Pages in topic:   [1 2 3] >
翻译技巧讨论-有时代背景的口号 Translation techniques involving slogans with specific cultural background
Thread poster: Shaunna
Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
Apr 3, 2007

在KudoZ一个问题里,再次看到一个比较普遍的问题--是更终于原文好还是更流畅好(信与雅的问题?),而这里因为涉及有时代背景的口号,问题就更加突出。
KudoZ 链接: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1851894#answ_4217816
作为起步不久的译者,我一直觉得忠实原文与理解发挥之间的平衡很难掌握,想借此机会听听大家都怎么看,如果碰到你会怎样处理?希望讨论一下大家得益。
--
不知在这里讨论KudoZ问题是否合适,希望KudoZ里参与那个问题的同仁都不会见怪,我会一一请他们过来谈谈看法。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

franksf
Chinese to English
给Shaunna捧场 Apr 3, 2007

网上找到 larger than life 的人的话,抄一下交卷:
"凡是翻译的人,必须通晓两种文学,不过通法有所不同,它对外国文的知识,必须是批评的(critical),而对本国人的知识,就必须是实用的(practical)。"
http://www.dreamkidland.com/sfhk/2005-08/jiqiao.htm


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
Good topic for discussion Apr 3, 2007

Shaunna wrote:

在KudoZ一个问题里,再次看到一个比较普遍的问题--是更终于原文好还是更流畅好(信与雅的问题?),而这里因为涉及有时代背景的口号,问题就更加突出。
KudoZ 链接: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1851894#answ_4217816
作为起步不久的译者,我一直觉得忠实原文与理解发挥之间的平衡很难掌握,想借此机会听听大家都怎么看,如果碰到你会怎样处理?希望讨论一下大家得益。


I actually prefer what Ozethai suggested. Not only does it correspond to the original Chinese quite well, but it also reads fluently in English.

"emancipate the mind" gets a lot of hits on the web. But I think it is mostly found in Chinese publications where the translation has been popularized. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But IMO, "break from traditional thinking" would be more understandable to an English-speaking crowd, and also communicate the same message.

For that matter, I think "liberate one's mind/thinking" as pk suggested would be more idiomatic than "emancipate the mind". I also think the word "pragmatic" is a good choice.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q="break%20from%20traditional%20thinking"&btnG=Search



[Edited at 2007-04-03 17:23]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Wenjer Leuschel  Identity Verified
Taiwan
Local time: 12:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
两人的翻译皆可,不过.... Apr 3, 2007

Shaunna wrote:

在KudoZ一个问题里,再次看到一个比较普遍的问题--是更忠于原文好还是更流畅好(信与雅的问题?),而这里因为涉及有时代背景的口号,问题就更加突出。
KudoZ 链接: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1851894#answ_4217816


Huijun Suo 和 Ozethai 两人的翻译都可以,不过若让一位没有读过有关中国文化方面书籍的英语母语者阅读那两种说法,他会立即明白 Oze 那个说法所指为何,对于 Huijun 的那个说法则会先愣一下,然后才明白意思。为什么呢?

我曾把鹿桥《人子》里的故事〈皮相〉翻译成德文,德国朋友读懂我的翻译,也觉得有趣,但最后还是帮我修改成地道的德文,只是内涵已经不再是鹿桥《人子》里的那篇故事,有了小小的改变,不只是文风的改变。

Huijun 和 Oze 翻译的那句话,却只是文风不同,内涵并无多大改变。经常接触中国信息的编辑,为了要保留中国文化的风味,反倒非常可能选择 Huijun 的翻译,而不选择 Oze 的翻译。

这样的选择真的叫做“见仁见智”,没有对错的问题,只是选择。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Shang
China
Local time: 12:49
English to Chinese
在准确表达原意的情况下,力求通顺流畅 Apr 3, 2007

