Provisions to deal with over-smart translators.
Thread poster: jelly_gill

jelly_gill  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2006)
English to Panjabi
+ ...
Apr 24, 2013

Dear All,

I have been an active follower of Kudoz in English-Hindi and English-Punjabi pairs since last 7-8 years. About 1 year ago a new translator became Proz.com member and suddenly jumped to a prominent position based upon points earned in Kudoz.

Recently I got suspicious about this so called translator and I searched the profiles of askers who were blindly choosing this translator's answers as most helpful. I got very strong evidence that profiles of askers were fake profiles.

This translator used to ask questions using these fake profiles for two reasons:

1. When he himself is not sure how to translate a difficult term, he would post this as a question in Kudoz to get opinion from other professional translators. He would not do so using his own profile because doing this would undermine the credibility expressed in his profile tag which said that he was highly educated and official translator for the government. When he used to select answer given by other translator, he would usually give him just 2 or 3 points.

2. Second reason was to ask questions using fake profiles and give answers using his real profile. Then he would select his own answer as most helpful and pave the way to give himself 4 points no matter how rubbish answer he gave.

The matter was reported to Proz.com and I am relieved that all his fake profiles are gone now and he has also lost all the fake points earned and his ranking has reached the level he deserved.


I would ask all fellow translators to be vigilant for such type of pseudo professionals and report any suspicious activity to Proz.com Support Team.


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Balasubramaniam L.  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
+ ...
A very curious and interesting case Apr 24, 2013

I was aware the kudoz is misused a lot, but had never thought that this level of ingenuity would be used to subvert the system.

I am glad that you raised the alarm at the right time and the proz.com staff were able to undo some of the damage.

Yes, we need to be very careful in grading kudoz answers. We should do this will full honesty and with the sole view of helping the asker and to find the most suitable solution to the translation question raised.

Kudoz points are used to decide the pecking order of translators which is why new translators fall into the temptation to subvert the system and earn some quick points. But in the long run this is counter-productive as any analysis of the kudoz answers provided by the translator will immediately reveal where the translator actually stands which will be to the detriment of his reputation and career.


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devendrakr  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2011)
English to Hindi
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Whistle Blower's Job Apr 24, 2013

I am not so much aware of such miss-happenings. But, it is true that there are lot of scrupulous persons always present. Such persons always try to milch the opportunities by hook or by crook. But hats off to Mr. Jelly who have done a whistle blower's job and unearthed such a racketeer. At the long run only quality work prevails, but very few have patience for it. Most of us aspire for short term gains. And this lure is causing the damage to this noble profession also.

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Lalit Sati  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2010)
English to Hindi
+ ...
जैली भाई को साधुवाद Apr 24, 2013

इससे पहले कपिल स्वामी जी ने भी "कई प्रोफ़ाइल रखने का अजब खेल" (http://www.proz.com/forum/hindi/245315-कई_प्रोफ़ाइल_रखने_का_अजब_खेल.html) नामक पोस्ट में इसी तरह के कुछ महत्वपूर्ण बिंदुओं पर प्रकाश डाला था। लेकिन वह चर्चा हिंदी में होने के कारण कई अनुवादक साथियों तक अपनी पहुंच नहीं बना पाई थी।

जैली भाई को साधुवाद कि उन्होंने इस महत्वपूर्ण मु्द्दे पर प्रकाश डाला।


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jelly_gill  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2006)
English to Panjabi
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Re: Lalit Bhai Apr 24, 2013

Lalit Bhai,

It was you who made me think like this when you wrote in Kudoz that "विनोद जी, कुछ प्रश्न बंद होने पर कई प्रश्न खड़े कर जाते हैं।"

I followed that lead and see where I have reached.

Question asker's profile is no longer available now and the question has become 'open' again.

My suggestion is "Never take anyone at face value even if he/she says I am PhD in Hindi". Judge him/her by the quality of Hindi he/she writes in Kudoz.

Regards,

[Edited at 2013-04-24 05:55 GMT]

[Edited at 2013-04-24 06:44 GMT]


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Ashutosh Mitra  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2011)
English to Hindi
+ ...
जेली, ललित और बाला भाई... Apr 24, 2013

सबसे पहले Jelly_gill को हार्दिक धन्यवाद!

