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Why you should never use Google Translate or the API in Trados...
Thread poster: LegalTransform

LegalTransform  Identity Verified
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Sep 29, 2015

without your client's (or agency's) express permission:

http://abovethelaw.com/2015/01/man-vs-machine-google-translate-jeopardizes-client-confidentiality-ediscovery/

"...When you upload, submit, store, send or receive content to or through our Services, you give Google (and those we work with) a worldwide license to use, host, store, reproduce, modify, create derivative works (such as those resulting from translations, adaptations or other changes we make so that your content works better with our Services), communicate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute such content.” ..."

[Edited at 2015-09-29 17:45 GMT]


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
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Google isn’t that stupid. Sep 29, 2015

I don't think there is any reason to worry about that. They just need to make sure you have given them the right to use your data in ways that will allow their system to function optimally.

I doubt that Google saves each source segment you send to the GT engine via the API, patches them all together and sells the resulting patchwork on the black market. Google isn’t that stupid.

However, if worrying is your thing, try a desktop engine: http://www.proz.com/forum/machine_translation_mt/290872-slate_desktop_your_personal_mt_engine.html


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Thayenga  Identity Verified
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Well, Sep 29, 2015

At least they're asking for one's permission to use, butcher, sell and resell people's texts. There are many cases when Google simply takes what rightfully belongs to others without even consindering asking for anyone's persmission.

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LegalTransform  Identity Verified
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It's not up to you to worry... Sep 29, 2015

..because it is not your decision to make. It's up to your client's discretion whether or not they want to risk having their data used sometime in the future. All this data is being collected (on Facebook and elsewhere) and no one can predict how it may be used against your clients in the future.

Michael Beijer wrote:

I don't think there is any reason to worry about that.


[Edited at 2015-09-29 19:11 GMT]


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
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they need to be able to "do stuff" with the data (not sell it to Russia) Sep 29, 2015

Thayenga wrote:

At least they're asking for one's permission to use, butcher, sell and resell people's texts. There are many cases when Google simply takes what rightfully belongs to others without even consindering asking for anyone's persmission.


They are not asking for "permission to use, butcher, sell and resell people's texts", they are asking if they can process your text in their MT engine. In order for them to make the system work, they need to be able to do stuff with the data. That's what this is about.


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LegalTransform  Identity Verified
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Thank you for making a legal determination Sep 29, 2015

on behalf of your clients. I am sure they appreciate your due diligence.

Michael Beijer wrote:


They are not asking for "permission to use, butcher, sell and resell people's texts", they are asking if they can process your text in their MT engine. In order for them to make the system work, they need to be able to do stuff with the data. That's what this is about.


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Michael Joseph Wdowiak Beijer  Identity Verified
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Paranoid scare mongering Sep 29, 2015

Jeff Whittaker wrote:

..because it is not your decision to make. It's up to your client's discretion whether or not they want to risk having their data used sometime in the future. All this data is being collected (on Facebook and elsewhere) and no one can predict how it may be used against your clients in the future.

Michael Beijer wrote:

I don't think there is any reason to worry about that.


[Edited at 2015-09-29 19:11 GMT]


Sorry, Jeff, but that's just silly. As if anyone really cares about the central heating boiler manual I am currently translating. The whole thing is already online in seven different languages (in and on various websites and downloadable PDFs). In a week or so, it will be available in eight.

I have carefully read Google's relevant terms, researched it thoroughly online, and do not feel that the data of my clients is at any risk by using the Google Translate plugin in my CAT tool via the (paid!) Google API. If a client doesn't want me using it, they can send the job to you for all I care. I find it useful and will continue to use it happily until someone demonstrates to me that it puts the data at any real risk.

PS: Due diligence indeed. I hope you don't use email to send/receive files to/from your clients?

[Edited at 2015-09-29 19:51 GMT]


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LegalTransform  Identity Verified
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Confidentiality Sep 29, 2015

If there is nothing wrong with using it, why not just ask them?

I would be curious to know how many agencies and clients would grant explicit permission (especially after reading Google's legal disclaimer).
Michael Beijer wrote:

If a client doesn't want me using it, they can send the job to you for all I care. I find it useful and will continue to use it happily until someone demonstrates to me that it puts the data at any real risk.



Michael Beijer wrote:

PS: Due diligence indeed. I hope you don't use email to send/receive files to/from your clients?

[Edited at 2015-09-29 19:51 GMT]


I use a private email provider whose contract does not say "we have the right to use all of your emails to publish new derivative documents.. and to distribute and display them publicly." AND - clients are aware of the risks of using the email service since they are the ones who send the original document and request its receipt via email. Clients are not aware that their documents (including private corporate and financial data that could be used by a competitor or for insider stock trading) are being sent to a private company for processing.

