| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | Clients who send document images from their cell phones Thread poster: Jeff Whittaker
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Jean Lachaud 
United States
Local time: 05:35
English to French
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Indeed, such small jobs require more work than "normal" translations. I view them as a sort of public service: individual customers have no experience about buying translation services. I have to confess that, after the job is done, I usually regret accepting, because I have spent much more time than anticipated.
Jeff Whittaker wrote:
I've found that doing small jobs for private individuals is really a waste of time.
| | | | Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 05:35
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
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TOPIC STARTER |
Maxi Schwarz wrote: Jeff Whittaker wrote:
I've found that doing small jobs for private individuals is really a waste of time. Can you explain why, and in what capacity? I have been moving more and more toward small jobs for private individuals. The interaction is simpler and less complicated and generally more efficient. The calculated per-hour earning is better.
I suspect that for the vast majority of translators, the calculated per-hour earning for small jobs for private individuals is abysmal. They don't have established routines for requesting translations, they are not sure what they want, they waffle about the price, researching terminology takes a disproportionately large amount of time etc. Working out all those details often takes more time than the job. Perhaps if there is a private person who supplies you with regular jobs, the equation will change as the communication/workflow gets smoother, but what private person has regular translation needs? None that I have ever met.
| | | | Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 05:35
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
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TOPIC STARTER | Especially when dealing with school transcripts: | Oct 23, 2015 |
And then the client wants endless changes: "That's not what the course is about", "That's not what my degree is called", "I need this to say Master's Degree", "I need you to convert the grades to U.S. letter grades...:" Well, they attended the school, so obviously they would know the content of the course, all you have is a brief title...
And the formatting...
And figuring out all the titles of organizations / stamps / ministries / job titles...
And figurin... See more And then the client wants endless changes: "That's not what the course is about", "That's not what my degree is called", "I need this to say Master's Degree", "I need you to convert the grades to U.S. letter grades...:" Well, they attended the school, so obviously they would know the content of the course, all you have is a brief title...
And the formatting...
And figuring out all the titles of organizations / stamps / ministries / job titles...
And figuring out the meaning of the dozens and dozens of abbreviations... which we are supposed to somehow magically know...
Incidentally, I know quite a few agencies that also no longer accept what they call "private docs". They only accept them from large companies (who receive them as part of employment applications and are therefore not fussy about the details).
That having been said, if you are translating German to English, Germans do have the most uniform civil registry documents throughout the country.
FarkasAndras wrote:
...researching terminology takes a disproportionately large amount of time etc. Working out all those details often takes more time than the job.
[Edited at 2015-10-23 22:24 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:35
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| Private isn't worth it | Oct 24, 2015 |
FarkasAndras wrote:
I suspect that for the vast majority of translators, the calculated per-hour earning for small jobs for private individuals is abysmal.
Agreed. If a private individual contacted me for a quote I would politely decline. Subsequent emails would be ignored. Ditto telephone calls.
What am I going to say to one of my corporate clients contacts me with an urgent job? "Sorry, no can do, translating somebody's marriage certificate"? Doesn't make sense.
Regards
Dan
| | | | | answering the answers to my question | Oct 24, 2015 |
Thank you Jeff, Dan, FarkasAndras and JL101 for your explanations about private clients asking for small translations. I do a lot of translations of this kind and the kinds of things you all describe don't match my experience. I'll try to explain.
I have created formatted templates for the most common small translation requests: driver's licenses, "police reports", etc. A driver's license is usually a little plastic laminated card so turning that original into electronic form wou... See more Thank you Jeff, Dan, FarkasAndras and JL101 for your explanations about private clients asking for small translations. I do a lot of translations of this kind and the kinds of things you all describe don't match my experience. I'll try to explain.
I have created formatted templates for the most common small translation requests: driver's licenses, "police reports", etc. A driver's license is usually a little plastic laminated card so turning that original into electronic form wouldn't make sense. But a template with formatting that will allow an official to scan back and forth is more than doable, and once you have created it, you can use it over and over.
Typically an end client will phone and e-mail for say a driver's license or police report. I tell the client my fee, which is $50 presently. It takes maybe 20 minutes to fill out the template, check it, and print out the translation, scan of the original as proof that I've seen it, and certifying statement. Another few minutes to stamp, date and sign. Perhaps 10 minutes for the interaction with the client - when they ask; when they come and pick it up; when they have received and looked at the preliminary copy of the translation. I get paid ahead of time or at pickup. Clients generally comply with my routine, and everything goes smoothly.
So for me, 30 minutes work for $50 adds up to $100/hour, which is paid immediately, and the interaction is usually hassle-free and enjoyable. Many end clients are genuinely thankful for the service which means something in their personal life. I have increased this kind of service over the past few years, and by word of mouth more such clients seek me out.
If this is my experience, it would be silly for me to turn my back on it. I was genuinely surprised to see it described so negatively which is why I asked.
Taking some of the responses individually:
(Andras)I suspect that for the vast majority of translators, the calculated per-hour earning for small jobs for private individuals is abysmal.
I've calculated mine to be at best $100/hour. That is not abysmal.
