Search Engine Submission
Thread poster: LaraBarnett

LaraBarnett  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:40
Member (2011)
French to English
+ ...
Oct 7, 2012

I have just created my own website, but not through the Proz hosting facility, from another commercial one. On the package that I have taken, I get Search Engine Submissions but not Optimization(SEO), as the cost of this one covered lots of features that I did not need. I was given the option to submit to Dmoz. Being new to this sort of thing and not particularly savvy on owning a website, I found it difficult to submit to exactly the category/sub-category that I wanted. This has gone through and there is not an option for contacting Dmoz for more help on finding a more specific category.

Does anybody know if there are other ways I can improve the search options myself, or even if it is possible to work on SEO individually? Or are there other directories that can be used that I can contact myself to improve my search engine presence? My website is www.lingocraft.co.uk. I would like to try and focus this as much on media/literary/film/general and some business such as marketing/commercial/advertising/promotional and public docs and certificates, which is where most of my knowledge lies. However,I also do voice over, which I will be marketing on a page on this website.

Any help would be more than appreciated. Tx



[Edited at 2012-10-07 11:55 GMT]

[Edited at 2012-10-07 11:56 GMT]

[Edited at 2012-10-07 11:58 GMT]

[Edited at 2012-10-07 11:59 GMT]


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Dominique Pivard  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:40
Finnish to French
Quality and relevance of content Oct 7, 2012

LaraBarnett wrote:
Does anybody know if there are other ways I can improve the search options myself, or even if it is possible to work on SEO individually? Or are there other directories that can be used that I can contact myself to improve my search engine presence? My website is www.lingocraft.co.uk. I would like to try and focus this as much on media/literary/film/general and some business such as marketing/commercial/advertising/promotional and public docs and certificates, which is where most of my knowledge lies. However,I also do voice over, which I will be marketing on a page on this website.

I don't believe in magical tricks that would push a brand-new site to the first page on a Google search. Just add quality content (eg. in the form of a regularly updated blog) that is relevant to what you are doing and Google will eventually take notice.

Google is THE search engine everyone uses precisely for that reason: it can't be "bribed" or tricked into displaying low-quality / non-relevant search results on its top pages.


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LaraBarnett  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:40
Member (2011)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
SEO Oct 7, 2012

I realise that, but if all the other websites use SEO, I would be at a disadvantage if I didn't, seeing that they would be overtaking me regardless of how relevant their site was surely?

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elzbieta jatowt  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 10:40
French to Polish
+ ...
Try this Oct 8, 2012

You can do at first these 4 steps:
1. See http://support.google.com/webmasters/bin/answer.py?hl=en&answer=35291
2. Search-engine-optimization-starter-guide.pdf
3. Do a sitemap in XML format (I think you could do it in your space for Administrator, if not – you can google for it)
4. Go to Google tools for webmasters and submit your sitemap
You can see also http://push2check.com

Sorry for my English.
Franela


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Meta Arkadia
Local time: 16:40
English to Indonesian
+ ...
Not everyone Oct 8, 2012

Dominique Pivard wrote:
Google is THE search engine everyone uses

I for one refuse to use it.
it can't be "bribed" or tricked into displaying low-quality / non-relevant search results on its top pages.

It could be tricked by SEO, and only because the thieves of Mountain View adjusted their algorithms, that effect has diminished. But there will always be other ways to cheat them. Like you can't get rid of viruses.

One way would be to use one of their sites (Blogger, YouTube) as a mirror of your actual site. Just create a "Blogspot" with tags from your site, and refer to it.

I tried the following:
I created a Blogspot and a Wordpress blog, both with the same title (also in the URL), and the same content (both a random sequence of characters, same as in title), at the same time. Within a day, the Blogspot showed up in G, not in Bing. I checked it regularly for about two weeks, and the WordPress blog never showed up in either.

Cheers,

Hans


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Dominique Pivard  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:40
Finnish to French
From the horse's mouth Oct 8, 2012


Yes, very good advice. If someone knows something about the way search engines work, it must be Google.


