Pages in topic:   [1 2 3] >
Off topic: Kudoz system - a beginner's guide
Thread poster: Aleksandr Okunev
Aleksandr Okunev
Local time: 14:08
English to Russian
Feb 23, 2006

Hi everyone. I'm a bit bored by thickness control system. Please, add your points to the guide or correct the existing ones.
Cheers,
Aleksandr
=============================
Asking

1. Try to provide as little context as possible. For a professional translator "@", "please, help", "thanks" is fairly enough, those who want more are not professionals.
2. If you still cannot avoid providing some context, say something about your client or project, for example "a dairy line erection in Kokushkino, Siberia". Wise people will either know the subject already or will be able to do a little Web research to find out what it is all about.
3. Do not switch fields too often, if your first Kudoz question was about geology, try to leave it this way for a couple of years, no matter what your subsequent questions are about, clever answerers must be able to find their way about it.
4. Do NOT EVER correct any spelling mistakes in your question - this is yet another means to filter off unprofessional answerers.
5. By all means, when asking Kudoz questions, cycle through all encodings available in your browser, to filter off careless and not so stubborn answerers.

Answering

1. Do not limit yourself to your specialty field, answer every question asked, even if you have not suspected that this subject matter existed at all, you may still have a chance to win points (see "Grading").
2. Answer quickly - it's the "n min" in your answer that directly reflects your professionalism. You can amend/correct your answer later. Having a few (preferably most) of your Kudoz answers with "0 min" timestamp is a sign of your high intellectual and professional abilities. (Unfortunately, stupid PHP scripts and the laws of physics do not allow us to negative timestams).
3. Do not doubt - just think of an answer and use Google search to confirm your answer. Use 'advanced search' if there is no proof in basic search.
4. Do not provide answer in the dedicated field, use "-->", "see below", "Note" and other strings. This way you can provide multiple answers based on what you think the winning version is going to be. This, combined with item 2, makes it possible for you to check the other answers, modify and include them into your list of variants.
5. Do NOT answer any graded Kudoz questions even if all the provided answers are incorrect and you know the correct answer, answering a question for no points is a waste of time.

Peer comments

1. First check the time of the answer. If this is below 1 minute, then the answer is stupid and the answerer is worthless (see exceptions in item 2). Abstain from grading. If there are several answers - the quickest answer is correct. If there are two answers with the same time, you will have to read the answer itself. If they are identical check item 2 of "Peer comments".
2. If the answerer is your buddy (comes from the same country, is graduate of the same Uni, etc.) or you like the photo, or is of the same/oposite sex with you or agreed with your answers before you must agree.
3. Do not provide any comments when you agree or disagree. When you get more Kudoz experience, try providing 'neutral' feedback without any comments - that is very effective in raising your professional image.

Grading

1. METHOD 1 --- Grade as soon as possible, preferably within 2 minutes after your question. Using this method, it is best to grade when you have just one "0 min" answer from a real professional and there are a couple of lame slow answerers lurking behind with their research, preparing their own silly answers. By doing so you help them improve professionally.
METHOD 2 --- Choose the winner based on his/her location, your relationship, previous grading of your own Kudoz answers. By doing so you enhance freelancers' solidarity.
METHOD 3 --- Leave the question to grading robots. Use this is to introduce a certain degree of "fuzziness" into the stale and stagnant conventional grading system. This will also help Proz robots improve their linguistic abilities.
METHOD 3 --- Close all your questions without grading, this is an absolute must when there is nobody among the answerers who graded your answers nicely.
2. If you cannot avoid awarding points to someone who does not really deserve them, give as few points as possible (once again, imperfection of PHP and Proz does not allow to give negative points).
3. Express you gratitude to the winning answerer ONLY, you must provide as much detail as possible to avoid making an impression that you are grateful to someone else among the answerers, typically "Thank you, John Smith, born XX-XX-19XX, passport number R8658657 issued on XX-XX-XXXX". Accuracy is an invaluable quality for a translator.

[Edited at 2006-02-23 12:44]

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2006-02-23 18:03]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Levan Namoradze  Identity Verified
Georgia
Local time: 15:08
Member (2005)
English to Georgian
+ ...
:-) Feb 23, 2006



Direct link Reply with quote
 

Kurt Porter  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:08
Russian to English
+ ...
I'd have replied to this sooner, Feb 23, 2006

but I had to get up off the floor, fix my chair, stop laughing and try to compose some thoughts.

