Pages in topic:   [1 2] >
Question about Hungarian surname pronunciation:
Thread poster: xxxLeliel
xxxLeliel
English
Nov 7, 2007

I'm making a text to speech system of Hungarian.

I already know the basic pronunciation rule of Hungarian.
But I find that the spelling of Hungarian surname is not as regular as common words.
Where can I find some pronunciation rule or pronunciation dictionary of surname?

Thanks for any help

[Edited at 2007-11-07 04:12]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Csaba Ban  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 13:26
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
some guidance Nov 7, 2007

"cz" is generally pronounced as "c"
"ch" is mostly "cs" (Kovách, Cholnoky), although in names of German origin it will pronounced as a "ch" in German (Schleicher)
"y" is pronounced as "i" (unless it's part of "gy", "ly", "ny" or "ty")
"ew" (very rare) is pronounced as "ő"
"h" at the end of a name is mute if preceded by a consonant (Horváth, Balogh)
"ss" is usually simply "s" (Kiss, Lámfalussy, Kossuth)
"sch" is the same as in German
"ff" is simply "f" (Istvánffy)
"aá", "eé" and "oó" are simply "á", "é" and "ó", respectively (Baán, Veér, Groó)

Some historical names (incl street names) follow their own "rule", so you have to learn them individually (e.g. Cházár (császár), Dessewffy (dezsőfi), etc.)

There are several names of German and various Slavic origin. Some families adapted the spelling to match pronounciation, some still keep the original spelling, making it more difficult to decipher pronounciation for the casual reader. In addition, there are few Italian, Romanian and French names as well, in which cases the native pronounciation rules apply.

(this post has been edited to accommodate the corrections listed below)

[Edited at 2007-11-07 20:12]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
xxxLeliel
English
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks a lot! Nov 7, 2007

These informations are very useful!

Direct link Reply with quote
 

Péter Tófalvi  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 13:26
English to Hungarian
+ ...
encouragement Nov 7, 2007

You are a very brave (or intelligent?) man.

Csaba wrote: ""y" is pronounced as "i" (unless it's part of "ly", "ny" or "ty")"

The same for "gy".

Keep up the good work!


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Éva Méh  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:26
French to Hungarian
+ ...
Cz = c Nov 7, 2007

Another correction:

"cz" is generally pronounced as "c" (Rácz, Becz...), not "cs"

Good luck


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Csaba Ban  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 13:26
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
thank you for the corrections Nov 7, 2007

Thank you for both corrections, you are absolutely right. I'm especially sorry for "cz". Of course I had "c" in mind, but by the time I actually wrote it down, I made this obvious mistake.

I wrote this early in the morning, I was still half asleep

And once we are it, "tz" is also pronounced as "c" (Rátz)

Csaba


Direct link Reply with quote
 

ViktoriaG  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 07:26
English to French
+ ...
Awesome explanations! Nov 7, 2007

Wow! Csaba gave some pretty good and complete explanations on the subject. The subsequent replies also point out some very handy information.

I just would like to add that the letter Y is not used in Hungarian on its own. Although it is part of the alphabet, it is not a letter on its own. It is used to soften the letter before it. For example, the letter G is usually pronounced as it would be pronounced in the word gone, but in any case where the letter G is followed by the letter Y, it is prononuced as in the word magyar, when pronounced correctly. The letters to which the letter Y is added to soften their pronunciation are the following: G, L, N, T. If you see the letter Y added after any other letter, then it is pronounced as the letter I in Hungarian, which is usually pronnounced as an E in English.

Some interesting trivia: back in times when nobles had control over many things in society (they most importantly owned land which was lent to peasants to grow produce in exchange for part of the produce or money), the letter Y was used to distinguish a noble from a regular citizen. So, Eszterhàzy was a noble, but Eszterhàzi was a simple citizen (the use of the letter Y was picked up to replace a double I - Eszterhàzy may have been Eszterhàzii before). This is why many Hungarian names end with a Y. But be careful before implying that the person whose name ends with a Y is a noble: the noble status is somewhat dated now, and so the use of the letter Y to distinguish nobles from simple citizens using their surnames has been somewhat dropped. So, today, an Eszterhàzy may well be of ordinary descent, and an Eszterhàzi may be of noble descent.

Best of luck with your undertaking, Leliel! Keep up the good work!


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Judith Kiraly  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 04:26
English to Hungarian
Hungarian TTS Nov 7, 2007

Hi there,

Although Hungarian is a so-called phonetic language, there are no rules to apply to all the words.
For names, words from foreign languages, mesuring units, abbreviations you have to built a special "exceptions" dictionary with the phonetic description of these.

All the existing systems are working this way.

