| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4] > | Last straw! - Askers who are too lazy to make up a user name Thread poster: Robert Donahue (X)
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Robert Donahue (X) 
Russian to English
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TOPIC STARTER | Ordinarily I would agree with you | May 20, 2005 |
Momoka wrote:
I think we all gain in new terms (and their definitions) in Kudoz by allowing people access from other sites, so I'm not against this. However, as a member of this site, where we (well, at least I) answer questions and make comments and suggestions in order to make our community of translators and interpreters a better one, would like to know when an asker is a member of Proz or not. I think those who answer should at least have the right to know (and choose, if they prefer to do so).
I don't like calling individuals out for their questions, but since this person is literally nameless/faceless and unregistered to boot, I will. http://www.proz.com/kudoz/1036800
Tell me, if you will, how this question improves the site? I just happen to think that allowing non-registered members to post questions leads to this type of silliness.
On another note...
"Intelligent Translation by HUMANS
for FREE! FAST answers to your e-mailbox
http://www.e-multiweb.com/info/human.htm
KudoZ!
A service of Yu Jian Yo Language Services, Ltd. and ProZ.com"
Ethically this is very wrong, IMHO. Any reasonable person can read this and make the assumption that a) this person is affiliated in an official capacity with the site and b) that the "FREE! FAST HUMAN" answer they'll receive comes courtesy of Yu Jian Yo language services, Ltd. I don't know about you, but when I answer a question on here it's for the benefit of the Asker and the community and not to line this person's pockets.
I think the HUMANS(!!!) is funny too, I'll grant that. It might just as well as say monkeys though, for all the respect it accords us. 
| | | | Schwabamädle
Canada
Local time: 03:33
English to German
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does this really matter? I think the name Kudoz abuser is very funny, sometimes I call my dog this way if he does not behave, ha ha
Have a great weekend and don´t worry so much
| | | | | Thanks, kinda | May 20, 2005 |
Some people like to be told their problems are in fact mere trifles. I don't, for one. I think Rob and Kirill would agree. Thank you, Andrea and Mats, but your approach does not work for me.
| | | | IanW (X)
Local time: 09:33
German to English
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| Life is too short to accept unsatisfactory things we can change | May 20, 2005 |
Kirill Semenov wrote: Mats Wiman wrote:
If there is something which irritates you, eg. too many questions or anonymous askers, there is always a very sane option: Disregard it. Saves a lot of adrenalin and saves a lot of time.
Yeas, Mats. If your house is robbed, the simplest solution is to disregard it. Just behave as if it's perfectly OK. Very sane. Don't call the police, just do nothing. Take it as it is. It's saves your adrenalin and your time.  Your `golden rule' contradicts the very fact that we have "Call the moderator" button in each question. It means that if we don't like something we CAN (and HAVE) to call moderators' attention to the fact. Otherwise we are to skip any offensive content like exploiting ProZ as a free translation site, abusive religious claims or child pornography. Please, stop to repeat this rule of yours HUNDREDS OF TIMES, I beg you, really! It does not work. And you are a moderator -- please act, don't find an excuse to do nothing or to disregard problems! [Edited at 2005-05-20 15:07]
With you all the way, Kirill. Personally, I think that the knee-jerk reactions that Mats inflicts upon us whenever there is any mention of changing the status quo are nothing short of ridiculous. More to the point, I don't think that it's right for a moderator to have such a self-serving attitude in public.
And Anabel, although I am a peace-loving guy, I can't agree that "life is too short" for "fighting over everything". On the contrary, life is too short to accept unsatisfactory things that we can change.
All the best
Ian
[Edited at 2005-05-20 17:16]
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Anabel Martínez
Spain
Local time: 09:33
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
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| just an opinion | May 20, 2005 |
Mikhail Kropotov wrote:
Some people like to be told their problems are in fact mere trifles. I don't, for one. I think Rob and Kirill would agree. Thank you, Andrea and Mats, but your approach does not work for me.