I wish I could express subtle (or not so subtle) sarcasm in writing in my acquired languages at such an eloquent level! Pure class! Thank you.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Endre Both  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 13:08
Member (2002)
English to German
KudoZ Best Practices Feb 23, 2006

Thank you, Aleksandr, for this thorough and detailed introduction on how to use KudoZ for the maximum benefit of all participants.

It is in fact a bit too thorough and detailed to make a good KudoZ answer, and it also shows signs of a sense of humour which is entirely unfitting for a translator and is the hallmark of inferior wordsmiths who do not take their profession seriously. But hey, this is the forum, so you are excused.

Endre


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
If I may Feb 23, 2006

Aleksandr Okunev wrote:
Answering

1. Do not limit yourself to your specialty field, answer every question asked, even if you have not suspected that this subject matter existed at all, you may still have a chance to win points (see "Grading").
2. Answer quickly - it's the "n min" in your answer that directly reflects your professionalism. You can amend/correct your answer later. Having a few (preferably most) of your Kudoz answers with "0 min" timestamp is a sign of your high intellectual and professional abilities. (Unfortunately, stupid PHP scripts and the laws of physics do not allow us to negative timestams).
3. Do not doubt - just think of an answer and use Google search to confirm your answer. Use 'advanced search' if there is no proof in basic search.
4. Do not provide answer in the dedicated field, use "-->", "see below", "Note" and other strings. This way you can provide multiple answers based on what you think the winning version is going to be. This, combined with item 2, makes it possible for you to check the other answers, modify and include them into your list of variants.
5. Do NOT answer any graded Kudoz questions even if all the provided answers are incorrect and you know the correct answer, answering a question for no points is a waste of time.


6. If there is a difference due to your country of origin don't state this in the space provided for 'agree'. First 'disagree' and then provide a separate answer. This will leverage your chances to win points e.g. EN-US/EN-UK, color/colour; PT-BR/PT-PT, atividade/actividade.

Note: this suggestion is based on real facts but examples have been slightly modified for identity protection purposes.

*******

Great initiative Aleksandr!

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 
gad
United States
Local time: 07:08
Member
French to English
These are humorous but... Feb 23, 2006

Aleksandr Okunev wrote:

2. If the answerer is your buddy (comes from the same country, is graduate of the same Uni, etc.) or you like the photo, or is of the same/oposite sex with you or agreed with your answers before you must agree.


I've actually seen this one in action - well, I should say I've seen this in action in the reverse, meaning:

If you the answerer is not your buddy and if you are condescendingly superior, then disagree with as many of that person's answers (given and/or chosen) as you can, even ones that are clearly correct.

[Edited at 2006-02-23 14:37]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Eva T
English to Albanian
+ ...
Google Feb 23, 2006

I like Asnwering Kudoz, Number 3:
3. Do not doubt - just think of an answer and use Google search to confirm your answer. Use 'advanced search' if there is no proof in basic search.



I have been surprised in my community how much people base their answers on a Google search.

Recently, we had one or two people trying to justify a misspelled word, because this is the way it is spelled in Google, so the Albanian way of spelling this word has changed!!!. Wow, very clever.

Another recent case: the asker did not accept a perfectly correct answer, which actually was the only answer provided and which received 4 or 5 Agrees, only because it was not found in Google!!!

Eva


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Kurt Porter  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:08
Russian to English
+ ...
Google Feb 23, 2006

Eva T wrote:

I like Asnwering Kudoz, Number 3:
3. Do not doubt - just think of an answer and use Google search to confirm your answer. Use 'advanced search' if there is no proof in basic search.



I have been surprised in my community how much people base their answers on a Google search.

Recently, we had one or two people trying to justify a misspelled word, because this is the way it is spelled in Google, so the Albanian way of spelling this word has changed!!!. Wow, very clever.

Another recent case: the asker did not accept a perfectly correct answer, which actually was the only answer provided and which received 4 or 5 Agrees, only because it was not found in Google!!!

Eva


Google and other search engines can be wonderful research tools..but to "Translate by Google" is a mistake.


Direct link Reply with quote
 
paolamonaco  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 07:08
English to Italian
+ ...
Humorous but... Feb 23, 2006

Answering
3. Do not doubt - just think of an answer and use Google search to confirm your answer. Use 'advanced search' if there is no proof in basic search.

Unfortunately this is very common between answerers and it's really disappointing...(


Direct link Reply with quote
 
gad
United States
Local time: 07:08
Member
French to English
Me too Feb 23, 2006

Eva T wrote:

I have been surprised in my community how much people base their answers on a Google search.