汉语和英语的语法结构相去甚远,绝大多数情况下不可能照顾到原文的句子结构,否则读起来很别扭,甚至令人费解。在理解原文的基础上,用流畅的汉语/英语表达出来,这才是好的翻译。如果照字面翻译,读者要琢磨半天才弄得明白你究竟在说什么,这是最糟糕的翻译。从忠实于原文,到准确+流畅,这是每个译员都要经历的过程。

至于说口号,我认为汉语里的口号大多空洞无味,你不知道它要表达什么意思,英语里很可能没有对应的陈词滥调,或者很少用类似的说法。在这种情况下,要请客户解释清楚,然后用最简洁的短语表达出来。通常不能照搬词典里的“翻译”,要使用更具体的表述。


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Huijun Suo  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 12:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
当前还是各取所需。 Apr 3, 2007

虽然说我在英文报刊上见到的以直译居多,但是看到巧妙的意译总会让我眼前一亮。就拿这句话来说吧:解放思想、实事求是,随着时代的发展,随着英语的全民普及,估计会有越来越多的人看不惯专家们的直译:emancipate the mind and seek truth from facts. 革命味道太浓了,我想未来的小资和老资们是不会喜欢这种硝烟弥漫的味道的。所以,seek the truth with an open mind 我也很喜欢,甚至觉得应该鼓励,相信这是未来发展的方向。大陆虽然缺乏地道的英语环境,但大陆译者也应该解放思想,不能闭门造车,以往的教训实在是太多了。

Direct link Reply with quote
 
Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
见仁见智 Apr 3, 2007

Wenjer Leuschel wrote:
Huijun Suo 和 Ozethai 两人的翻译都可以,不过若让一位没有读过有关中国文化方面书籍的英语母语者阅读那两种说法,他会立即明白 Oze 那个说法所指为何,对于 Huijun 的那个说法则会先愣一下,然后才明白意思。为什么呢?
。。。
这样的选择真的叫做“见仁见智”,没有对错的问题,只是选择。


嗯。我也知道各种翻译都有道理,更多是个人风格和喜好不同。是想看看大家一般都偏向哪种处理。
我是想,象解放思想这样的口号,就是中文,刚提出来时也是一个很硬的词,风格鲜明。译成英文不应该太圆熟,而应对其时代背景有所反映。
但是,想让不了解中国文化的人感受到隐含有文化背景的意味,大概是要求太高了。

wherestip wrote:

"emancipate the mind" gets a lot of hits on the web. But I think it is mostly found in Chinese publications where the translation has been popularized.


------ 还有,岔岔题儿 ------
对一些被广泛采用的翻译名词如果大家觉得有问题会力图改之吗?不光是因为这个解放思想,我还想起来Fang Sheng (是你吧?)早先问青藏高速的问题。

[Edited at 2007-04-03 18:25]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
isahuang
Local time: 23:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
IMO Apr 3, 2007

Shaunna wrote:

在KudoZ一个问题里,再次看到一个比较普遍的问题--是更终于原文好还是更流畅好(信与雅的问题?),而这里因为涉及有时代背景的口号,问题就更加突出。
KudoZ 链接: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1851894#answ_4217816
作为起步不久的译者,我一直觉得忠实原文与理解发挥之间的平衡很难掌握,想借此机会听听大家都怎么看,如果碰到你会怎样处理?希望讨论一下大家得益。
--
不知在这里讨论KudoZ问题是否合适,希望KudoZ里参与那个问题的同仁都不会见怪,我会一一请他们过来谈谈看法。


I wanted to post similiar topics for discussion but hadn't found time to do so, you beat me. Shaunna.

IMO translators should always keep in mind that who the target audience is. 忠实原文 doesn't mean to do a literal translation. Translators are supposed to convey the meaning rather than just translate the text word for word. For the question in the link, I would go for Ozethai's or PK's interpretation. They would make more sense to native English speakers.