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Dominique Pivard  Identity Verified
Local time: 11:40
Finnish to French
content quality vs. SEO Oct 8, 2012

LaraBarnett wrote:
I realise that, but if all the other websites use SEO, I would be at a disadvantage if I didn't, seeing that they would be overtaking me regardless of how relevant their site was surely?

This is if you believe a low-quality content SEO:ed site will always win a high-quality content non-SEO:ed site. Read the Google link provided by Franela.


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Neil Coffey  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:40
French to English
+ ...
SEO is largely snake-oil Oct 8, 2012

It depends slightly on what you mean by "SEO". If you mean "tricks to try and fool the search engine", the main beneficiaries of "SEO" are likely to be companies trying to sell you SEO services. The major search engines are wise to silly SEO tricks and at best simply ignore them and at worst remove your site from their database if they think your site is just spam.

If by "SEO" you mean "writing in a generally Internet-savvy way", then there may be a tiny bit of mileage in this. So, things like: prioritisng phrases/vocabulary that Internet users will actually search for and understand (though without being paranoid: search engines understand the concept of synonyms, spelling variations etc), writing content that has a reading age and average page length suitable for your target audience, making your pages link together in a consistent, logical way... basically, anything that you might see as being a "good Internet copy-writing technique" without being a "trick" as such.

So broadly, as others have said, I would initially concentrate far more on trying to produce quality content that other sites will want to link to and reference because your site actually enhances the experience of their sites' users.

Once you have good copy, the major search engines' reporting tools will give you some pointers on how to refine certain things, e.g. if you have titles/keywords that are absent or the wrong length, broken links etc.

If there are relevant search engines that have a good Alexa ranking and which are free to submit to, then by all means go ahead. But it is probably going to be a waste of time and money submitting to hundreds of search engines that barely get any traffic (in other words, offers to "purchase our gold package and we will submit your site to X search engines" are basically a waste of space...).

In general, the vast vast majority of search engine traffic is going to come from the major search engines, which don't really have any "submission" process as such: if you have quality content that is linked to by other sites, they'll pick you up in time.

Things you can do:
- add Google Webmaster Tools to your page and check your page fulfils the basic diagnostics (make sure you have no missing keywords, titles etc)
- link to your page from your ProZ profile, blog etc
- once you have quality content, think about publicising your page briefly with Google Adwords or similar (you're not trying to get all your traffic this way: it's just a way of initially "getting the word out")
- look out for opportunities to mention specific pages of your site that answer specific questions being posed on forums, social bookmarking sites, blogs, mailing lists etc (think about setting up some Google Alerts to spot such opportunities): though note that the idea here is really to raise awareness among a "key" audience who will mention you site to friends, on their blog etc-- it's not that you're trying to get every single hit from such sources


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LaraBarnett  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:40
Member (2011)
French to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Useful Information Oct 8, 2012

Thank you everybody who has responded to my question. I never expected to get such a full and informative response with so many links and ideas. Will go ahead and try all these suggestions.

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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 10:40
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Lara Oct 8, 2012

LaraBarnett wrote:
I have just created my own website. ... On the package that I have taken, I get Search Engine Submissions but not Optimization(SEO).


I think what that means is that the web host will submit your site to a number of search engines, but will not make any effort to optimise your site for optimal positioning in those search engines. I think that SEO (optimisation) of a freelancer's web site should be done by the freelancer himself, or partly by the web designer (who should design the site so that is not search engine unfriendly).

I have tried a number of search engine submission services in the past, but ultimately the question is whether it is truly worth all the hassle. I think that if you use the free service of addme.com, you would cover a good number of bases for very little time spent.

If you're keen on search engine submission, visit all the search engines listed here:
http://www.dmoz.org/Computers/Internet/Searching/Search_Engines/
and submit to them, when you have a spare weekend.

Spend a little more time on your Dmoz submission, but do it yourself. Remember, if you submit to multiple categories, some editors might think you're spamming, but on the other hand you are allowed to submit to multiple categories under certain circumstances.

