't even think the site's staff has to be involved, but it could rather be a spontaneous initiative from many seasoned translators who would use this site as a venue (that word again) to find their mentees. I've actually seen a thread with that purpose with more than a hundred replies in another site. Why hasn't it happened here?
There are many kinds of mentoring. It can be one-to-one, a mentor can be in charge of a group of half a dozen, or there could be to teams, one of mentors, one of mentees (this is the one I did, thanks to the ITI) who don't even have the same language combinations. (These schemes should be about other kind of practicalities).
The key idea Claudia Iglesias mentioned is marketing abilities, and I would add negotiating skills, they are not easy! It's shouldn't be really about grammar, specialized knowledge on electronics or style differences between two languages, those things are taught at Uni. Namely, the programme offered by the ITI contained modules on how to write a good CV and show good manners on the phone, among others.
Of course, there is a lot of mentoring going on in this site, actually any time a question is answered, but it's always better to have something structured.
I would appreciate that something was organized, although I wouldn't participate because I think I'm too much of an expert to be a mentee and too much of a beginner to be a mentor. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Suggestion # 4: Bells and whistles | May 21, 2006 |
It may be a good idea to add a page recommending a link to articles in the knowledge database when bidding for a job: you click on the bidding button, you find a recommendation to read some articles, you can click on ignore and go on with the process, but it's always there.
The aim would be to give more visibility to translators' opinions. After endless debates on rates when I think everyone in this profession has heard about them, there's always one who asks "should I charge less f... See more It may be a good idea to add a page recommending a link to articles in the knowledge database when bidding for a job: you click on the bidding button, you find a recommendation to read some articles, you can click on ignore and go on with the process, but it's always there.
The aim would be to give more visibility to translators' opinions. After endless debates on rates when I think everyone in this profession has heard about them, there's always one who asks "should I charge less for being a beginner?" or similar questions. It's frustrating.
There is a danger that this could be considering legally as fixing rates, so I think it should be stated that those are only colleagues opinions, and Proz.com doesn't take any responsibility (as happens in the Blueboard).
There is already a good article by Aurora Humarán on rates in Argentina, and I think many more could be written advising against the usual fallacies some posters use for exploiting translators. Again, everything is in the forums, but as I said, it's better to have something organized.
Another possible problem is that it may be consider illegal to simply advise on rates (not to fix them), I'm sure there are many people out there who know about this more than I. For a start, I would encourage advocating for a more assertive attitude in other respects without mentioning any figure. ▲ Collapse
| | |
|
|
|
Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Suggestion # 5: Transparency | May 21, 2006 |
Henry wrote:
About half of the quotes are not serious. Of the half that are serious, the majority quote higher than what the poster offers.
I don't know exactly how you mean not serious, would that include people who don't intend to get the job but rather write to vent their anger? Or do you mean people who are very far from qualifying for the job and still think they can do it?
Anyway, I am 104% sure there are an awful lot of both. In the first case because there are many people who complain in the forums, and it's easy for me to imagine they complain as well to the people concerned directly. In the second case because I've posted myself in the past and have also seen ads in other sites (where they are visible to everybody). More often than not you find absolutely ridiculous one-sentence biddings like "I can translate into any language in the world", "my English is perfect because I spent a summer in Ireland" and the like. It's amazing!
The problem of this is that some job posters tend to take advantage of their prospective vendors by convincing them that there are another two hundred translators out there who would do the job for a fraction of the price. This is a lie, or even worse, a half-truth. There are another two hundred translators, and this can be easily watched on the bottom of each job posting, but the job poster wouldn't dream of giving the job to 195 of them! With this fallacy, they actually get good quality at a poor rate.
Now, I expect an awful lot of objections in this respect but my proposal is that biddings are made visible to everybody, so that all good professional would feel again, in a strong position and assertive. "You're telling me there are a lot of translators, look at them!"
Of course, bidders' names would have to be hidden and comment on what they write not allowed, continuing with the spirit of this site not naming and shaming.
Again, there's also the problem that people could choose to be contacted privately and I don't have a solution to that. Any ideas?
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Suggestion # 6: Hidden rates II (for job posters) | May 21, 2006 |
Some time ago, someone said in this site that what's in place is not really a bidding system. I don't know myself anything about what that's meant to be, but apparently "bidding" implies that the price offered is in a closed envelope and the figure is only disclosed when somebody has been chosen. Please forgive me if I'm very wrong. Again, I'm only borrowing from somebody else's words and don't even remember who said it.