ललित भाई! आपने सही फरमाया जब कपिल जी ने यह बात फोरम में उठाई थी तो मैने यह सोच कर उसमें लिखा था कि प्रोज़ के पास ऐसा तरीका होगा जो ऐसे नटवरलालों को पकड़ लेगा...लेकिन जेली भाई के प्रयास से ही यह संभव हो सका और ऐसा करने वालों को आगे के लिये सबक भी मिल गया...

और बाला भाई के इस कथन से मैं पूरी तरह सहमत हूँ कि...

"Kudoz points are used to decide the pecking order of translators which is why new translators fall into the temptation to subvert the system and earn some quick points. But in the long run this is counter-productive as any analysis of the kudoz answers provided by the translator will immediately reveal where the translator actually stands which will be to the detriment of his reputation and career."



[Edited at 2013-04-24 07:17 GMT]


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jelly_gill  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2006)
English to Panjabi
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TOPIC STARTER
Some Indications of Fake Profiles Apr 24, 2013

I would like to share my experience of how you can identify a fake profile from a real one.

1. In a fake profile, the 'translator' would say he has been working for so many clients since so many years but there would be no WWA entry in his/her profile. Such so called experts ask lot of questions but almost never give any answer to a kudoz question because doing so would split their kudoz points between two profiles they are maintaining.

2. Fake translator would be 'expert' in more than one language pairs. I found a profile in the name of "RN Gupta" (now no longer available) who said he had got his degree from Dublin City University and was an expert in Marathi/Hindi/Punjabi.

3. Such experts normally select the best answer themselves and don't leave it to net peer agreement if it is not going in their real profile's favor. I found that hard way when a profile created in the name of "Deepak Shukla" (now no longer available) selected an utterly non-sense answer given by a so called certified govt translator.

4. A real translator would always provide his/her mobile number/email ID in his/her profile so that clients can contact him/her but in fake profiles such information is missing because if a client contacts a man named "RN Gupta" on his mobile and gives him a job, "RN Gupta" would be unable to provide a bank account and PAN Card in his own name when the clients asks for it for payment purposes.

I would like to ask other translators to share their inputs about identifying fake profiles.


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Lalit Sati  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2010)
English to Hindi
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अनैतिक फर्जी प्रोफ़ाइलबाजी Mar 12, 2015

छद्म प्रोफ़ाइल बनाकर उछलकूद करने वाले बीच-बीच में प्रकट होते रहते हैं। मन खिन्न हो जाता है। साफ दिखाई देता है कि यह फर्जी प्रोफ़ाइल है और किसका है यह भी दिखाई पड़ता है। अनुवाद प्रतियोगिता जीतने या कुछ कुडोज़ अंक हासिल करने के लिए ऐसा कृत्य न केवल क्षुद्रता का परिचायक है, बल्कि पूरे परिवेश को ख़राब कर रहा होता है। आभासी जगत के उस परिवेश को गंदा कर रहा होता है, जिससे तमाम सक्रिय अनुवादक जुड़े रहते हैं।

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Ashutosh Mitra  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 22:28
Member (2011)
English to Hindi
+ ...
परिवेश की चिंता? Mar 12, 2015

ललित भाई/बाला भाई/जेली भाई,
छद्म प्रोफाइल, आउटसोर्सिंग के लिए धन्यवाद और ग्रुप बनाकर मठधीषी करने वाले 'परिवेश' और 'गंदगी' जैसे शब्दों से अनभिज्ञ होते हैं और उनके लिए अनुवाद...शब्द संख्या का एक भाषा से दूसरी भाषा में परिवर्तन मात्र है। सो उनको यह सारी हरकतें..एक प्रतिस्पर्धी, पेशेवर अनुवादक गुण के गुण समझ आते हैं। इसीलिए वो ऐसे पटाखो की रोशनी सरीखे होते हैं जिनका बारूद शीघ्र सेवानिवृत्त हो जाता है। ऐसे डेढ़ समझदार आते रहे हैं और आते रहेंगे। मन तो वाकई खिन्न होता है लेकिन आभासी दुनिया में काम करने का यह एक सबसे बड़ा दुर्गुण हैं कि आप जितने चाहें उतनी तरह से खुद को पेश करिए।

कुडोज़ में ऐसे उत्तर और तर्क सामने आते हैं (कई बार) कि अब कितनी ही बार उधर जाने की इच्छा ही नहीं होती है।

तो पंचो...किसी ने सही ही कहा है... "रहिमन इस संसार में भांति-भांति के लोग, कुछ तो.... कुछ बहुतै..."

सादर.


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