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opinion....another kind of competition.....
Thread poster: emilia manolache

emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
Aug 29, 2006

Dear all,

I have recently joined this site and unfortunately, I noticed in many cases that people who answer to various questions or express their opinion are more preoccupied with being sarcastic or checking whether answers are written with capitals or not, or asking about qualifications, or.....I could go on and on....
Hey, I thought we were supposed to help each other, express opinions, learn from one another, share our "vast" knowledge.....
I read a few discussions on various topics and I often saw that many are eager to evidence their sarcasm, irony, when all that they are expected is to be a helper and a...colleague....
Maybe I am wrong and this is only a first impression.... Hopefully I didn't offend anyone........I surely didn't mean it...
Great day and thank you for taking the time to read my message........!


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xxxEmmanuelleAn  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:13
English to French
+ ...
Don't bother! Aug 30, 2006

I have experienced that before with 2 people. First, I took it very personally and should it happen again I just would not pay attention to it. They feel the need to have an "agressive/sarcastic" (whatever...) behaviour because they have a problem with themselves and it is so easy to express it hidden behind the screen of your computer. On top of that, if you haven't been in the translation/interpreting market for too long (just like me), you are more likely to be "assaulted" by them. Just don't bother! There are also many pleasant people on the kudoz forums. Have a lovely day!

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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I see.... Aug 30, 2006

Hi, Emmanuelle!

I know I shouldn't bother...but first I had to make sure I let them know my opinion....and this way I had the chance to find out that there are pleasant people on these forums...the start was very good....!

Thank you and you too!


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Enrique
Local time: 19:13
SITE STAFF
Contact a moderator or open a support ticket Aug 30, 2006

KudoZ rule 3.5 states


Peer comments must be purely linguistic. As elsewhere in the site, personal comments are not allowed in peer comments. Notes should be based solely on linguistic evaluation of answers provided. Backing up peer comments with references is encouraged.

http://www.proz.com/siterules/kudoz_answ/3.5#3.5


If your answers get comments not in line with this rule please get in touch with a moderator or open a support ticket, including the link to the relevant question(s).

Thanks,
Enrique Cavalitto


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gad
United States
Local time: 18:13
Member
French to English
Yes, your first impression is correct (unfortunately) Aug 30, 2006

emilia manolache wrote:

Dear all,

I have recently joined this site and unfortunately, I noticed in many cases that people who answer to various questions or express their opinion are more preoccupied with being sarcastic or checking whether answers are written with capitals or not, or asking about qualifications, or.....I could go on and on....
Hey, I thought we were supposed to help each other, express opinions, learn from one another, share our "vast" knowledge.....
I read a few discussions on various topics and I often saw that many are eager to evidence their sarcasm, irony, when all that they are expected is to be a helper and a...colleague....
Maybe I am wrong and this is only a first impression.... Hopefully I didn't offend anyone........I surely didn't mean it...
Great day and thank you for taking the time to read my message........!


Yes, the snideness from some people is just unreal. It makes one wonder what they are doing on a site where at least one purpose is to help others. Being rude and unprofessional doesn't help anyone.

But, there are others here who are nice, so I hope that you encounter much more of them if you decide to hang around. The thing about those who are snide and sarcastic is that sometimes they seem to live on this site and take over, which is frustrating.

You take care.:)


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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thank you.... Aug 30, 2006

Thank you for your answer and I hope I won't get the chance ....as possible as it can be.....to contact a moderator...!
It is good to know, however....


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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Glad..... Aug 30, 2006

Hi, Gad!

Thank you for your answer and I am more and more confident that "they" cannot take over.....
So far, only nice people answered to my topic....this means something, doesn't it ?!

Have a great day!


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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 17:13
German to English
First impression Aug 30, 2006

emilia manolache wrote:

I have recently joined this site and unfortunately, I noticed in many cases that people who answer to various questions or express their opinion are more preoccupied with being sarcastic or checking whether answers are written with capitals or not, or asking about qualifications, or.....I could go on and on....

Maybe I am wrong and this is only a first impression.... Hopefully I didn't offend anyone........I surely didn't mean it...
Great day and thank you for taking the time to read my message........!


Dear Emilia - welcome to ProZ.com! You're certainly not offending anyone by letting us know how you feel about KudoZ after just starting out. I'm glad you left open the possibility that your first impression might not tell the whole story.

Before we jump to conclusions, can you give us some examples of what you consider to be sarcastic comments? I don't mean mentioning specific people but just quoting a comment that you consider offensive.

I know that when I first started using KudoZ as a newcomer to the translation business, I learned a lot about how professional translators think. They are perfectionists, and every little comma and spelling error is a big thing. Those red "disagrees" can be unsettling at first, but after you've been around a while, you may come to appreciate the "disagrees" as much as the "agrees."


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writeaway  Identity Verified
French to English
+ ...
Please return the page explaining Kudoz to newcomers Aug 30, 2006

Enrique wrote:

KudoZ rule 3.5 states


Peer comments must be purely linguistic. As elsewhere in the site, personal comments are not allowed in peer comments. Notes should be based solely on linguistic evaluation of answers provided. Backing up peer comments with references is encouraged.

http://www.proz.com/siterules/kudoz_answ/3.5#3.5


If your answers get comments not in line with this rule please get in touch with a moderator or open a support ticket, including the link to the relevant question(s).

