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DVX3 - why do I need to do formatting???
Thread poster: NatM
NatM
Germany
Local time: 05:33
English to German
+ ...
Feb 12, 2015

Dear All

I have been working with DVX3 for about a week now and I have to say that I am not happy at all...
Not many good new features for such an amount of money.

Plus:
What I appreciated the most in DVX was that I didn't have to bother about formatting thanks to the embeded codes.
I just placed the codes at the right positions with the press of a key - and that was it!
I am now working on a long Excel spreadsheet with many segments which are in bold in the source text. Now, when I start typing, my text is not bold and I have to reformat it. Why is that??? It means a lot more work and a potential source of errors.
Why is there both in DVX3 - embedded codes plus the need for additional formatting at some points???
Definitely NO improvement IMHO.


Are there any settings to prevent this additional need for formatting?


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Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 06:33
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
you can use old filters Feb 12, 2015

Office like formatting was requested by users (and used by some other CAT tools), that is why Atril implemented it.

But if you are not happy with them you can still use the old filters, e.g. Excel filter to import Excel files instead of the Office Live filter.

I don't think it is difficult to select a word and use Ctrl+B shortcut but we all have different preferences.


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NatM
Germany
Local time: 05:33
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks Selcuk Feb 13, 2015

Ok, I'll try that.

"I don't think it is difficult to select a word and use Ctrl+B shortcut but we all have different preferences."
- You are right, it is of course ok to select an entire segment and press CTRL+B.
But in other cases... In my current project, there are for example many segments with several words in which only the first letter in each word is underlined. In such cases, it is much easier (from my point of view) to place the codes at the respective positions by pressing F8 than to highlight a letter, press CTRL+U, highlight the next one, press CTRL+U, and so on...


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Wojciech_
Poland
Local time: 05:33
English to Polish
+ ...
Regarding WYSIWYG Feb 13, 2015

Unfortunately DVX3 doesn't adjust formatting of the target text to formatting of the source text. Even Wordfast Classic does it.

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Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 06:33
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
examples please Feb 13, 2015

pro-lingua wrote:

Unfortunately DVX3 doesn't adjust formatting of the target text to formatting of the source text. Even Wordfast Classic does it.


In normal translation stage, assembly, or pre-translation?
If you can add images it will be appreciated.

Selcuk


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Wojciech_
Poland
Local time: 05:33
English to Polish
+ ...
Well... Feb 13, 2015

Do you mean this?

Deja Vu
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7aaxvrdtyev3ywy/Clipboard01.bmp?dl=0

Wordfast
https://www.dropbox.com/s/t5cyqptfjsxk5ra/Clipboard02.bmp?dl=0

As you can see, unless you pretranslate the whole file in Deja Vu, you need to manually set formatting for each segment. In WF Classic if a segment is underlined or bolded, the source segment is preformatted accordingly, ie.
I don't have access now to Trados and MemoQ, but I know for sure that they also adjust formatting to source segment.
Seems like a small thing, but with lots of formatting changes within a document, it can save you a lot of time.


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Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 06:33
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
same font Feb 14, 2015

In DVX3, do you use the same font for source and target? I asked this because some people set a different font, or bold instead of regular.

Selcuk


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Wojciech_
Poland
Local time: 05:33
English to Polish
+ ...
Nope Feb 15, 2015

Actually I work in Wordfast, but I was thinking of getting DVX3.
I meant to show in the screens that DVX3 doesn't, by default, adjust formatting of TT to ST. You need to do it manually (yeah, I know: CTRL+B - how laborous is that? But over time you start liking CATs that can do it automatically). This may take considerable amount of time, especially if you translate a text where there are lots of formatting changes from segment to segment.
That's it.


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Epameinondas Soufleros  Identity Verified
Greece
Local time: 06:33
Member (2008)
English to Greek
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Paragraph formatting vs inline formatting Feb 16, 2015

What pro-lingua means is this:

When DVX3 sees a source segment entirely formatted in bold, then bold is not 'pre-selected' for the target segment. So, when you start typing in the corresponding target segment you don't see the text in bold and you have to do one of the following:

  • select the text after you type it and hit Ctrl+B

  • hit Ctrl+B before you start typing



The best solution in most cases is the one implemented in memoQ: If an entire segment is in bold, then the target will appear in bold, too. DVX3 should follow suit, but also make this behaviour optional.