It is very true that job posters want to choose the translator... See more Some time ago, someone said in this site that what's in place is not really a bidding system. I don't know myself anything about what that's meant to be, but apparently "bidding" implies that the price offered is in a closed envelope and the figure is only disclosed when somebody has been chosen. Please forgive me if I'm very wrong. Again, I'm only borrowing from somebody else's words and don't even remember who said it.
It is very true that job posters want to choose the translator with the best profile, and do everything they can to get that person to put their fees down. I'm sure many look at the profile first, others may not, but this could be a partial solutions.
If posters are only given the choice of profiles and can ask for the rates once they've decided who the best candidate is, the chosen translator would be sure the prospective client wants him or her to do that job. The translator could feel very free to ask for the rate they wanted. Of course the negotiation could fail but I'm also thinking the site could restrict the number of people the job poster can contact for a certain job. If it's only three or five, the translator could think (even though they don't know if they've been contacted first, second or third) it's likely that the two or four others –also with good profiles- are going to ask for normal rates. The key word is again assertiveness.
Again, this would be a drastic change, but it's food for thought. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| Final note: The role of Proz.com | May 21, 2006 |
I am sure that if Proz implemented all this measures tomorrow, there would be a million enemies to the site. Many job posters are also paying members and would immediately migrate to another site if they were imposed so many restrictions through unilateral decisions, the site would probably be called CowboyZ.com or something similar. On the other hand let me remind you all that proz is the plural for pro, an abbreviation of professional. Probably some of those who were paying members and decided... See more I am sure that if Proz implemented all this measures tomorrow, there would be a million enemies to the site. Many job posters are also paying members and would immediately migrate to another site if they were imposed so many restrictions through unilateral decisions, the site would probably be called CowboyZ.com or something similar. On the other hand let me remind you all that proz is the plural for pro, an abbreviation of professional. Probably some of those who were paying members and decided not to extend their membership would come back. Also, in some (maybe many) years' time, the site would have a much better reputation.
Since there is a natural conflict of interests between professional and aficionados, I wouldn't be surprised if in the near future there were several translators' sites with different biases.
Currently, no site favours good standards in the bidding department, they all fail to address the challenges of the internet era. If a site that guarantees excellent standards for real freelance translators was launched tomorrow, I would definitely pay for its membership. But actually, despite of all my angry words to Proz, I sincerely appreciate all the help I've received and admire many of its members and people who feel deeply involved with it. I would definitely preferred this site to be the one that turned the tide.
Best regards to all,
J. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Javier Herrera (X)
Spanish
| And on a very informal note | May 21, 2006 |
Henry wrote:
I would love to be in a position to wave a wand (or install a drop-down menu) and magically, have all instances of translators charging below their my-rate, disappear. Unfortunately it is not that easy!
It's a tradition, we always mention doctors when talking of a prestigious profession, probably the best respected in the world.
No matter how professional docs are, there will always be charlatans. Doctors will never have the power to make them disappear with a magical wand or feel threatened by them, but they've managed to give their profession a good status through strong associations and individual achievements made real through hard work.
| | |
|
|
|
Ana Cuesta 
Spain
Local time: 11:32
Member
English to Spanish
| Existing mechanisms regarding rates and job posters bypassing them | May 21, 2006 |
I am among those who would prefer seeing any mention to rates whatsoever banned from the jobs section if that is the only possible way to stop it becoming a reverse auction place but even now, while we get there or short of getting there, I think other measures could be taken to at least enforce/reinforce the mechanisms already in place.
We are seeing more and more often how job posters leave void the optional pricing section but then state a rate in the body of their message, as i... See more I am among those who would prefer seeing any mention to rates whatsoever banned from the jobs section if that is the only possible way to stop it becoming a reverse auction place but even now, while we get there or short of getting there, I think other measures could be taken to at least enforce/reinforce the mechanisms already in place.
We are seeing more and more often how job posters leave void the optional pricing section but then state a rate in the body of their message, as it has been the case with the post that triggered this thread. Had they stated $ 0.015/word in the pricing section, none of us feeling insulted would have received the offer in the first place, and I wonder how many translators in total (including the ones who answered to it) would have received it? I mean, how many translators in ProZ have stated $0.015 as their minimum rate (so preventing themselves from receiving any offer above $0.04)???
So what I would propose is that job posters are advised that if they want to state a rate they must do it by way of the optional pricing section only. Otherwise, the minimum rate and the 2.5 ratio mechanisms are close to useless. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Thanks for taking this discussion in consideration ;) | May 22, 2006 |
Henry and Ralf,
I hear both of you and understand how you explain the rule and ProZ's point of view on this. The thing is, these are all very subtle things and they have to be examined carefully.
