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难道没人应该为这样的ridiculous rate负责吗?
Thread poster: jim summer

jim summer  Identity Verified
China
English to Chinese
Mar 7, 2013

又看到一家“名声狼藉”的印度某公司的广告了。2年前左右刚刚开拓国际市场时曾接过他们的一个活,900多字只10美金,当时根本不懂国际市场的价格,懵懂之间竟然接受了,后来我的一位资深自由译者朋友还为这事"批评"过我,说这是以低价竞争扰乱国际市场的恶劣行径,现在想来还觉得有自责感。通过一些途径我了解到,这次他们的出众依然让人咋舌,0.17左右吧,当我提出他们的价格是对专业翻译者的“羞辱”时,他说“别用这种态度和我说话,现在还有50位中国翻译乐意为我鞍前马后效劳呢(非原译,有些夸张的色彩,不过稍微发挥一下想像力我想也差不多这意思)!”我的问题是如果真是这样,那么愿意接受这等低价的那些中国译员不应该为此受到指责吗?不也是恶意竞争吗?更令人不解的是其blueboard上一致是5分的好评!!!据我知道他给别国的译员加上他之后几次联系我时的出价甚至不到0.01,这让我对blueboard的评分也产生了几丝怀疑!!!!!

[Edited at 2013-03-07 10:35 GMT]


 

Marvin Sun  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 16:32
English to Chinese
能不能以出价低为由给它打低分? Mar 7, 2013

可以因为出价低在blueboard里给它低分吗?Blueboard貌似只是从付款诚信上来评价的,好像很少人以价格低为由给低分的。

没仔细研究,不知道具体打分标准是什么。

[Edited at 2013-03-07 12:05 GMT]


 

jim summer  Identity Verified
China
English to Chinese
TOPIC STARTER
可以因为出价低在blueboard里给它低分吗? Mar 7, 2013

[quote]Marvin Sun wrote:

可以因为出价低在blueboard里给它低分吗?

说得有道理,不过我认为评分时应当将“专业精神”纳入考量,以超低价格的出价本身就是对专业翻译的不尊重!不知这样考虑有没有道理,呵呵。欢迎大家探讨。


 

Cheng Peng  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 16:32
Member (2010)
English to Chinese
+ ...
May I ask how much you get paid for your current job now? Mar 7, 2013

as the title suggests....:)

 

Zhoudan  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:32
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
管好自己就行了 Mar 7, 2013

别人愿意接受低价,让他们去接。更何况你也管不了。

 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 02:32
Chinese to English
+ ...
Never use it ... Mar 7, 2013

... since I'm not a paying member.icon_wink.gif

But according to the objective of the Blue Board, of course you can factor in the issue of high or low payment rates when rating an outsourcer. The number merely reflects the willingness to work again with a given outsourcer.



The ProZ.com Blue Board is provided as a resource for referencing outsourcers of translation, interpreting and other language-related work, and for expressing willingness to work again with given outsourcers ...



Also in the heading of the column of "Avg. entry level", the rating number is specifically defined as the "Likelihood of Working Again"(LWA) on a scale of 1 to 5 ...



Blue Board average entry level:

In the ProZ.com blue board, service providers enter, on a scale of 1 to 5, their likelihood of working again for a given outsourcer. An outsourcer's "average entry level" is the average of these numbers.



In other words, you can factor in issues other than the outsourcer's honesty and credibility, such as payment rates, promptness of payment, etc.. That is my interpretation.

Of course I don't see the rationale behind marking an outsourcer down mainly because of unsatisfactory rates if one accepted an assignment knowing full well (ahead of time) what the rates were going to be.


[Edited at 2013-03-08 03:54 GMT]


 

lbone  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 16:32
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
你可以不接的 Mar 8, 2013

市场经济,他们有权要低价。他们的价和中国国内公司差不多,只要双方明码标价,没什么好指责的。

我的价格,自认为在这里属于属于中等,但我很清楚我自己都雇不起我自己。

经常有我的客户问我其他语种的价格,我想想那些profile看起来水平不错的,似乎也个个都很贵,所以基本没有介绍成的。

这个市场上什么价都有,印度的价格普遍低,有人能以低价找他们翻译,这是低价公司给社会带来的价值,还有人自愿按“低价”接翻译稿,一个愿打,一个愿挨,其实没什么好指责的。

中国有很多小公司生产了很多低价手机,苹果的手机一样有大把人愿意买。一分价钱一分货,只要管好自己,让自己做出来的东西物有所值就可以,如果你没这个信心,我就没什么好说的了。

[Edited at 2013-03-08 05:54 GMT]


 

jim summer  Identity Verified
China
English to Chinese
TOPIC STARTER
我反应过激了 Mar 8, 2013

仔细看了大家的发言,挺有道理的,我总觉得太低的出价就像是和别人玩跳棋一样,你可以想方设法为自己开路搭桥,也可以费尽心机步步堵死别人的路。从游戏规则考虑后者也没有什么要指责的,可就是觉得这样有些“不厚道”,可能这样的想法比较主观吧。谢谢大家!!!!!