For example, you can submit twice to the main English directory as well as once to each language in the World category if a sizeable portion of your web site is in that language. In your case, have your entire site translated into English, Romanian, French and Italian, so that you can submit it to all four languages.

I suggest you submit to these two English categories:
http://tinyurl.com/9ajqlyv
http://tinyurl.com/97k78w2

There was a time when Google made extensive use of Dmoz, but that time is past. Dmoz is still good because it gives you a high[er] PR backlink, but Google no longer uses Dmoz for its directory.

Does anybody know if there are other ways I can improve the search options myself, or even if it is possible to work on SEO individually?


The information here is a bit outdated but many of the principles still apply. SEO is best done by yourself (or by your web designer).

Remember, pure SEO is just one small aspect of marketing yourself and your web site. The SEO that I think of is simply page optimisation, i.e. to write your web pages in such a way that they are loved by search engines and spotted by users of search engines.


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 07:40
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Valuable, useful, and unique content Oct 8, 2012

Lara,

As you put it, your experience is eclectic. This means that you probably have some rare firsthand information that would be useful for anyone who is trying to find out about it.

While I agree with Neil that SEO is snake oil, any trickery - no matter how expensive - to get your site in a privileged position may be thwarted by an algorithm change.

On the other hand, if you have some valuable and unique content, the lifeblood of a search engine is whether people will find it quickly and easily.

I'll give you my example, so you can check what you'd have to offer along this line.

There is little information available on sworn translations in Brazil , one specific service I am licensed to provide. So I put together the most relevant FAQs on it. I did it first in Portuguese. A friend in the Brazilian Embassy in Washington, DC, asked me to make it in English too, as his staff spent many hours on the phone every week giving all that information to people who needed it, but didn't understand Portuguese.

Though I have no restriction to anyone copying all that and publishing it anywhere, few sites have done it so far. Most used only parts of it, and none took the trouble to keep it updated.

Bottom line is that I never spent one cent in SEO, yet if you search for sworn translation Brazil or certified translation Brazil on Google, my page will come up first. If you search in Portuguese with tradução juramentada Brasil, it will come up second, because the first one is Wikipedia's.

My web site has several other pages containing valuable information, however the others are not so unique, therefore they don't make it to the top on Google, just close enough.

All you need is one magnet to draw people to your web site. If you make the entire site interesting enough, people might stay there for a while, browse around, and eventually hire you to do something you do.

While I was writing this, I received an e-mail from a prospect, quoting from it verbatim:
Li recentemente detalhes do serviço de tradução juramentada em seu
site, e primeiramente parabéns; ele é sem dúvida a melhor fonte de
informações sobre o assunto que pude encontrar.

Translation: I recently read some details of the sworn translation service on your site, and, firstly, congratulations; it is doubtlessly the best source of information on this matter I could find.


This is what you should aim for. Give it a try! Search your eclectic experience for some potentially unique content you could use for such a 'magnet'. Then just use keywords smartly and correctly (several web sites offering SEO services have tutorials on this as their magnets).


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 10:40
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Some things don't change Oct 8, 2012

José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:
I agree with Neil that SEO is snake oil. Any trickery - no matter how expensive - to get your site in a privileged position may be thwarted by an algorithm change.


True, but some things don't change. There are certain principles in SEO that haven't changed in decades. These include having keywords in your "title", in your "keywords" and in your "description", as well as in your URL.

Lara, if you want to see what your site would look like in a Google search, if someone had searched for "translation" plus two of your languages, there is a site that can fake it for you.

Here is an image that shows how this thread's current participants' web site's search result would look like if the search was done for "translation" plus two of the languages translated by the person (this image is not 100% accurate because the faker ignores words ending on a comma, but Google doesn't):



What do you learn from this? If by some luck any of these sites make it to the top 5 in a search result, which of them would a user likely click, and which of them would a user likely ignore?



[Edited at 2012-10-08 13:13 GMT]


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