[Edited at 2015-09-29 20:10 GMT]


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Kevin Dias
Local time: 00:09
SITE STAFF
Old TOS Sep 29, 2015

Jeff,

The article you linked quotes Google's TOS from April 14, 2014:


Google Terms of Service, as of April 14, 2014”

“YOUR CONTENT IN OUR SERVICES
Some of our Services allow you to upload, submit, store, send or receive content. You retain ownership of any intellectual property rights that you hold in that content. In short, what belongs to you stays yours.

When you upload, submit, store, send or receive content to or through our Services, you give Google (and those we work with) a worldwide license to use, host, store, reproduce, modify, create derivative works (such as those resulting from translations, adaptations or other changes we make so that your content works better with our Services), communicate, publish, publicly perform, publicly display and distribute such content.”


If you check Google's current TOS (Last modified: August 19, 2015) I can not find that clause.

The closest clause I can see is:

Our automated systems analyze your content (including emails) to provide you personally relevant product features, such as customized search results, tailored advertising, and spam and malware detection.


The Google Translate API TOS (Last modified: April 1, 2013) state:


2. Submission of Content

Google does not claim any ownership in the content that you submit or in the translations of that content returned by the API.


On the other hand, the Google APIs Terms of Service (last modified: December 5, 2014) includes the following clause:


b. Submission of Content Some of our APIs allow the submission of content. Google does not acquire any ownership of any intellectual property rights in the content that you submit to our APIs through your API Client, except as expressly provided in the Terms. For the sole purpose of enabling Google to provide, secure, and improve the APIs (and the related service(s)) and only in accordance with the applicable Google privacy policies, you give Google a perpetual, irrevocable, worldwide, sublicensable, royalty-free, and non-exclusive license to Use content submitted, posted, or displayed to or from the APIs through your API Client. "Use" means use, host, store, modify, communicate, and publish. Before you submit content to our APIs through your API Client, you will ensure that you have the necessary rights (including the necessary rights from your end users) to grant us the license.


Although it is not clear to me how or if this applies to the Google Translate API. To me, an example of submission of content would be uploading a YouTube video through the API. Would querying the Translate API count as submission of content? Not sure, I'm not a lawyer.

Kevin

Edit: Fix link HTML

[Edited at 2015-09-29 20:20 GMT]


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LegalTransform  Identity Verified
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Thanks Kevin Sep 29, 2015

That is interesting stuff.

The point remains, however, do clients have the right to know that GT, Bing or other online translation system is being used and make their own decision in this regard?

Kevin Dias wrote:


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Robert Rietvelt  Identity Verified
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Maybe a silly thought, but.... Sep 29, 2015

.... aren't we working on our own downfall? What I mean to say is when we are 'feeding' Google with our translations, so they can improve their MT, maybe they will succeed some day, and thanks to us we at that day won't be needed anymore.

Like I said: 'Maybe a silly thought', but still...... (????)

[Edited at 2015-09-29 22:07 GMT]


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LEXpert  Identity Verified
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Except... Sep 30, 2015

Robert Rietvelt wrote:

.... aren't we working on our own downfall? What I mean to say is when we are 'feeding' Google with our translations, so they can improve their MT, maybe they will succeed some day, and thanks to us we at that day won't be needed anymore.


[Edited at 2015-09-29 22:07 GMT]


...Google does not receive your post-edits, so you are not "feeding" it anything useful, least of all your translations.


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
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NSA knows it anyway Sep 30, 2015

When you send your translation via email NSA and probably many other organisation will routinely intercept your traffic and so nobody can guarantee absolute secrecy anymore. If your technical text is of any interest to American industry they will get it for sure and free of charge.

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xxxDorothyX
France
Local time: 16:09
That's why Sep 30, 2015

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

When you send your translation via email NSA and probably many other organisation will routinely intercept your traffic and so nobody can guarantee absolute secrecy anymore. If your technical text is of any interest to American industry they will get it for sure and free of charge.


that's why really confidential texts are and should be translated in-house on a machine that is not connected to the internet. Although... I just read a book about spies capturing keystrokes from inside an embassy, by using very sensitive material installed in a nearby truck. So to be sure, add a bunker to your translator's equipment.


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
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Jeff, that's a different question Sep 30, 2015

Jeff Whittaker wrote:
The point remains, however, do clients have the right to know that GT, Bing or other online translation system is being used and make their own decision in this regard?


That's a different question than the one from the original post. The original post (and the blog post) suggests that it is wrong to use GT for client work because of the GT terms of service. You are now asking a different question, namely: is it wrong to use GT for client work without the client's consent or knowledge (and/or presumably: against the client's wishes)?

This has been discussed before. The main issue is whether the client has any say in *how* you do the translation, if the delivered product complies with the client's specifications. In some jurisdictions, you may lose your status as an independent contractor if you allow the client to deny you your independent right to decide how you will do the job.


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