| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | Your thoughts on a translators' blacklist? Thread poster: Samuel Murray
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Nicoletta F (X)
Local time: 10:25
English to Italian
(I agree with Liz, I'm adding this about Samuel's and general considerations)
I would add that translating in your native language/languages is not THE skill or the only one, obviously...
I'm sure you consider degrees/certifications/specialization/broad culture/writing skills and accuracy as well.
Studying, in synthesis!
I'm saying this because I read here and there in translation sites: yes, sure you can do translations without the above things.
Yes, but which tran... See more (I agree with Liz, I'm adding this about Samuel's and general considerations)
I would add that translating in your native language/languages is not THE skill or the only one, obviously...
I'm sure you consider degrees/certifications/specialization/broad culture/writing skills and accuracy as well.
Studying, in synthesis!
I'm saying this because I read here and there in translation sites: yes, sure you can do translations without the above things.
Yes, but which translations?
[Edited at 2007-11-21 11:13] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Lia Fail (X) 
Spain
Local time: 10:25
Spanish to English
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lbone wrote:
If an agency push a translator to work 3 times faster than his/her general speed, you know what will happen.
A professional (such as the ones Samuel would like to be correcting) would not accept to work under such conditions:
1) to uphold their own reputation
2) to uphold the profession.
| | | | Lia Fail (X)
Spain
Local time: 10:25
Spanish to English
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| 2 suggestions | Nov 21, 2007 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
G'day everyone
For the second time this week I'm editing a translation done by a translator who really should get blacklisted somewhere. I can't believe any professional translator would deliver such rubbish as a finished product to a client. It is blatantly dishonest, in my opinion, for such a person to give themselves out as experts in their field.
I'm in the fortunate position to work in a less common language pair that is likely to see most translators in it originating from a single country. This makes a blacklist much more of a practical possibility. But... there is no such blacklist, and probably for good reason (libel, slander, you name it).
Still, I'm so peeved that I'm considering initiating a blacklist of translators in my language pair and country, to protect the good name of our industry. What are your thoughts on such a list? I'm not talking about a blacklist on ProZ.com, but something separate.
Just fishing for some ideas here... call it a rant, if you will.
Thanks
Samuel
I know the feeling:-)
Two suggestions: tell the client how bad the translator is (in the interest of defending the profession) and don't do this kind of work (to maintain your sanity!)
| | | | | I do check the text to be edited | Nov 21, 2007 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
Not accepting jobs sight unseen is a myth, in my opinion... or do you read the entire text with a hawk's eye before you accept the job?
In case of translations that have been done by translators I have no previous experience with, I do check them fairly thoroughly: not enough to see all the errors or problems that may need to be corrected in the translation, perhaps, but well enough to get a very good idea of the overall quality of the piece and how long it will probably take me to edit it well.
If I believe it would take me more than an hour/1000 words on average, I probably won't accept the project for editing.
I have enough experience, now, that I very seldom find I was mistaken in my initial assessment.
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NancyLynn
Canada
Local time: 04:25
Member (2002)
French to English
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MODERATOR | In support of being selective | Nov 21, 2007 |
Recently I was asked to do an edit by an agency, and when the task was complete I was able to say: do not lose this translator's number, as the translation was perfect. We now have a relationship: the translator does the work, I have the pleasurable task of reading over a flawless translation and be paid to do it; the odd typo I may have caught over the past year makes the proofreading worth it - two pairs of eyes are always bette... See more Recently I was asked to do an edit by an agency, and when the task was complete I was able to say: do not lose this translator's number, as the translation was perfect. We now have a relationship: the translator does the work, I have the pleasurable task of reading over a flawless translation and be paid to do it; the odd typo I may have caught over the past year makes the proofreading worth it - two pairs of eyes are always better than one.
I believe that some proofreaders, mindful of lost jobs (so they think) or jealous of their competitors, butcher any translation to make themselves look more authoritative. Please note that I am not saying this was the case with Samuel Murray. What I am saying, sort of along the lines of what Charlie Bavington was saying, is that when you do come across excellent work, don't be shy to say so: this agency continues to send me these works of art for proofreading, after all; they didn't assume that because the work submitted was so good the first time, the proofreading step can henceforth be dropped. Not at all. QA is QA. But complimenting deserving work encourages the agency to forge a long-term relatioinbship with a good, dependable translator, sometimes increasing the rate to keep this professional, which benefits everyone - the translator is recognised for his/her excellence; the agency's client is happy, and the agency's income is secure; the public enjoys first-class documents.
As Samuel mentioned, some clients and agencies are not out for top-quality. That will change. Your namesake, Samuel Clemens, said something like: My father was so ignorant when I was 17, but by the time I turned 21, I was amazed at how much smarter he'd become. Live and learn, as they say. This is a new phase in translation, with a proliferation of freelancers jumping in thanks to the advent of Internet, but I believe this is in fact a transition period, at the end of which we should have done a good deal of weeding out the bad. Call me an optimist.
Meanwhile, the responsible thing to do is point out to the client the errors in the translation, making notes to be clear (track changes is great, but sometimes an accompanying explanatory Word file does wonders) and ride out the change.