Yes, I have been disappointed to see how many people will overuse the statement "lots of Google hits" in their answers, as if Google is the language bible and as if there aren't plenty of poor translations all over the net. While Google obviously can be a helpful tool, many times if someone is posting a question then it is to get an answer based on others' expertise (not always, but often).


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Fred Neild  Identity Verified
English to Spanish
+ ...
Poor experience as an asker Feb 23, 2006

gad wrote:

Eva T wrote:

I have been surprised in my community how much people base their answers on a Google search.


Yes, I have been disappointed to see how many people will overuse the statement "lots of Google hits" in their answers, as if Google is the language bible and as if there aren't plenty of poor translations all over the net. While Google obviously can be a helpful tool, many times if someone is posting a question then it is to get an answer based on others' expertise (not always, but often).


Great point gad.

Usually, I have already searched for the answer in Google before posting a question and I have to say that I haven't got the results I expected as an asker in KudoZ.

Fred


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 06:08
German to English
Beginner's guide to KudoZ Feb 23, 2006

Eva T wrote:

I have been surprised in my community how much people base their answers on a Google search.

Eva


Hi Eva,
Google can be a very valuable tool, if it is used judiciously and intelligently. You're very right, of course, that there are a lot of badly written texts on the internet (including very bad translations prepared by people who seek help in KudoZ), so it's important to evaluate any online resources found with search engines carefully before submitting them for KudoZ answers.

But what I find most abhorrent, is the submission of an answer with tons of Google hits to back it up but nothing to show that the proposed term is also a good translation of the source term. The only thing the answerer is doing is showing that his proposal exists in the target language.


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Eva T
English to Albanian
+ ...
On Google again Feb 23, 2006

Kurt Porter wrote:
Google and other search engines can be wonderful research tools..but to "Translate by Google" is a mistake.



Exactly my point Kurt.

Gad wrote:
Yes, I have been disappointed to see how many people will overuse the statement "lots of Google hits" in their answers, as if Google is the language bible and as if there aren't plenty of poor translations all over the net. While Google obviously can be a helpful tool, many times if someone is posting a question then it is to get an answer based on others' expertise (not always, but often).


I am so happy that I am not alone on thinking that Google is not an official "language source" as some people use it. Some use it as if it found on Google, it is correct! I mean what does googling mean? Finding how often a word/subject is used on the internet. I am inclined to use a google entry, only after I have checked the source well, meaning who wrote it etc. Anyway..., I am glad that is not just me who feels this way.

Eva


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Kirill Semenov  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 14:08
Member (2004)
English to Russian
+ ...
Exactly, Kim :) Feb 23, 2006

Kim Metzger wrote:
But what I find most abhorrent, is the submission of an answer with tons of Google hits to back it up but nothing to show that the proposed term is also a good translation of the source term. The only thing the answerer is doing is showing that his proposal exists in the target language.


This is a very important point. Say, the question is how to translate "I love you", but someone translates it as "thank you" in target language and provides zillions of Google links in the *target* language to `support' the version. The logical connection is totally lost, and it usually makes me mad (as a former mathematician).

Google is great, it's a precious source of knowledge, but please, people, use it wisely, not purely formally, as if it is an endless set of non-coherent words.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Monika Coulson  Identity Verified
Local time: 05:08
Member (2001)
English to Albanian
+ ...
Existing entries vs. correct translation Feb 23, 2006

Dear Kim
You make a very wise point here. Many asnwers backed up by Google only show that the proposal exists in the target language, but it might not mean that it is a correct translation in a given context. IMHO, it is best to identify the source of that entry, meaning, if it is an official site and related to the subject or it is found merely in the midst of the internet world, where people just enjoy communicating freely with each-other, as members of different lists or forums.

Monika

Kim Metzger wrote:

But what I find most abhorrent, is the submission of an answer with tons of Google hits to back it up but nothing to show that the proposed term is also a good translation of the source term. The only thing the answerer is doing is showing that his proposal exists in the target language.




[Edited at 2006-02-23 17:42]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
Pages in topic:   [1 2 3] >


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Kudoz system - a beginner's guide

Advanced search






SDL Trados Studio 2017 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 250,000 translators.

SDL Trados Studio 2017 helps translators increase translation productivity whilst ensuring quality. Combining translation memory, terminology management and machine translation in one simple and easy-to-use environment.

More info »
WordFinder
The words you want Anywhere, Anytime

WordFinder is the market's fastest and easiest way of finding the right word, term, translation or synonym in one or more dictionaries. In our assortment you can choose among more than 120 dictionaries in 15 languages from leading publishers.

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search