Client who want to remain anonymous
Thread poster: jelly_gill

jelly_gill  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 19:53
Member (2006)
English to Panjabi
+ ...
Aug 2, 2007

Dear all,

Yesterday I got one email from a hotmail ID. The sender asked me if I could translate 2500 words for them and they asked me to quote my rates. There was no name, address or telephone numbers in the email.

Since I have been cheated in the past, I asked them to communicate using their corporate email ID and provide their website address, phone numbers etc. I also told them that if they dont provide me these details, I will not work for them unless they pay my full payment in advance via Paypal or Western Union Money Transfer.


They replied from same hotmail ID and again there was no name, address, website reference or phone number in the email. They said, they can send me bank draft within two days if I gave them my address. I thought it is a ploy to make me send them the file, and afterwards they will not be traceable to be forced to pay me.


So, I told them they can pay me via bank draft but till they identify themselves or till the bank draft reaches me and is realised, I will hold their file.


After that they stopped communicating with me and posted the same job on proz.com


Did I do the correct thing? How do you cope with such circumstances?


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Patricia Lane  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 15:23
French to English
+ ...
Skip it Aug 2, 2007

Good morning,

Maybe I am overly cautious, but I would not even respond to such an email.

Red flags pop up all over the place. There is not one single element that gives me the slightest confidence.

Besides, I need to communicate with a client and know what their needs/expectations are. I don't work in a vacuum.

Responding seems to me a total waste of time.

Cheers,

Patricia


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Harry Bornemann  Identity Verified
Mexico
English to German
+ ...
You did. Aug 2, 2007

jelly_gill wrote:
Did I do the correct thing?

I would have reacted exactly the same way, except that I would not accept any bank draft from someone who is already suspicious.
And I would use Moneybookers instead of Paypal (for safety reasons) and MoneyGram instead of Western Union (for cost reasons).

Harry


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Michele Treves
Local time: 15:23
Italian to Croatian
+ ...
THE CUSTOMER HAS NO INTENTION TO PAY Aug 2, 2007

Dear friend,

the same happened to me last month.
I asked to be paid in advance ... Guess what happened ... No answer, no news ... nothing!
This kind of customer is not welcome!
Best wishes,
Michele Treves


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Ken Cox  Identity Verified
Local time: 15:23
German to English
+ ...
I agree with the other posters... Aug 2, 2007

IMO any party in a business relationship should be perfectly willing to provide the information you requested, or at least enough information to allow them to be identified and verified if so desired (e.g. via a chamber of commerce or the like). If they refuse, you can safely assume that their intentions are not honourable.

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Claudia Krysztofiak  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:23
English to German
+ ...
Of course you did the right thing Aug 2, 2007

I would even go at least one step further. If I get contacted by a person I do not know, I always require full details, business e-mail, address, phone number, web site etc. and I confirm with the company this person works for that the person is really working for them (via the contact given on their website).

Otherwise they have to pay in advance.

I cannot see, why I would want to work with someone who is not willing to go through this process. For my part I also provide full details and e.g. had my ID verified on Proz.com.


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Özden Arıkan  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:23
Member
English to Turkish
You were wrong, Jelly... Aug 2, 2007

...at posting this to the Off topic forum as an off-topic thread. Therefore I moved it to Business Issues and made it on topic.


And, nothing to add to the above comments: you did the right thing not accepting the job. Do these guys think we are three-year olds or something? What legitimate reason would someone have for remaining anonymous in business, and which translator on earth would accept to work with someone under those circumstances? Of course, you did the right thing.


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jelly_gill  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 19:53
Member (2006)
English to Panjabi
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
now its more irritating Aug 2, 2007

After I refused the job, they have posted it on proz.com and now it irritates me even more because they may be able to trap few new transltors. They have again given the same email address for contacting purpose (which they used to contact me) and they have given their mailing address as if they are operating from an Asian country although I traced their emails to be originated from either Canada or USA.

