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胡說亂道
Thread poster: Kenneth Woo

Kenneth Woo
China
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
Sep 9, 2014

見到一些譯文,憋不住,發發牢騷。

office 不一定就是辦公室,有時是辦事處,甚至是政府的部門。
《牛津高階英漢雙解詞典》釋義:
a room or building used for a particular purpose, especially to provide information or services;
used in the names of some British government departments;

enquiry、inquiry 不是次次都可譯成什麼查詢,而要譯成咨詢。這個字往往後面跟著一個電郵地址或本身就含一個連接,當然也經常附有電話號碼。

英文喜歡 include 來,include 去,中文左一個包括,又一個包括就很彆扭,其實,往往用個有 x x 等結構就可以了。

還有這個 make sure, 不必每次都譯成確保,譯成務請、務必、保(to make sure:為保)也可以嘛。

multilingual factsheet 不要譯成多種語言的資料,拗口;譯成多語資料簡潔順口得多。

最大的問題還是拖沓,八個字說得清楚得非得用十六個字。

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?

sex between man and woman 就是男女性交,為何要說成男人和女人之間的性接觸?

浪費讀者時間是犯罪!


 

Kenneth Woo
China
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
TOPIC STARTER
還說一個 Sep 9, 2014

早先不是說律師行嗎?為何現在偏偏說什麼律師事務所,又臭又長。

 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 19:35
Chinese to English
+ ...
比比皆是 Sep 9, 2014

Kenny,

这种中文语言上需要修正的地方想来比比皆是。 我之所以说“想来”,主要是没有耐心、也没有愿望去看那些蹩脚文字。

顺便提一下,我觉得 sex 这里译成 “性生活” 比较笼统概括些,或者可说是 “性关系”。 当然还要看上下文而定。


[Edited at 2014-09-09 22:37 GMT]


 

J.H. Wang
China
Local time: 08:35
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
My two cents Sep 9, 2014

Kenneth Woo wrote:

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?



Office 的确有多种含义,比如办公室、办事处、政府机关、部门等。不过,对于 for this reason,我觉得还是翻译成“因为这个原因/理由”更严谨些。

[Edited at 2014-09-09 15:14 GMT]


 

Phil Hand  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 08:35
Chinese to English
支持 Sep 10, 2014

译稿应该用简洁清晰易读的风格。

唯一不太同意的是:
Kenneth Woo wrote:

早先不是說律師行嗎?為何現在偏偏說什麼律師事務所,又臭又長。

因为大陆的普遍说法好像就是律师事务所。可以嫌它长,但还是得遵循人家的语言习惯。


 

Sophie Cheung  Identity Verified
Hong Kong
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
+ ...
agree Sep 10, 2014

正正是歐化中文的最佳例子。



Kenneth Woo wrote:

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?




 

deleted. (X)
Australia
Local time: 21:35
English to Chinese
+ ...
David Copperfield (译者不详) Sep 10, 2014

Sophie Cheung wrote:

正正是歐化中文的最佳例子。



Kenneth Woo wrote:

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?




要看具体语境。在以下译文中,译者的处理方式是对的,不能用“就是因此”。

When Mr. and Miss Murdstone were at home, I took my meals with them; in their absence, I ate and drank by myself. At all times I lounged about the house and neighbourhood quite disregarded, except that they were jealous of my making any friends: thinking, perhaps, that if I did, I might complain to someone. For this reason, though Mr. Chillip often asked me to go and see him (he was a widower, having, some years before that, lost a little small light-haired wife, whom I can just remember connecting in my own thoughts with a pale tortoise-shell cat), it was but seldom that I enjoyed the happiness of passing an afternoon in his closet of a surgery; reading some book that was new to me, with the smell of the whole Pharmacopoeia coming up my nose, or pounding something in a mortar under his mild directions.

默德斯通先生和小姐在家时,我和他们一起吃饭,他们不在时,我就自餐自饮。我可以随意在住宅附近走来走去,他们只是妒忌我结交什么朋友,也许他们认为,我交了什么朋友就会对这人诉苦了。为了这原因,尽管齐力普先生常请我去看他(他是个鳏夫,他那位娇小而长着浅色头发的太太在几年前就去世了;在我想来,他太太总和一只灰蒙蒙的三色猫联系在一起),让我在他那外科诊室里过一个下午,读我从没读过而发出药香的一些书,或在他温和的指导下在一个药钵里擂捣点什么,我还是很少有这份幸福的享受。


 

Sophie Cheung  Identity Verified
Hong Kong
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
+ ...
就是 因此 Sep 10, 2014

我同意你舉的例子。每篇翻譯都有不同的難題,譯者要看整體文章作判斷。
但是,我猜Kenneth指的是 「for this reason 就是 『因此』」,而不是「就是因此」。:)

如有錯誤,請更正。

Kenneth Woo wrote:

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?