Thanks,
Enrique Cavalitto



Lots of newcomers are instantly offended by ANY comment made to their answers. This is because when they answer questions on KudoZ for the first time, they don't know what to expect.
A problem at present is that more and more people are not upset about comments out of line but with comments in general. Anything short of an agree. Instead of defending or explaining their answer, they just insult the person who 'dared' make a "nasty" comment.
Of course the person who will suffer most from this is the Asker because if erroneous answers go unchallenged or are showered with uninformed agrees from "nice" colleagues, then those answers will be accepted. And be entered into the KOG.
So much misunderstanding could be avoided if the page explaining KudoZ to newcomers were reinstated. In previous discussions, it was indicated that the page would be returned but so far it still seems to be missing. Please put it back Enrique.


[Edited at 2006-08-30 15:02]


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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Politeness...... Aug 30, 2006

Hello!

You are right....as a newcomer, one can feel very "attacked"...
I understand professionals are perfectionists, but....I don't think they should forget their own start....we are not born omniscient...
They do not encourage you to answer and express opinion and I sometimes thought....they cannot lose faim, money or something important, or no one is stealing anything from them.....I wish they were a bit more....relaxed....ok?
Examples....
When I translate a simple expression and NOT using it in a context, I just write it.....Folic Acid...the equivalent for the german term and someone first sent negative, changed with neutral and said......not with capitals, of course...............
Another ........ I had a suggestion for a medical term and someone said that the article that I provided had nothing to do with my explanation...wrong...and asked if I had a certificate for medical translations....
come on.......first of all....this "certificate" is the experience one earns along the years....and that person started in 1978....
For the same suggestion someone else added......competence of Office Manager vs. Translator....

I don't want to go on....I appreciate disagrees, as long as they are a matter of constructive criticism, as a member here said, and of politeness.
Thank you for reading my message and for your answer!


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xxxEmmanuelleAn  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:13
English to French
+ ...
Kudoz Kings and Queens (Prima dona may sound better...) Aug 30, 2006

I donot mind if somebody does not agree with my answer. The person can be right. We are not perfect. We all make mistakes and learn from them, especially as new translators in the business. What I didn't like once is the way a person expressed a (don't want to offend anyone) disagreement by writting: "Those who KNOW can answer Kudoz questions." That was my second time on the Kudoz forum. That warm welcome sort of put me off for a few days. It's never happened again. Now I'm back on the forum and try not to bother with Kudoz Queens!

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xxxEmmanuelleAn  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:13
English to French
+ ...
Agree Aug 30, 2006

emilia manolache wrote:

Hello!

You are right....as a newcomer, one can feel very "attacked"...
I understand professionals are perfectionists, but....I don't think they should forget their own start....we are not born omniscient...
They do not encourage you to answer and express opinion and I sometimes thought....they cannot lose faim, money or something important, or no one is stealing anything from them.....I wish they were a bit more....relaxed....ok?
Examples....
When I translate a simple expression and NOT using it in a context, I just write it.....Folic Acid...the equivalent for the german term and someone first sent negative, changed with neutral and said......not with capitals, of course...............
Another ........ I had a suggestion for a medical term and someone said that the article that I provided had nothing to do with my explanation...wrong...and asked if I had a certificate for medical translations....
come on.......first of all....this "certificate" is the experience one earns along the years....and that person started in 1978....
For the same suggestion someone else added......competence of Office Manager vs. Translator....

I don't want to go on....I appreciate disagrees, as long as they are a matter of constructive criticism, as a member here said, and of politeness.
Thank you for reading my message and for your answer!


I fully agree with you Emilia. That's exactly how I feel.


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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Offended....? Aug 30, 2006

All right, writeaway....

My message didn't say anything about any offence...
I did not expect to be welcomed, agreed or praised by anyone or I am not too sensitive....
I consider comments as being educational and constructive, as long as they based on something solid. I had comments or "disagrees" that were very precious to me, the only difference was that they were........relaxed....
I expect that as long as my answer includes certain references, I already "defend" my opinion or explain it....and as a "nice" colleague I can help the Answerer or not, it is his decision and not of the others.
If you consider that "the page" can settle the limits of "expectations" for newcomers, please allow me to say that these expectations are only of being able to discuss on interesting and educational matters, in a relaxed and mature way.
It seems that my topic offended you......that wasn't my intention and I don't think you have to ask Enrique or any other moderator to return the page, just to avoid "these kind of messages".
Thank you for your message and honestly, I hope you will not consider it ironical. For me, it was really helpful.
Have a great day!


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emilia manolache
Local time: 01:13
Romanian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Ok....I thought I was exaggerated... Aug 30, 2006

I hope you will stay this time.....and I wish you that never to happen to you again.....!

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gad
United States
Local time: 18:13
Member
French to English
Very well said Aug 30, 2006

EmmanuelleAnn wrote:

I donot mind if somebody does not agree with my answer. The person can be right. We are not perfect. We all make mistakes and learn from them, especially as new translators in the business. What I didn't like once is the way a person expressed a (don't want to offend anyone) disagreement by writting: "Those who KNOW can answer Kudoz questions." That was my second time on the Kudoz forum. That warm welcome sort of put me off for a few days. It's never happened again. Now I'm back on the forum and try not to bother with Kudoz Queens!


Yes, I believe that most people do not mind disagreement, they just want to be treated with some respect. And a comment like the one you quoted above is not very respectful, and is without a doubt a personal attack that does not belong on a website where professionals collaborate.


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