As a side note, is it really necessary to have to select the desired font four times (source language primary, source language secondary, target language primary, target language secondary)? There are use cases for this, for sure, but for the vast majority, I think, this is just a pain. There should be one drop-down list for selecting a font and some check boxes for ‘advanced’ settings. Something like “Use different fonts for source and target” and “Use different fonts in the grid and in the AutoSearch pane”.


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Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 06:33
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
hear, hear Feb 16, 2015

Epameinondas Soufleros wrote:

As a side note, is it really necessary to have to select the desired font four times (source language primary, source language secondary, target language primary, target language secondary)? There are use cases for this, for sure, but for the vast majority, I think, this is just a pain. There should be one drop-down list for selecting a font and some check boxes for ‘advanced’ settings. Something like “Use different fonts for source and target” and “Use different fonts in the grid and in the AutoSearch pane”.


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David Turner  Identity Verified
Local time: 05:33
French to English
+ ...
I'd say that must be... Feb 16, 2015

I am now working on a long Excel spreadsheet with many segments which are in bold in the source text. Now, when I start typing, my text is not bold and I have to reformat it. Why is that???


...some sort of oversight (or bug). If you have an all bold segment and press ctrl+T (assemble), the segment is indeed assembled in all bold. Same for pretranslate. I can't see any advantage in it being otherwise if you just start typing in the empty target segment.


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Martin Janda  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 05:33
Member (2003)
English to Czech
Why would you do that? Feb 16, 2015

I've been using DV(X) for over ten years, but I have never ever set any desired fonts. DVX exports your translation in the very same font as the source file, that's all you need to make your client happy.

The desired font option is just for you - it you think the default DVX font is ugly, you can select a different one but this applies to the grid only, not the final file.



Epameinondas Soufleros wrote:

As a side note, is it really necessary to have to select the desired font four times (source language primary, source language secondary, target language primary, target language secondary)? There are use cases for this, for sure, but for the vast majority, I think, this is just a pain. There should be one drop-down list for selecting a font and some check boxes for ‘advanced’ settings. Something like “Use different fonts for source and target” and “Use different fonts in the grid and in the AutoSearch pane”.


[/quote]


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Epameinondas Soufleros  Identity Verified
Greece
Local time: 06:33
Member (2008)
English to Greek
+ ...
There are reasons Feb 16, 2015

Martin Janda wrote:

I've been using DV(X) for over ten years, but I have never ever set any desired fonts. DVX exports your translation in the very same font as the source file, that's all you need to make your client happy.

The desired font option is just for you - it you think the default DVX font is ugly, you can select a different one but this applies to the grid only, not the final file.



Epameinondas Soufleros wrote:

As a side note, is it really necessary to have to select the desired font four times (source language primary, source language secondary, target language primary, target language secondary)? There are use cases for this, for sure, but for the vast majority, I think, this is just a pain. There should be one drop-down list for selecting a font and some check boxes for ‘advanced’ settings. Something like “Use different fonts for source and target” and “Use different fonts in the grid and in the AutoSearch pane”.





One reason is that I can't work with a tiny Tahoma font. Another reason is that I like to switch to a different font when I'm revising my work, so that I get a feeling that I'm reading a 'fresh' text (try it!). A third reason—the most important one, perhaps—is that one might want to use Arial Unicode or another font like that for a script that does not display correctly when using Tahoma.

It doesn't matter if this setting does not affect the exported file. It's the grid I'm working in, and this is where I want to see what I want to see.

To take this a step further, it would be nice to also include the ability to use alternating row colours in the grid. This is a feature of memoQ that I have always used and I find it particularly helpful. Not aesthetically pleasing, but helpful; it helps to focus your attention on a single row, instead of getting lost in a sea of white.

[Edited at 2015-02-16 17:34 GMT]


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Selcuk Akyuz  Identity Verified
Turkey
Local time: 06:33
Member (2006)
English to Turkish
+ ...
orange border Feb 17, 2015

Epameinondas Soufleros wrote:

To take this a step further, it would be nice to also include the ability to use alternating row colours in the grid. This is a feature of memoQ that I have always used and I find it particularly helpful. Not aesthetically pleasing, but helpful; it helps to focus your attention on a single row, instead of getting lost in a sea of white.


Alternating row colours or the orange borderline? I remember there was an orange borderline in memoQ indicating the active segment and it was very useful. It was requested for DVX many years ago, even before memoQ implemented it. But unfortunately we could not see it in DVX2 or X3.


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