[/quote]

要看具体语境。在以下译文中,译者的处理方式是对的,不能用“就是因此”。

When Mr. and Miss Murdstone were at home, I took my meals with them; in their absence, I ate and drank by myself. At all times I lounged about the house and neighbourhood quite disregarded, except that they were jealous of my making any friends: thinking, perhaps, that if I did, I might complain to someone. For this reason, though Mr. Chillip often asked me to go and see him (he was a widower, having, some years before that, lost a little small light-haired wife, whom I can just remember connecting in my own thoughts with a pale tortoise-shell cat), it was but seldom that I enjoyed the happiness of passing an afternoon in his closet of a surgery; reading some book that was new to me, with the smell of the whole Pharmacopoeia coming up my nose, or pounding something in a mortar under his mild directions.

默德斯通先生和小姐在家时,我和他们一起吃饭,他们不在时,我就自餐自饮。我可以随意在住宅附近走来走去,他们只是妒忌我结交什么朋友,也许他们认为,我交了什么朋友就会对这人诉苦了。为了这原因,尽管齐力普先生常请我去看他(他是个鳏夫,他那位娇小而长着浅色头发的太太在几年前就去世了;在我想来,他太太总和一只灰蒙蒙的三色猫联系在一起),让我在他那外科诊室里过一个下午,读我从没读过而发出药香的一些书,或在他温和的指导下在一个药钵里擂捣点什么,我还是很少有这份幸福的享受。
[/quote]


 

J.H. Wang
China
Local time: 08:35
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
很是赞成 Sep 10, 2014

Kenneth Woo wrote:


還有這個 make sure, 不必每次都譯成確保,譯成務請、務必、保(to make sure:為保)也可以嘛。




语言的表达要丰富多样,否则读起来会觉得干瘪、乏味。


 

J.H. Wang
China
Local time: 08:35
Member (2007)
English to Chinese
+ ...
当然,也不能为简洁而简洁 Sep 10, 2014

在具体的语言运用中,要以能够准确、充分、清晰地表达意思为标准。需要达到何种程度的简洁性要视具体情况而定。

[Edited at 2014-09-10 10:41 GMT]


 

jyuan_us  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:35
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
具體單詞是否簡潔無所謂 Sep 10, 2014

一致就可以了,多一個字少一個字每沒什麼區別, 但是,如果連續寫80個字沒有標點,就屬於不簡潔了。

 

jyuan_us  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:35
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
嘎嘎 Sep 10, 2014

Sophie Cheung wrote:

但是,我猜Kenneth指的是 「for this reason 就是 『因此』」,而不是「就是因此」。:)

[/quote]

你猜的應該不對,KEN的意思是「for this reason 就是 『因此』」。


 

Marvin Sun  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
同意 Sep 10, 2014

Phil Hand wrote:

唯一不太同意的是:
Kenneth Woo wrote:

早先不是說律師行嗎?為何現在偏偏說什麼律師事務所,又臭又長。

因为大陆的普遍说法好像就是律师事务所。可以嫌它长,但还是得遵循人家的语言习惯。


翻译不能改变目标语的使用习惯。就像“晒太阳”,不能因为这个目标语不合语法就去改正,这估计属于汉语言学家该干的事,翻译干了,就有越俎代庖之嫌。

“事务所”这种称呼,猜测可能是从日语里直接借用过来的。


 

jyuan_us  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 20:35
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
律師行/律師楼应该都是香港的用法 Sep 10, 2014

Kenneth Woo wrote:

早先不是說律師行嗎?為何現在偏偏說什麼律師事務所,又臭又長。


美国的華人社區和大陸,应该一直以来都叫律師事務所的而且这可能是司法局的強制性規定。


 

Kenneth Woo
China
Local time: 08:35
English to Chinese
TOPIC STARTER
近日煩躁,出言或有得罪諸位之處,請多包涵。 Sep 10, 2014

顺便提一下,我觉得 sex 这里译成 “性生活” 比较笼统概括些,或者可说是 “性关系”。 当然还要看上下文而定。


前輩所言不無道理。倘文章所論為愛滋病傳播途徑,「男女性交」或較「性生活」、「性關係」為宜。

Office 的确有多种含义,比如办公室、办事处、政府机关、部门等。不过,对于 for this reason,我觉得还是翻译成“因为这个原因/理由”更严谨些。


恕某不敢苟同。依愚之見,二者除字數而外,並無區別。


說到「律師行」、「律師事務所」二詞,我認為在大陸地區,兩者通行。除非司法部有明令要求律師行用「律師事務所」一詞命名,否則,譯者翻譯外國律師行之名,以「律師行」名之亦未嘗不可。

for this reason 就是因此,為什麼要說成因為這個原因?

因我一時懶惰未加引號,讓he li 會錯意思,抱歉。我的本意是「for this reason」義即「因此」,不必說成「因為這個原因」。


 
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