When an outsourcer/agency is posting a rate in their job posting, I am not forced to accept them. But the rates offered in these job postings are indicators to people with less experience of how much they can charge for such a job. There are two issues here: the inexperienced t... See more Henry and Ralf,
I hear both of you and understand how you explain the rule and ProZ's point of view on this. The thing is, these are all very subtle things and they have to be examined carefully.
When an outsourcer/agency is posting a rate in their job posting, I am not forced to accept them. But the rates offered in these job postings are indicators to people with less experience of how much they can charge for such a job. There are two issues here: the inexperienced translators will think that is the normal rate and will be ready to work for it - not because they don't think they deserve better or because they think they should give a "beginner rebate" - simply because they will think that is the standard rate. Also, when you first start out, you tell yourself that if you can make 3 cents per word and manage to translate 4000 words in a day, that is already a real nice pay, as it comes down to $120, which, if you get full time work, is enough to make a decent living, even in Canada. When you fist start out, you don't take into consideration that you will have to buy CAT tools, that you will have to pay for certification, internet (I have high-speed only because of my work, otherwise, I would cut the speed and the cost by half), books, memberships (such as ProZ), etc. You don't take into consideration that you will need an extra room to work in, equipment, ergonomics, long-distance calls, etc. When you consider these costs, $120 per day is not such a great sum after all - especially if you also consider that you will not earn this sum every day, since we don't all get 40 hours worth of work per week, especially not when starting out.
Now, the danger of this is that there are more and more people trying this job. The number of new translators - whether qualified or not - is exponentially growing. If this new generation believes that 2, 3 and 4 cents per word is the standard rate, then all of the new generation will be ready to work for much less than we work for presently. It is a process that has already begun. I've seen profiles of people on ProZ with writing and book translating experience who went to Ivy League universities in the States, and they charge 3 cents per word for complicated language pairs - because they are starting out in freelancing.
So, when a job poster posts an amount next to the work to be done, they don't force ME to accept that rate, but THEY are setting the table for negotiation. And we all know that when an outsourcer puts a set rate in their posting, if you offer them a penny more per word, they will flat out refuse your rate and politely tell you that if they put a rate in their posting, it is because they don't have a budget for anything over that. So, they ensure that the negotiation will never take place. That's what I am against, for me to lose the privilege to negotiate. Also, by putting a rate into postings, they don't shove it down my throat, but they do contribute to a market average, which is also exponentially decreasing.
Finally, by allowing posters to put rates in their postings, what we also allow is for the offer/demand situation to turn totally around. Usually, the client has a demand and I have a supply. However, these days, as there are too many young people looking for the dream freelancer job, increasingly, it's the other way around - the client has an offer because inexperienced translators have a demand. Not long ago, there were too many contracts and not enough people to work on them. Now, there is a steady demand - but the number of people wanting the contracts has tipped over. There are more and more horror stories about people stealing other people's clients, trasnlators calling outsourcers over the phone harassing them to get work, even throwing tantrums and crying, never hesitating to step on their own pride. To me, it's a sign that our industry is changing - and the control is more and more between the hands of agencies.
This is why I propose that job posters be not allowed to post rates, even as a suggestion. Just post the job, due date, languages, kind of job it is, etc., and see who replies and with what rates. Then, take your pick - at the rates proposed. Sure, some people still will offer low rates with the new system - but when it will be up to the service provider to propose a rate, most of them will ask for the sound rates, not the African ones for the European quality job.
Please do take this into consideration. And whoever has an opinion, please do share it. Let's appreciate the dialogue and contribute to it so that we can fix this situation once and for all.
Cheers!
P.S.: When a translator gets fresh out of school and starts looking for work, they always start by checking out the rates on the market. But the only rates they will see are the ones publicly displayed - and those are the ones that are offered on sites like this one, by agencies and outsourcers. The rates they will not see are the ones that the translators offer to their clients, because those are not publicly displayed, as they are communicated through e-mail most of the time. And the rates that translators publicly display are the ones that are most of the time in line with what outsourcers offer. When a translator displays his or her rates, it is only to "catch" clients. What better way to catch clients than to offer competitive rates? If you do a little bit of searching on ProZ, you will see that the rates translators offer in their profiles are rather lowish. So, someone who starts out will think that those are the normal rates, not knowing that translators often offer twice that rate. And once you start charging the low rates, good luck to try and raise them later on. I know of all this, because this is how I first started out myself. I thought that the rates in job postings on ProZ were the normal market rates. Needless to say, I charge twice that now - and had a hard time getting there...