(Andras) They don't have established routines for requesting translations, they are not sure what they want, they waffle about the price,...
True, they don't have an established routine. But I have a routine and quickly put them through the paces by asking pertinent questions and telling them how we will work. For the second: they want a certified translation of their licence or report, as requested by the government officials - and I know what the government officials want. My price is firm and anyone who waffles doesn't get my time. But I rarely get waffling.
researching terminology takes a disproportionately large amount of time etc.
Terminology research is rarely needed for this kind of job.
But on that point - I've gotten plenty of work through agencies where there is a LOT of terminology that needs to be researched. I can't say how this relates to private individuals. Doesn't this relate to the type of translation? Btw, I have never received glossaries for anything in my entire translation career.
Working out all those details often takes more time than the job.
There is no working out of details. However, I have worked for agencies that have complicated procedures, that want to tell me how to do my work, that have proofreaders who destroy my work and then force me to justify why their "corrections" are wrong etc. I have had a lot of time stole by some agencies, and this has never happened with an end client. Plus payment is rarely immediate. Arguments about price have happened with agencies, esp. those who have quoted a low price before contacting me.
(Jeff) And then the client wants endless changes: ...
Doesn't happen. Well, it wouldn't happen in driver's licenses and police reports in any case. For transcripts, letters of recommendation, apprenticeship reports etc. I will tell the end client that I am an expert in translation and language, and they are the expert in their own field. Many end clients are bilingual, especially in their field. I will ask questions during the translation, and have them go through the translation after it is done while still in electronic form. We work together. It is collaborative and not confrontational. I always have the last word and they respect that.
And the formatting...
The common ones are pre-formatted. This last week I did three driver's licenses, two with the new European Union formatting, and one with the old. I simply pulled out the right one.
And figuring out all the titles of organizations / stamps / ministries / job titles...
There aren't that many, and they tend to be the same ones over and over.
And figuring out the meaning of the dozens and dozens of abbreviations... which we are supposed to somehow magically know...
I see loads of abbreviations in medical reports, which are usually requested for insurance compensation. I avoid those and often refuse them outright.
(Jeff) That having been said, if you are translating German to English, Germans do have the most uniform civil registry documents throughout the country.
Ah - something we can agree on.  I translate from German (giving me Germany, Switzerland, and Austria) and from French (giving my France, Switzerland, Quebec, and a few African countries).
I'm guessing that it's not the case in your language pairs in which case your reaction makes sense.
(Jeff) Incidentally, I know quite a few agencies that also no longer accept what they call "private docs".
Yes, I've been told the same. All the better for translators like me. Send them my way.
I honestly do enjoy my end clients. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kevin Fulton
United States
Local time: 05:35
German to English
| No personal documents for me | Oct 25, 2015 |
Although over the years I've created templates for standard documents like drivers licenses, etc. I gave up a couple of years ago due to the hassle involved: delivery of documents, requested notarization, discussions regarding the content of certificates.
Some people thought I could translate documents while they waited, like having a copy of a key made.
The last straw was having a translation of a driver's license rejected by the Michigan Secretary of State because my letterhead (r... See more Although over the years I've created templates for standard documents like drivers licenses, etc. I gave up a couple of years ago due to the hassle involved: delivery of documents, requested notarization, discussions regarding the content of certificates.
Some people thought I could translate documents while they waited, like having a copy of a key made.
The last straw was having a translation of a driver's license rejected by the Michigan Secretary of State because my letterhead (required on every page) looked like it was printed by a laser printer, which it was. The phone discussion with the clerk convinced me that I didn't have the right attitude toward this type of work.
Granted, the translating effort is generally low, but the collateral aggravation isn't worth the money to me. ▲ Collapse
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Perhaps it's country-specific. In Canada a certified translator uses his or her certification stamp, and notarization is not needed. Since these translations must be done by a certified translator or be notarized, these arguments with the translator don't occur in my experience. When I read about the difficulties and complications that my colleagues encounter I can see the reason for reticence.
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Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:35
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
Maxi Schwarz wrote: Yes, I've been told the same. All the better for translators like me. Send them my way. I honestly do enjoy my end clients.
Well, if you've got a system for private documents that works due to the effort you've put into making it efficient, more power to your elbow. That sounds like a decent niche in the market, in addition to you other projects.
Regards
Dan
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:35
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Dan Lucas wrote: Maxi Schwarz wrote: Yes, I've been told the same. All the better for translators like me. Send them my way. I honestly do enjoy my end clients. Well, if you've got a system for private documents that works due to the effort you've put into making it efficient, more power to your elbow. That sounds like a decent niche in the market, in addition to you other projects. Regards Dan
Unlike others who have posted here, I have a lot of time for the private individual who wants a professional translator to do a small job.
Haven't you ever needed someone to come and repair a leak in your bathroom, or fix your washing machine?
I simply quote my standard rate for small jobs. This includes the time I would spend on the job itself, plus my admin and invoicing costs etc.
We shouldn't think we're so high and mighty (and greedy for profits above everything else) that we haven't got time to help the little guy or gal.
And anyway they might turn out to be someone who knows someone who needs big translation jobs, further down the line !
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