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Translation Workspace / Lionbridge CAT tool
Thread poster: sasp

sasp  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 17:53
Member
Spanish to English
+ ...
Mar 4, 2010

Hey,

I just wanted to know what you guys think about this new system being introduced by Liox. I've been to a couple of webinars and it all looks great, etc. but the only problem is that in order to work for Lionbridge from June onwards, we will have to pay for a subscription to the system. What's the general opinion on this?
FYI: the lowest cost subscription seems reasonable and you can use the system for your own projects too, but if you are only going to use it for Lionbridge, doesn't this seem slightly unfair? Would you think it reasonable to factor in the cost of this into your rates? (Whenever I get asked to use CAT tools, it's either Trados or Wordfast which I've already paid for.)
Anyway, just hoping someone can give me some thoughts on this.
Thanks!


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Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 16:53
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
It's a free world Mar 4, 2010

I suppose they can specify that if they wish, just as I can specify to a plumber that he must use a certain brand of tool. Of course, most plumbers would tell me where to stick this certain brand of tool, wouldn't they?
it
My own opinion is that it's a free world, and I'm free not to work when faced with unworkable/unprofitable restrictions.

[Edited at 2010-03-04 19:00 GMT]


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Maria Lidia Wilczewski  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:53
English to Polish
Ditto Mar 4, 2010

I agree with Sheila.

[Edited at 2010-03-04 18:31 GMT]


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Tomás Cano Binder, BA, CT  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 17:53
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Being requested a tool is OK... Mar 4, 2010

...but being asked to pay for the use of a proprietary tool is not OK.

It is perfectly OK if this company asks you to use their tool. It is legitimate as it helps them work more efficiently and deliver a better service to their customers. However, I would only pay for the use of the tool is there was a written guarantee that they would give me a constant quantity of work equivalent to 25% of my usual throughput, and at a reasonable rate.

Working for a low rate, being forced to use their proprietary tool, and being forced to be a customer to their CAT tool business as part of the deal is not quite my idea of an interesting customer...


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John Rawlins  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 17:53
Spanish to English
+ ...
A wonderfully innovative business Mar 4, 2010

You have to take your hat off in admiration for their relentless spirit of innovation.

Firstly, they have introduced Indian pay rates to the US and Western Europe. Now they have managed to pull another rabbit from the hat - by charging suppliers to work for them.

Bravo!


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Oleg Prots  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 18:53
Member (2003)
English to Ukrainian
+ ...
Just wondering... Mar 4, 2010

There was a surprising revelation for me at the webinar - that "many translators have been repeatedly asking for the ability to use Logoport for their own projects" (not 100% accurate quote maybe, but that was the idea). This sounded like a poor bluff to me...
What you think? Would you ever want to use Logoport for non-Lion projects, even for free?

[Edited at 2010-03-04 16:09 GMT]


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Laurent KRAULAND  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 17:53
French to German
+ ...
Using Logoport... Mar 4, 2010

Oleg Prots wrote:

There was a surprising revelation for me at the webinar - that "many translators have been repeatedly asking for the ability to use Logoport for their own projects" (not 100% accurate quote maybe, but that was the idea). This sounded like a poor bluff to me...
What you think? Would you ever want to use Logoport for non-Lion projects, even for free?

[Edited at 2010-03-04 16:09 GMT]


Not in my worst nightmarish nightmares, Oleg. I am against feeding an online TM on which I have no control anyway, and the Logoport interface is not better than the one of the older Trados version (btw, Trados will implement a clone of the Liox system soon - for 8 EUR/month).

I predicted some months ago - and it was an easy prediction - that big LSP's would sooner or later force their "vendors" to use one-way, Internet-based systems. There we have them! And the future seems quite "cloudy".

Seriously, and with reference to another offer made by a translation agency: why on Earth should I accept their offer for a free and permanent storage capacity of 2 GB when I can buy a fully tax-deductible storage device with a capacity of 1 TB for some $ 300?

[Edited at 2010-03-04 16:25 GMT]


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Kasia Platkowska
Spain
Local time: 17:53
Member (2005)
Spanish to Polish
+ ...
Definitely not!!! Mar 4, 2010

Definitely not, Oleg. I worked with Logoport because I was forced to, but I really prefer Trados that also allows you to work without the obligation of being connected all the time... And I don´t like the idea of "sharing" the same TM with other translators.. Each translation has his/her own style and I think that by "mixing" sentences of different translators, the "perfect" system would create a kind of horrendous "verbal patchwork"... Our work is our work and we shouldn´t be obliged to share it with anybody. This "Translation Workspace" we have to pay for just drives me crazy! Pay-to-get-the-job.... No comments...