 

jim summer  Identity Verified
China
English to Chinese
TOPIC STARTER
谢谢,非常明确的说明,澄清了我的疑惑 Mar 8, 2013

wherestip wrote:

... since I'm not a paying member.icon_wink.gif

But according to the objective of the Blue Board, of course you can factor in the issue of high or low payment rates when rating an outsourcer. The number merely reflects the willingness to work again with a given outsourcer.



The ProZ.com Blue Board is provided as a resource for referencing outsourcers of translation, interpreting and other language-related work, and for expressing willingness to work again with given outsourcers ...



Also in the heading of the column of "Avg. entry level", the rating number is specifically defined as the "Likelihood of Working Again"(LWA) on a scale of 1 to 5 ...



Blue Board average entry level:

In the ProZ.com blue board, service providers enter, on a scale of 1 to 5, their likelihood of working again for a given outsourcer. An outsourcer's "average entry level" is the average of these numbers.



In other words, you can factor in issues other than the outsourcer's honesty and credibility, such as payment rates, promptness of payment, etc.. That is my interpretation.

Of course I don't see the rationale behind marking an outsourcer down mainly because of unsatisfactory rates if one accepted an assignment knowing full well (ahead of time) what the rates were going to be.


[Edited at 2013-03-08 03:54 GMT]


 

Marvin Sun  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 16:32
English to Chinese
当然需要指责 Mar 8, 2013

“管好自己”,或许只是无奈之举,但是以超低价格接稿,属于恶性竞争,行为应该受到指责。

中国大陆有《反不正当竞争法》,里面将”以排挤竞争对手为目的,以低于成本的价格销售商品。“列为不正当竞争行为; 台湾也有《公平交易法》。世界上大多数国家都有关于规范竞争的法律:

http://www.competitionlaw.cn/show.aspx?id=2240&cid=40

当然,其中的主要条文是对冒用商标、侵犯商业秘密、恶意诽谤等不正当竞争行为的规范。至于是否将“以超低价格交易”列在规范内容里,需要有关人士花力气去研读。


 

Zhoudan  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:32
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
有什么用 Mar 8, 2013

指责可以,但没有用。你又拿不出证据说人家低价竞争。

Marvin Sun wrote:

“管好自己”,或许只是无奈之举,但是以超低价格接稿,属于恶性竞争,行为应该受到指责。

中国大陆有《反不正当竞争法》,里面将”以排挤竞争对手为目的,以低于成本的价格销售商品。“列为不正当竞争行为; 台湾也有《公平交易法》。世界上大多数国家都有关于规范竞争的法律:

http://www.competitionlaw.cn/show.aspx?id=2240&cid=40

当然,其中的主要条文是对冒用商标、侵犯商业秘密、恶意诽谤等不正当竞争行为的规范。至于是否将“以超低价格交易”列在规范内容里,需要有关人士花力气去研读。


 

ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 02:32
English to Chinese
+ ...
无奈之举 Mar 8, 2013

Marvin Sun wrote:

“管好自己”,或许只是无奈之举,但是以超低价格接稿,属于恶性竞争,行为应该受到指责。

尽管从客观上讲,这些人的超低价格确实会影响国际市场,但他们恐怕也是出于无奈,并非有意扰乱国际市场。例如大学生付不起学费,婴儿的爹妈买不起进口奶粉(更别提买房了),都是出于无奈。所以,该指责的不是这些人。


 

ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 02:32
English to Chinese
+ ...
态度 Mar 8, 2013

jim summer wrote:

他说“别用这种态度和我说话,现在还有50位中国翻译乐意为我鞍前马后效劳呢(非原译,有些夸张的色彩,不过稍微发挥一下想像力我想也差不多这意思)!

类似的话我也听到过。不过,你也可以对这种翻译公司说,“别用这种态度和我说话,此处不养爷,自有养爷处!” icon_biggrin.gif


 

ysun  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 02:32
English to Chinese
+ ...
谁该为这样的 ridiculous rate 负责 Mar 11, 2013

如果说谁该为这样的 ridiculous rate 负责,那就是中国国家版权局 。这本1999年制订的老皇历,至今仍未废除或修订。外国很多翻译公司对这种情况十分了解。到 Proz.com 来找翻译的客户基本上就是冲着 “Walmart” 去的。 

http://www.ncac.gov.cn/cms/html/205/1873/200701/671770.html
 第六条 基本稿酬标准
  (一)原创作品:每千字30-100元
  (二)演绎作品:
    1.改编:每千字10-50元
    2.汇编:每千字3-10元
    3.翻译:每千字20-80元 
 


 

J.H. Wang
China
Local time: 16:32
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
改进办法 Mar 11, 2013

ysun wrote:

如果说谁该为这样的 ridiculous rate 负责,那就是中国国家版权局 。这本1999年制订的老皇历,至今仍未废除或修订。外国很多翻译公司对这种情况十分了解。到 Proz.com 来找翻译的客户基本上就是冲着 “Walmart” 去的。 

http://www.ncac.gov.cn/cms/html/205/1873/200701/671770.html
 第六条 基本稿酬标准
  (一)原创作品:每千字30-100元
  (二)演绎作品:
    1.改编:每千字10-50元
    2.汇编:每千字3-10元
    3.翻译:每千字20-80元 
 




根据当前的物价水平、翻译工作的难度以及重要作用,并加上前瞻性考虑,我的建议是:


翻译:每千字200-800元

icon_biggrin.gif


 
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