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Lawyer-Linguist  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 14:23
Dutch to English
+ ...
At least ... Aug 2, 2007

jelly_gill wrote:

After I refused the job, they have posted it on proz.com and now it irritates me even more because they may be able to trap few new transltors. They have again given the same email address for contacting purpose (which they used to contact me) and they have given their mailing address as if they are operating from an Asian country although I traced their emails to be originated from either Canada or USA.



... you've alerted colleagues here. What they do from this point on is out of your hands.

You did the right thing.
Debs


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Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 09:23
English to Chinese
+ ...
Maybe post this story to the forums for the languages they are look for in this job? Aug 2, 2007

-- if there is any?
This way you can probable alert more people that are "at risk".

jelly_gill wrote:

After I refused the job, they have posted it on proz.com and now it irritates me even more because they may be able to trap few new transltors. They have again given the same email address for contacting purpose (which they used to contact me) and they have given their mailing address as if they are operating from an Asian country although I traced their emails to be originated from either Canada or USA.






[Edited at 2007-08-02 13:26]


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Rafa Lombardino
United States
Local time: 06:23
Member (2005)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
You did the right thing! Aug 2, 2007

Whenever I get such requests from people trying to remain anonymous, using only a nickname and a free email account, or just an individual who identifies himself, but could disappear from the face of the Earth without giving me any reliable information for collection purposes, that's exactly what I do: PAY IN ADVANCE, OR LOOK FOR SOMEONE ELSE!

You'd be surprised how many people do actually pay in advance and then send you the material. I realized that sometimes they don't want you to know who they are because they need personal stuff translated, like letters to a boyfriend or girlfriend from another country. Some other times, it's confidential documents they don't want their companies looking into. And most of the times they're just regular individuals who need their personal documents translated and, instead of going to an agency, they come across freelancers and are not familiar with the way we work (invoice paid in 15, 30 days...)

Well, since you already established your rules (I don't know if you're a good client, so pay me in advance), all you have to do now is sit and wait.


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 15:23
English to German
+ ...
Contact details are mandatory for jobs posted (even though they may not be publicly visible) Aug 2, 2007

Hi jelly_gill,
You quite rightly turned down the proposal - personally, I strictly refuse to do business with anyone unwilling to provide full business details. At the same time, I'm amazed at how many colleagues appear to be happy to do so...

jelly_gill wrote:

After I refused the job, they have posted it on proz.com and now it irritates me even more because they may be able to trap few new transltors. They have again given the same email address for contacting purpose (which they used to contact me) and they have given their mailing address as if they are operating from an Asian country although I traced their emails to be originated from either Canada or USA.

Full contact details are mandatory for posting jobs - Jobs/BB moderators reject job postings without these details. (Note that outsourcers may not wish to publicly show all details, but even so, they have to be provided, in which case they're visible to ProZ.com staff and moderators.)

What I would suggest - so we can check this - is to contact a Jobs/BB moderator (one at a time, please), indicating the URL of the job concerned. (Thanks for not mentioning specific details in the forum.)

Best regards,
Ralf


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ViktoriaG  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 09:23
English to French
+ ...
Who do you invoice? Aug 2, 2007

If you don't have information on your client, who are you going to invoice? How can you have a contract or an agreement if you can't name the parties bound by the contract?

No, my friends, there is no such thing as an anonymous client.


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sandhya  Identity Verified
Local time: 19:53
German to English
+ ...
Your reply was right! Aug 3, 2007

You were fully justified in demanding a live contact address. I receive several such (anonymous) inquiries. I merely use the very useful "Delete" button on my keyboard to get rid of them.

Don't be too upset or irritated, this is all part of the business!

cheers
Sandhya

jelly_gill wrote:

After I refused the job, they have posted it on proz.com and now it irritates me even more because they may be able to trap few new transltors. They have again given the same email address for contacting purpose (which they used to contact me) and they have given their mailing address as if they are operating from an Asian country although I traced their emails to be originated from either Canada or USA.






[Edited at 2007-08-03 00:42]

[Edited at 2007-08-03 00:42]


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