Best,
Nancy ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Agree with Nancy | Nov 22, 2007 |
I also tell my client if a translation I've revised is particularly good, not only if it's particularly bad.
| | | | MariusV
Lithuania
Local time: 11:25
English to Lithuanian
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| what about the legal side of the matter | Nov 27, 2007 |
Samuel,
A nice idea, but...I if there is a blacklist of translators (or a blacklist of whatever/whomever), think about the legal consequences for "defamation" (even if you make obvious facts known to the public). Well, even if kinda blacklist is made between several dozen of freelancers and agencies with restricted access...The psychology of those frauds just works "vice versa" - they will never agree they did a total crap, nor they will ever tell "well, my translation was really ve... See more Samuel,
A nice idea, but...I if there is a blacklist of translators (or a blacklist of whatever/whomever), think about the legal consequences for "defamation" (even if you make obvious facts known to the public). Well, even if kinda blacklist is made between several dozen of freelancers and agencies with restricted access...The psychology of those frauds just works "vice versa" - they will never agree they did a total crap, nor they will ever tell "well, my translation was really very poor"...They will always do the best they can (and even impossible things) to prove that black is white.
Your general considerations are really good, but be careful about the legal consequences. Negative info and bad rumors become known 1000 times faster than something positive.
[Edited at 2007-11-27 00:01] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | I am wondering | Apr 16, 2023 |
For months now, I do not get jobs. Even if the jobs offered are right in my fields and in the wished for price span. During Covid, I met a couple of dishonest and unethical people. I did not work with them. There were a couple of others who thought I was obliged to work with them at their unhear of conditions. And then, others did not like that I found out that they are cheating on me. They told me that they would ruin my career everywhere. Did they really succeed?
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| Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: Empty post | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:25
Member (2008)
Italian to English
I keep a personal blacklist just for my own use. No need for it to become public
| | | | Josep Vives (X)
Spain
Local time: 10:25
English to Spanish
+ ...
If he/she is really that bad, then he/she won't last a month. The same will happen with an agency with low quality standards.
Generally speaking, I am against all sorts of blacklists -they can lead to isolation, black sorcery and being burned in a pyre. It's just not the way to go!
| | | | Nikolay Novitskiy
Russian Federation
Local time: 13:25
Member (2018)
English to Russian
| One step ahead? | Apr 18, 2023 |
The problem will be solved by itself, and very soon. ChatGPT is already replacing bad and mediocre translators all over the world. As Stalin, our great leader has said: "When there's no person, there's no problem"
[Edited at 2023-04-18 06:30 GMT]
[Edited at 2023-04-18 06:52 GMT]
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| I'm beginning to put together a blacklist of KudoZ askers | Apr 28, 2023 |
After a number of very traumatic facepalm experiences where the asker would choose one of the stupidest KudoZ answers out of the list (which contained sensible alternatives with sensible explanations), I began to put the names of those askers in my awareness bank so that later I could make a definitive list of askers I'm not going to help even if the question is interesting. I'm not claiming that my answers to those questions were the best (in fact, some of the questions were ones I didn't answe... See more After a number of very traumatic facepalm experiences where the asker would choose one of the stupidest KudoZ answers out of the list (which contained sensible alternatives with sensible explanations), I began to put the names of those askers in my awareness bank so that later I could make a definitive list of askers I'm not going to help even if the question is interesting. I'm not claiming that my answers to those questions were the best (in fact, some of the questions were ones I didn't answer at all); it's just that the answer choices were a sin against common sense
[Edited at 2023-04-28 09:25 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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Denis Fesik wrote:
After a number of very traumatic facepalm experiences where the asker would choose one of the stupidest KudoZ answers out of the list (which contained sensible alternatives with sensible explanations), I began to put the names of those askers in my awareness bank so that later I could make a definitive list of askers I'm not going to help even if the question is interesting. I'm not claiming that my answers to those questions were the best (in fact, some of the questions were ones I didn't answer at all); it's just that the answer choices were a sin against common sense
[Edited at 2023-04-28 09:25 GMT]
And don't forget to blacklist askers who close questions without grading with the reason "other" without giving further details to WHY they closed the question. It is the least that they can do to notify people who contributed their time and answers as to why they closed the question. And the funny thing is that these askers who close questions without grading them are not first-time offenders but repeating offenders.
I recently blacklisted a few people in my language pair, but the most irritating and annoying incident was when the asker selected another person's answer instead of mine not because it was the best, but s/he simply made a simple error closing the question. This person has admitted this on the comment section to me that s/he was going to select my answer but made a mistake selecting the other person's answer. Can you believe that?
A blacklist of dishonest/incompetent clients and Kudoz askers is a must.
| | | | Zea_Mays
Italy
Local time: 10:25
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
| There's a Kudoz "blacklist" feature | Apr 30, 2023 |
Denis Fesik wrote:
After a number of very traumatic facepalm experiences where the asker would choose one of the stupidest KudoZ answers out of the list (which contained sensible alternatives with sensible explanations), I began to put the names of those askers in my awareness bank so that later I could make a definitive list of askers I'm not going to help even if the question is interesting. I'm not claiming that my answers to those questions were the best (in fact, some of the questions were ones I didn't answer at all); it's just that the answer choices were a sin against common sense
[Edited at 2023-04-28 09:25 GMT]
You can filter (or flag) those askers here: https://www.proz.com/?sp=dashboard&sp_mode=kudoz&sp_kudoz_mode=flagsandfilters&target_eid
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