You see, the rates in job postings, even if we don't have to accept them, have a huge influence on the average market rate - and it is high time we all do something to change this trend.
[Edited at 2006-05-22 09:04] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Marc P (X)
Local time: 11:32
German to English
+ ...
| First KudoZ, now QuoteZ? | May 22, 2006 |
Is the ProZ jobs section becoming a game? By that, I mean the competition not to win jobs, but to be allowed to post them.
There is a group of customers who wish to buy translation services at the lowest possible price (in many cases with little regard for the consequences), and a group of translators, actual or potential, who for various reasons are willing to work for the rates on offer. Thanks to its reputation, these two groups come to ProZ in order to find each other.
... See more Is the ProZ jobs section becoming a game? By that, I mean the competition not to win jobs, but to be allowed to post them.
There is a group of customers who wish to buy translation services at the lowest possible price (in many cases with little regard for the consequences), and a group of translators, actual or potential, who for various reasons are willing to work for the rates on offer. Thanks to its reputation, these two groups come to ProZ in order to find each other.
Neither ProZ management, nor many of ProZ' users and customers, are particularly happy about this phenomenon, and various steps have already been taken to prevent ProZ being used as a venue for this particular sub-market. And so we have a cat-and-mouse game, in which one side repeatedly tweaks the rules and the other finds new ways of circumventing them.
Three things need to be considered here. Firstly, this sub-market is not going to vanish. Even if it can be eliminated from ProZ, it will spring up somewhere else. Secondly, there is no consensus on whether this market is legitimate, or how it is to be defined. It certainly cannot be defined by price alone. This is an obstacle to resolving the problem, since many ProZ users who believe that there is a problem are regarded in turn by other users as part of the problem. Thirdly, if it is to be eliminated from ProZ, it is going to take radical measures. The idea of banning all reference to rates in job postings is sensible and well-intentioned, but I doubt that it will be sufficient to prevent the two groups mentioned above from using ProZ to communicate with each other.
A more radical solution might be along these lines: the jobs section to be restricted, on the quoting side, to Platinum members; in addition, the system to display not only the number of quotes submitted, but also the geographical location of the submitters.
This is not intended as a proposal, just as a general idea for discussion, and an indicator of how radical the measures need to be in order to change the existing situation.
Marc ▲ Collapse
| | | |
MarcPrior wrote:
Is the ProZ jobs section becoming a game? By that, I mean the competition not to win jobs, but to be allowed to post them.
Marc
well, I don't see anywhere on the net professionals negotiating prices publicly. If you offer a service, fine, but if you are looking for a service, how can you offer a fixed price publicly for everybody to see? This is a perverse game, one which should be banned, simply because it's not professional and undermines our community.
Giovanni
| | |
|
|
|
| African Prices!!! : | May 22, 2006 |
Well... I don't know what African Prices are generally like. But they are not definitely that cheap.
Last year, I did some voluntary work for an NGO in Africa. Well, part of it (Interpretation) was voluntary and the rest (translation of their workshop manual) was paid.
Anyways, I met an experienced and qualified Interpreter who worked in a professional capacity (and not as a volunteer)... and was quite strict about things.
He charged more than 400 USD p... See more Well... I don't know what African Prices are generally like. But they are not definitely that cheap.
Last year, I did some voluntary work for an NGO in Africa. Well, part of it (Interpretation) was voluntary and the rest (translation of their workshop manual) was paid.
Anyways, I met an experienced and qualified Interpreter who worked in a professional capacity (and not as a volunteer)... and was quite strict about things.
He charged more than 400 USD per day and worked less than 4 - 5 hours, and interpreted only from French > English. And on top of it we had to wait for him... (never on time)
So to say that they can get work done cheaper in Africa one has to shell out 2 USD to check one's e-mail (1 hour). In India, I could use internet for 6 hours with that same amount.
Ritu
[Edited at 2006-05-22 12:21] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Aleksandr Okunev (X)
Local time: 12:32
English to Russian
| Missing the forest behind the trees | May 22, 2006 |
I regret to say that the discussion is going exactly the same way it went countless times here on Proz. We discuss the mechanics and *miss the whole point*. Please, take my words for granted, I have lived through disintegration of the Soviet Union, and the Kremlin folks also thought they were the smartest. I would not want to see Proz collapse one sunny day.