Hi, Mikhail,
Please, don't misunderstand me, I just want to say that, ok, this is not a trifle, it's offensive, I agree completely, but... would you call it "a problem"? I mean, it's kinda relative... I'm not going to lose sleep over being "a human translation for free" tonight, and I can tell you I take most things very seriously. I'm not saying it's fun, but just not to overreact. Henry's going to do something about it and, by talking about it and making people conscious of all the issues talked about here in the fora, we're probably going to make it better. Not having a job is a problem, this is definitely not.
| | | | Anabel Martínez
Spain
Local time: 09:33
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
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| ok, we agree on many things, one of them is: life's too short | May 20, 2005 |
Ian Winick wrote:
And Anabel, although I am a peace-loving guy, I can't agree that "life is too short" for "fighting over everything". On the contrary, life is too short to accept unsatisfactory things that we can change.
Ok, Ian, I agree with you in that we should try to overcome and change things we don't like, of course! But I meant not taking it so much at heart. I mean, yes, it's all offensive, we're not treated as the professionals we are, I agree (I even made a post about it). But again, I prefer not to think all the time about it. What I meant is, of course I don't like this situation at all, but I'm going to post a thread and not be burning with rage with it. I don't agree with Mats in just letting it go, but with doing something about more peacefully... Being more constructive, if you want to put it that way.
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Thank you Anabel, I agree with you. We should find a solution without jumping off the handle and making a mess of things. As long as something gets done, it's worth talking about
| | | | Kirill Semenov
Ukraine
Local time: 10:33
Member (2004)
English to Russian
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| Thank you, Ian | May 20, 2005 |
As I had stated before, I feel that we don't have to be indifferent. If there is a problem, and if the problem is raised often during several years, it's to be solved. The very fact that so many people find this or that as a problem is enough to consider it seriously. Any advice like `just pass it by' or `skip it' just do not appeal to me, personally. I would like to see a solution, not just a consolation.
[Edited at 2005-05-20 17:33]
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Can Altinbay
Local time: 03:33
Japanese to English
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In memoriam | Not so fast! | May 20, 2005 |
Álvaro Blanch wrote: Personally I think it's mildly amusing..makes me sounds like an animal in a zoo...I only regret that they didn't say "REAL HUMANS", but do appreciate the fact they said "Intelligent". If only they knew...  ) ) ) )
Don't celebrate so fast. "Intelligent" here qualifies "translation", not "human".
| | | | Tatiana Nero (X)
Local time: 03:33
Russian
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| are we being outsourced? | May 20, 2005 |
I guess, it's a question to Henry (no offense, just asking for information)...
Are those links created by various companies offering "free human translation" without ProZ's knowledge or consent, and ProZ cannot control it, or are we being outsourced knowingly?
Another site offering us for free:
http://www.russiantimes.com/translate.html
That's... See more I guess, it's a question to Henry (no offense, just asking for information)...
Are those links created by various companies offering "free human translation" without ProZ's knowledge or consent, and ProZ cannot control it, or are we being outsourced knowingly?
Another site offering us for free:
http://www.russiantimes.com/translate.html
That's what they say on this page (among other things):
quote
======
This FREE service is brought to you by Baraban.Com - Russian America
....
Need help translating a tough term?
Ask KudoZ! language experts for FREE help. (Powered by ProZ.com)
unquote
======== ▲ Collapse
| | | | Mats Wiman
Sweden
Local time: 09:33
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
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In memoriam | Astounding views! | May 20, 2005 |
Kirill Semenov wrote: Mats Wiman wrote:
If there is something which irritates you, eg. too many questions or anonymous askers, there is always a very sane option: Disregard it. Saves a lot of adrenalin and saves a lot of time.
Yeas, Mats. If your house is robbed, the simplest solution is to disregard it. Just behave as if it's perfectly OK. Very sane. Don't call the police, just do nothing. Take it as it is. It's saves your adrenalin and your time. Your `golden rule' contradicts the very fact that we have "Call the moderator" button in each question. It means that if we don't like something we CAN (and HAVE) to call moderators' attention to the fact. Otherwise we are to skip any offensive content like exploiting ProZ as a free translation site, abusive religious claims or child pornography. Please, stop to repeat this rule of yours HUNDREDS OF TIMES, I beg you, really! It does not work. And you are a moderator -- please act, don't find an excuse to do nothing or to disregard problems!
To make it simple: In a system where askers are invited to ask questions, it's not a crime/abuse to ask questions. Nobody is hurt by not having to answer a question.