Judith


Direct link Reply with quote
 
xxxLeliel
English
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks for the reply Nov 8, 2007

Gourmetcook wrote:

Hi there,

Although Hungarian is a so-called phonetic language, there are no rules to apply to all the words.
For names, words from foreign languages, mesuring units, abbreviations you have to built a special "exceptions" dictionary with the phonetic description of these.

All the existing systems are working this way.

Judith


But I didn't find a reliable phonetic dictionary of Hungarian on internet.

Where can I find one?


Direct link Reply with quote
 
juvera  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:26
English to Hungarian
+ ...
As they say, it is phonetic... Nov 10, 2007

...therefore most words are pronounced in accordance with the general rules, and you are unlikely to find a pronunciation dictionary.

The same doesn't apply to foreign words, but the relevant dictionaries of foreign words and names are more help to Hungarians than to you.

The problem with some Hungarian surnames is that their written form didn't change the same way as the rest of the language; they retain their old forms. The only help I could find is this:

http://vmek.oszk.hu/03300/03311/pdf/ff-1.pdf

On page 54 they list letters found in names written the old-fashion way, and add names to illustrate their pronunciation. There are a few additions to those already mentioned by Csaba.

In the Osiris edition of Helyesírás (Laczkó - Mártonfi, reprinted 2005) you can find the phonetic versions of lots of surnames, but I don't know, if it exists on CD, and certainly cannot be found on the internet. Apart from that, you would have to know the name to look for it in this chunky dic.


Direct link Reply with quote
 
xxxLeliel
English
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks a lot! Nov 12, 2007

The information is very useful.
Better than nothing


Direct link Reply with quote
 
talllion
English
Hungarian surname Feb 23, 2008

I'm trying to find the original spelling of my
ancestors last name. They were from Daruvar.
Here in the U.S. it has been spelled as;
Tehoke
Tichoky
Tihoky

They pronounce it like tee-ho-key.

I believe that it was changed when they arrive but
I'm not sure what it could have been.

Thanks!


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Csaba Ban  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 13:26
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Croatian name, perhaps? Feb 23, 2008

Well, Daruvár is in Slavonia, i.e. the Northern part of Croatia. Even before 1918/20, when Hungary was partitioned, this area was predominantly inhabited by ethnic Croatians. This name "Tihoky" or similar does not resemble any regular Hungarian name.

The word stem "tih-" means "silent" in all Slavic languages, so this may well be a common Croatian name. I think you should repost your question in the Croatian forum, perhaps they can help. And start a new thread rather than post it at the end of an existing one.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

NancyLynn
Canada
Local time: 07:26
Member (2002)
French to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
How about mine, please? Sep 28, 2010

My name, Bogar, is acquired through marriage.

My older kids are reaching the age (8-10) where they're saying things like, "I wish I could speak Hungarian because I'm Hungarian."

A few years ago, when I taught at RMC, one of the young cadets was Hungarian. He informed me the name means bug (I already knew that, and call my kids my snug-bugs) but he added an accent to the a that seemed to go straight up, rather than right like the accent aigu in French. Would this be correct?

Many thanks!

Nancy


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 07:26
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
Bogár - yes, bug Sep 28, 2010

You may want to look around here for pronouncing Hungarian letters:
http://www.magyarora.com/english/shortaudio.html

Hungarian pronunciation is quite simple in the sense that each letter represents one sound, there is only one way to pronounce each letter (that's why we have 44 of them). There are exceptions, mainly in archaic names, but yours is not like that.

I couldn't find a place with a prerecorded soundfile for bogár, but I will tell you on the phone Thursday if you log in a bit early.


The accent on the á can be written straight, or slanted to the right, depending on the handwriting style of the person. In school it is taught to be straight, but right slant is also accepted. There are no left slanted accents in Hungarian, so writing accents that way would not be confusing, however it is considered sloppy (or unconventional).

Katalin

[Edited at 2010-09-28 12:47 GMT]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:

Moderator(s) of this forum
Ildiko Santana[Call to this topic]

You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Question about Hungarian surname pronunciation:

Advanced search






Wordfast Pro
Translation Memory Software for Any Platform

Exclusive discount for ProZ.com users! Save over 13% when purchasing Wordfast Pro through ProZ.com. Wordfast is the world's #1 provider of platform-independent Translation Memory software. Consistently ranked the most user-friendly and highest value

More info »
TM-Town
Manage your TMs and Terms ... and boost your translation business

Are you ready for something fresh in the industry? TM-Town is a unique new site for you -- the freelance translator -- to store, manage and share translation memories (TMs) and glossaries...and potentially meet new clients on the basis of your prior work.

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search