Back to the mechanics. Let me give you an example. Take a look at Kud... See more I regret to say that the discussion is going exactly the same way it went countless times here on Proz. We discuss the mechanics and *miss the whole point*. Please, take my words for granted, I have lived through disintegration of the Soviet Union, and the Kremlin folks also thought they were the smartest. I would not want to see Proz collapse one sunny day.
Back to the mechanics. Let me give you an example. Take a look at Kudoz. There are bells and whistles everywhere, limitations, notices, tags, popups and Kudoz is abused by those who want it and does not serve its purpose fully. Moreover, the entire idea of limiting the number of questions asked, lobbied by the aggressive minority, is quite illogical - who would host an online terminology database and take steps to limit its growth?
Now, currently Kudoz score is *the only* factor which determines a freelancer’s position in the rating and his/her exposure to potential clients. I am not at all happy about it, not because I am not on Page One but because I know what Kudoz points are worth. Don’t tell me it’s a game, when it comes to finding a freelancer on Proz, it is no game at all. Let us also not forget that most of Kudoz leaders got their points when there were NO LIMITATIONS on the number of questions and “I love you” questions were abundant. Now they are happy with their thousands of points, and I am not. I am not happy about myself being forced to be in this game, I am unhappy for those people who will not answer a “not for points” question, I am not happy for a lot of good translators who don’t provide their answers in Kudoz because this game stinks.
Blue Board... Shall I list the problems it is plagued with?
I do not blame everything on Henry and Proz. Sadly enough it is the community that largely determines Proz development, similarly to Brownian motion.
However, what the site looks like, what scripts it runs is decided by Proz team and here I cannot give them a lot of credit. To illustrate my vision of the current Proz strategy I would like you to recall those boxes of pills with blinking LEDs, green, red, yellow. Presently Proz’s box has a million of them, most of the time and effort is spent on installling new ones, while inside it is the same old pill, with another year behind it, closer to expiry.
Please, understand me right. I do care about Proz, I am spending my valuable time writing this post because I want to see this site improve. I try to avoid offensive wording but sometimes the facts themselves can make you feel bitter enough.
Let me finish with a quote from an e-mail which I got from a man I worked for and was quite close to. British press calls him “a tycoon”. This is related to what I think is the reason behind the rush here on Proz - an incessant drive to increase the audience irrespective of its quality and to get as many plats out of this as possible.
Though I studied political economy more than thirty years ago, I have
forgotten almost everything I learned then and I do not have a
straightforward answer to your question about wealth. Of course, it has
something to do with the division of labour and with the operation of
markets but the older I get the more I notice that wealth seems to arise
from a cast of mind, a serious and sensitive attitude towards what other
people want. When this is at the forefront, wealth seems to be generated
in torrents. There is an example of this currently in the news here.
British Airways is one of the biggest airlines in the world. Until
relatively recent years, it belonged to the state. It is a huge
bureaucracy and, until a few months ago, it had a fixed idea that
airline services should offer a very high level of prestige and comfort
and charge commensurately high prices. Just a few years ago, a man
called Ryan decided to set up his own airline, called Ryanair, which
would offer safe services but with the prestige and comfort stripped
away to produce the very lowest possible fares. Many of his fares are
less than a quarter of the British Airways ones. People have flocked to
him. His company, though it is much smaller than British Airways is now
almost twice as valuable as it. And, more important, millions of people
who could not previously afford to travel can now afford to do so.
Belatedly, British Airways now tries to copy him.
Perhaps the source of wealth is the desire to profit by providing people
with what they really want.
Don’t, for God’s sake, check Ryanair rates again. Think globally.
Thank you for your patience.
Alex ▲ Collapse
| | | | | I can only agree... | May 22, 2006 |
Aleksandr Okunev wrote:
Let me finish with a quote from an e-mail which I got from a man I worked for and was quite close to. British press calls him “a tycoon”. This is related to what I think is the reason behind the rush here on Proz - an incessant drive to increase the audience irrespective of its quality and to get as many plats out of this as possible.
Alex
I like Henry very much , but he is a businessman and his primary goal is to make money.
Giovanni
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » Commentary on rates by job poster(s) in their posts | Trados Studio 2022 Freelance | The leading translation software used by over 270,000 translators.
Designed with your feedback in mind, Trados Studio 2022 delivers an unrivalled, powerful desktop
and cloud solution, empowering you to work in the most efficient and cost-effective way.
More info » |
| | Trados Business Manager Lite | Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
Trados Business Manager Lite helps to simplify and speed up some of the daily tasks, such as invoicing and reporting, associated with running your freelance translation business.
More info » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
Translation news