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John Rawlins  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 17:53
Spanish to English
+ ...
I have a copy of their research report Mar 4, 2010

Oleg Prots wrote:

There was a surprising revelation for me at the webinar - that "many translators have been repeatedly asking for the ability to use Logoport for their own projects" (not 100% accurate quote maybe, but that was the idea). This sounded like a poor bluff to me...
What you think? Would you ever want to use Logoport for non-Lion projects, even for free?

[Edited at 2010-03-04 16:09 GMT]


Below is an extract from the BS Report on the Translating Industry 2010.

Our preliminary research has indicated that many translators are interested in low-paying work and tight deadlines. Moreover, a significant number have expressed a preference for weekend work and say that enjoy offering extended periods of credit to their clients.
Most translators report being confused by the variety of CAT tools available on the market and have said they would welcome a supplier who was able to simplify the decision-making process with respect to CAT tools...


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Jabberwock  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 17:53
Member (2004)
English to Polish
A clever (?) ploy... Mar 4, 2010

Oleg Prots wrote:
There was a surprising revelation for me at the webinar - that "many translators have been repeatedly asking for the ability to use Logoport for their own projects" (not 100% accurate quote maybe, but that was the idea). This sounded like a poor bluff to me...


Well, it would be much harder to charge for their system if it was used just for their translation, wouldn't it? Now that you might use it for your own project, you have to pay...

It's really funny - they want translators to pay for the system which has no visible benefits for translators and all the benefits for Lionbridge!

[Edited at 2010-03-04 16:31 GMT]


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Oleg Prots  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 18:53
Member (2003)
English to Ukrainian
+ ...
Wow! Mar 4, 2010

John Rawlins wrote:
Our preliminary research has indicated that many translators are interested in low-paying work and tight deadlines. Moreover, a significant number have expressed a preference for weekend work and say that enjoy offering extended periods of credit to their clients.
Most translators report being confused by the variety of CAT tools available on the market and have said they would welcome a supplier who was able to simplify the decision-making process with respect to CAT tools...


That's hilarious!
I wonder if anyone here knows anyone of these "many translators" and "most translators"...


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Nadejda Vega Cespedes  Identity Verified

Local time: 17:53
Spanish to Russian
+ ...
A whole page into the discussion... Mar 4, 2010

...and nobody has said it is only natural to pay agencies for the honor of working with them? Because that is how things work in the real world and we are facing recession and there's India on this planet and Google Translate? We might be making a progress.

John Rawlins wrote:

Our preliminary research has indicated that many translators are interested in low-paying work and tight deadlines. Moreover, a significant number have expressed a preference for weekend work and say that enjoy offering extended periods of credit to their clients.


That's a joke, right? Please, please tell me it's a joke... please!


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Oleg Prots  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 18:53
Member (2003)
English to Ukrainian
+ ...
Agree Mar 4, 2010

Laurent KRAULAND wrote:
I predicted some months ago - and it was an easy prediction - that big LSP's would sooner or later force their "vendors" to use one-way, Internet-based systems. There we have them! And the future seems quite "cloudy".


I am mostly optimistically minded, but I must admit I share your concerns about the future.


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Anett Lindner
Germany
English to German
Even if Mar 4, 2010

Hi all,

I just want to say with respect to Laurent Kraulands assessment of the current development of larger providers*, which I think is correct, that still no translator is forced to support it.

Only a quarter of the market is controlled by larger providers and only if translators subject to their mode of operation they ll be able to grow their share and hence the spread of such business practices.

I once was contacted by a larger agency and asked to sign a contract making me liable for all forms of damage and at the same time offered a liability insurance through them, which was also a nice new way of growing sales through suppliers. Though I was at the beginning of my career as a freelancer I did not feel the need to sign such a contract and since then have been asked several times by them to sign this contract so as to be admitted to their supplier base, which made me think that the pool of individuals willing to cooperate on these terms might not be as large as the image of their brand suggests.

Hw a nice day,

Anett


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Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 16:53
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
We just need to put pride before desperation Mar 4, 2010

Anett Lindner wrote:
no translator is forced to support it.

Only a quarter of the market is controlled by larger providers and only if translators subject to their mode of operation they ll be able to grow their share and hence the spread of such business practices.

the pool of individuals willing to cooperate on these terms might not be as large as the image of their brand suggests.


I agree entirely with these extracts from your post, Anett.

There are a lot of other fish in the sea and we owe it to all other professional translators not to let ourselves be subjected to these practices.

If the only translators who will agree to work for them all produce shoddy work, they may eventually turn to us for professional products at reasonable prices. On the other hand, they may not - but who cares? Others will pay a reasonable price for top quality.


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