"Please act" ?? Of course! Nobody has ever asked me to. If they would, I would of course act (child pornography, religious propaganda, political views which all rarely appear in the KudoZ arena. In fact I have unsquashed a number of squashed questions that were translation phrases and no propaganda.)
Moderators are of course to be called if there is a genuine problem, not if someone happens to find a question uninteresting. His/her answer would probably be "If you don't like the question, don't answer it".
I'll of course not propagate my golden rule if I don't see a reason to.
Ian Winnick
With you all the way, Kirill.
Personally, I think that the knee-jerk reactions that Mats inflicts upon us whenever there is any mention of changing the status quo are nothing short of ridiculous.
More to the point, I don't think that it's right for a moderator to have such a self-serving attitude in public.
Self-serving??? What is self-serving with wanting to upphold as much freedom as possible in a system built on invitation to ask questions?
Riduculous?? Are you saying that it would be better if I made this argument in secret or only in the moderator circle?
I believe it is not only for members to participate in discussions. Moderators also have this right, and to be exact I have propagated my golden rule incessantly in the moderator circle as well.
If you don't like my view, there is no need to call it ridiculous.
[Edited at 2005-05-21 01:10]
| | | | | The job is to solve problems while remaining open | May 20, 2005 |
In KudoZ and other areas of the site, the challenge is to maintain as much openness as possible while solving the problems that go along with that.
Openness is one of ProZ.com's important characteristics, and personally I am glad that Mats and others have made themselves advocates for that. I am equally glad that other members refuse to settle for what can be improved upon. I believe the two positions can be reconciled, but even if they can not, let us at least keep our public dialo... See more In KudoZ and other areas of the site, the challenge is to maintain as much openness as possible while solving the problems that go along with that.
Openness is one of ProZ.com's important characteristics, and personally I am glad that Mats and others have made themselves advocates for that. I am equally glad that other members refuse to settle for what can be improved upon. I believe the two positions can be reconciled, but even if they can not, let us at least keep our public dialogue measured and respectful. Thank you. ▲ Collapse
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Momoka (X)
Local time: 16:33
Japanese to Spanish
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| Members/Non-members | May 20, 2005 |
[quote]Endre Both wrote:
[The asker information box (upper left-hand side on the KudoZ page) already reveals whether or not the question comes from a member (if the asker is a member, their name appears in red, and clicking on it takes you to their profile).
Thank your for telling me, Endre. Hadn't noticed it.
| | | | | As Edmund Burke would have said... | May 20, 2005 |
...if he'd been on ProZ, "All that is required for a website to go to rack and ruin is for those who don't like a question to stand by and move on to the next one."
I don't always agree with all the suggestions myself, but I am always impressed by the fact that people are bothered enough to raise the points.
| | | | IanW (X)
Local time: 09:33
German to English
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| Self-serving | May 21, 2005 |
Mats Wiman wrote:
Self-serving??? What is self-serving with wanting to upphold as much freedom as possible in a system built on invitation to ask questions?
Riduculous?? Are you saying that it would be better if I made this argument in secret or only in the moderator circle?
I believe it is not only for members to participate in discussions. Moderators also have this right, and to be exact I have propagated my golden rule incessantly in the moderator circle as well.
If you don't like my view, there is no need to call it ridiculous.
With respect, Mats, I didn't say that your "views" were ridiculous - and my apologies if you find this offensive (although from someone who has been known to call other members "little troublemakers" and to tell them to "mind their own business", this is a bit rich).
What I find ridiculous is that you have the same knee-jerk reaction to any suggestion to make this better. If other members don't know what I mean, I would ask them to have a look back through every forum suggesting an improvement in the KudoZ system, and you'll almost certainly find Mats there with his wonderfully constructive "if you don't like it, ignore it" attitude, his "golden rule". And as a self-confessed point-grabber, this "golden rule" is thoroughly self-serving - a more professional approach geared towards translators lending assistance to other professionals in their own native/working languages would spell the end of the dictionaries-and-broadband brigade. And would stop people scornfully referring to the site as "AmateurZ".
Of course moderators have the right to participate in discussions too - but from them I expect a little bit of flexibility, openness and a willingness to make things better. Otherwise we can do away with moderators completely.
[Edited at 2005-05-21 06:52]
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