Another problem I found in C to E translation is a lot of translators rely too much on dictionary translation. But some of those translations just won't fit into the context.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
Objective of Translation Apr 3, 2007

Shaunna wrote:

------ 还有,岔岔题儿 ------
对一些被广泛采用的翻译名词如果大家觉得有问题会力图改之吗?不光是因为这个解放思想,我还想起来Fang Sheng (是你吧?)早先问青藏高速的问题。



Shaunna,

Of course I can only speak for myself and express my own opinion on this.

IMO the main objective of translation is for people of different nationalities and cultures to exchange ideas and communicate with each other. I would suggest basing one's decision mostly towards that end.

Take "emancipate the mind" for example. The first thing I would ask myself is "would most English-speaking people understand what this is referring to in the context?" If there were any doubt, I myself wouldn't hesitate to rephrase it into something more idiomatic and understandable.

But like I said, this is only my opinion. Some people may prefer more literal translations. The danger of being too literal though, IMO, is not getting the ideas across, leaving the audience confused, and therefore failing the main objective of translation.

IMO this is a common mistake. Some of the more severe cases sometimes end up being material for jokes... of course, I'm not referring to this instance.



[Edited at 2007-04-03 19:14]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

pkchan  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:49
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
統一口徑,還是百花齊放 Apr 3, 2007

中共中央是這樣譯

Emancipate the mind and seek truth from facts; do not stick to old ways and make no progress. 2. Combine theory with practice; do not copy mechanically or ...
english.cpc.people.com.cn/66739/4496615.html - 146k - Cached - Similar pages

穿解放裝,還是穿西裝, 兩樣都好看。


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
Too Literal Apr 3, 2007

Yes, I agree with Tingting about being too literal. Like I said, I think it is a common mistake and should be avoided.

Direct link Reply with quote
 
Shaunna  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:49
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
translation- get the meaning across Apr 3, 2007

Tingting and Steve-- Very good points there.

Tingting Huang wrote:

Another problem I found in C to E translation is a lot of translators rely too much on dictionary translation. But some of those translations just won't fit into the context.


I saw this problem too, not only in translation.
I always try to check the usage of words I am not familiar with by searching for sentences with similar context.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
Apr 3, 2007



[Edited at 2007-04-03 23:52]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
A reference Apr 3, 2007

Actually, I'm not sure myself whether "emancipate the mind" is understandable to most people. The thing is you hardly ever hear the word "emancipate" or "emancipation" used that way by anyone.

But here's a reference FWIW:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Emancipation



[Edited at 2007-04-03 23:56]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

wherestip  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:49
Chinese to English
+ ...
This reference indicates that the usage is correct :-) Apr 3, 2007

http://www.brainyquote.com/words/em/emancipation159166.html



Emancipation

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The act of setting free from the power of another, from slavery, subjection, dependence, or controlling influence; also, the state of being thus set free; liberation; as, the emancipation of slaves; the emancipation of minors; the emancipation of a person from prejudices; the emancipation of the mind from superstition; the emancipation of a nation from tyranny or subjection.



~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*

p.s., But still if you look at all the famous quotes in the link, none of them use it in the sense of 解放思想

I still don't think it's very good English. But that's just me



[Edited at 2007-04-03 23:19]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2 3] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

翻译技巧讨论-有时代背景的口号 Translation techniques involving slogans with specific cultural background

Advanced search






TM-Town
Manage your TMs and Terms ... and boost your translation business

Are you ready for something fresh in the industry? TM-Town is a unique new site for you -- the freelance translator -- to store, manage and share translation memories (TMs) and glossaries...and potentially meet new clients on the basis of your prior work.

More info »
memoQ translator pro
Kilgray's memoQ is the world's fastest developing integrated localization & translation environment rendering you more productive and efficient.

With our advanced file filters, unlimited language and advanced file support, memoQ translator pro has been designed for translators and reviewers who work on their own, with other translators or in team-based translation projects.

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search