On URGENT help!, google hits and KudoZ netiquette (see context)
Thread poster: Daniela Zambrini

Daniela Zambrini  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 12:31
Member (2005)
English to Italian
+ ...
Sep 12, 2006

How about a deal?

If you agree not to write any of the following in the KudoZ term fields and especially not in the KOG:

1. URGENT
2. help!
3. see sentence
4. (in context)

I will strive never to answer with:

1. see explanation
2. see below
3. missing accents or incorrect capital letters
4. pages and pages of cut+paste google hits

Just kidding…or maybe not.


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xxxIanW
Local time: 12:31
German to English
+ ...
How about changing the system ... Sep 12, 2006

Daniela Zambrini wrote:

How about a deal?

If you agree not to write any of the following in the KudoZ term fields and especially not in the KOG:

1. URGENT
2. help!
3. see sentence
4. (in context)

I will strive never to answer with:

1. see explanation
2. see below
3. missing accents or incorrect capital letters
4. pages and pages of cut+paste google hits

Just kidding…or maybe not.



... to include an "urgent" option (much needed, in my view) and a selectable option for "see below" or "see explanation" (and "not for grading"), so that it's not necessary to copy the entire sentence into the term field if the question doesn't relate to a specific part of it.


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Jack Doughty  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 11:31
Member (2000)
Russian to English
+ ...
KOG Glossary: leave translation field of entry form blank Sep 12, 2006

I think it is wrong that the translation for the KudoZ Glossary entry is already there in the box when the successful answerer goes to enter a term, in exactly the form the answerer put it. If it were left blank, it would be necessary to to think about what was being entered there, and some of the more glaring errors could be avoided.

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Rachel Vanarsdall  Identity Verified
Local time: 06:31
Member (2004)
French to English
TERM (here) or TERM (in this sentence) Sep 12, 2006

These are the ones that bug me the most.

There's even a Kudoz rule against this sort of thing.

"2.6 - Expressions such as 'see below', 'in this context', etc., must not be entered in the form boxes intended for the term in question, or its proposed translations. Entering such expressions interferes with the expected display of the KudoZ viewing page, alerts, digests and glossary entries. The use of quotes, unnecessary capitalization, question marks, and anything else that would not be found in a dictionary, should be avoided. "


Someday I would love to see:

TERM (not here)
or
TERM (in some other sentence)


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GoodWords  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 05:31
Spanish to English
+ ...
Heartily seconded Sep 12, 2006

Jack Doughty wrote:

I think it is wrong that the translation for the KudoZ Glossary entry is already there in the box when the successful answerer goes to enter a term, in exactly the form the answerer put it. If it were left blank, it would be necessary to to think about what was being entered there, and some of the more glaring errors could be avoided.


Just as you say, if the target term for entering into the glossary were blank by default, the person entering the pair into the Glossary would have to think about what to type.

What do you think about also having the source term blank? When the source term in a KudoZ query is typed with spelling or typographical errors or mistaken use of upper/lower case, it often enters the glossary with the mistakes intact. On the other hand, the challenge might be too great for some people.


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Daniela Zambrini  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 12:31
Member (2005)
English to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
empty KOG source and target fields Sep 12, 2006

Yes, I definitely agree with Jack and GoodWords.
Often, especially when there are long sentences ( !) or multiple terms in the question field, the KOG results are muddled or longwinded.
In actual fact, when the question is closed, the Glossary box does display "Glossary entry (DERIVED from question below)".

Leaving both fields blank would hopefully lead to careful re-reading and re-writing of dictionary-like entries in the KOG (capitals, spelling, singular form, infinitives, etc.)


Any other ideas?


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NancyLynn
Canada
Local time: 06:31
Member (2002)
French to English
+ ...

MODERATOR
You get my vote for sure! Sep 12, 2006

Daniela Zambrini wrote:

How about a deal?

If you agree not to write any of the following in the KudoZ term fields and especially not in the KOG:

1. URGENT
2. help!
3. see sentence
4. (in context)

I will strive never to answer with:

1. see explanation
2. see below
3. missing accents or incorrect capital letters
4. pages and pages of cut+paste google hits

Just kidding…or maybe not.



Absolutely.

Nancy


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Kim Metzger  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 05:31
German to English
Pages of google hits Sep 12, 2006

Daniela Zambrini wrote:


I will strive never to answer with:

1. see explanation
2. see below
3. missing accents or incorrect capital letters
4. pages and pages of cut+paste google hits

Just kidding…or maybe not.



I must admit, the Google-hit method of providing justification for an answer is at the top of my list of harmful practices. They prove only that the proposed target term probably exists in the target language.

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Karin Kutscher  Identity Verified
Local time: 08:31
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
+ ...
So totally Sep 12, 2006

In agreement with you... "(en este contexto)" is a utterly despicable waste of space and an insult against the mandatory filling of the Explanation box. I pledge to never help a person who commits this sin!

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Steffen Walter  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 12:31
Member (2002)
English to German
+ ...
Agree with all previous comments Sep 13, 2006

I routinely edit out parts such as "(here)" or "(in this context)" whenever I come across such entirely unnecessary additions in my pairs.

I do think that source and target glossary entry fields that are blank by default would make people think before they shoot, so to speak, and would rid us of a lot of careless entries whilst making KudoZ editors' lives much easier.

Steffen


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GoodWords  Identity Verified
Mexico
Local time: 05:31
Spanish to English
+ ...
Sins on both sides Sep 13, 2006

Karin Kutscher wrote:
"(en este contexto)" is a utterly despicable waste of space and an insult against the mandatory filling of the Explanation box. I pledge to never help a person who commits this sin!


Please, Karin have some compassion! I may have committed this "sin" myself on occasion out of frustration from reading too many answerers on other queries who ignored the context given and just supplied a dictionary look-up. Notes like (here) or (see context) are intended to make those kinds of "answerers" stop, read, and actually consider the given context. Of course it should go without saying, but sad experience has shown that some people do actually need it drawn to their attention.

[Edited at 2006-09-13 16:03]


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Ulrike MacKay  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 12:31
Member (2006)
English to German
+ ...
I confess Sep 13, 2006

Full of remorse I confess having committed such crimes and solemnly promise not to do so again!

As a new member in the community, I got carried away and franky admit to have quickly picked up some bad habits. It was most certainly not my intention to upset, offend or trouble anyone of my esteemed colleagues.

I therefore humbly ask the Jury to temper justice with mercy and to let me off with a warning.


Only kidding, but of course, you're absolutely right! In view of the KOG and even the daily digests, it's more than just "not very helpful" to have this kind of term indication.

On the other hand, sometimes it IS indeed hard to limit one's question to a specific phrase, especially when it comes to a sentence seems entirely incomprehensible.

That's why it WOULD in fact be a good idea to implement such functions / tick boxes like "grammar", "comprehension", "special meaning / here" - and blank fields or even restricted entry possibilities for the KOG would help immensely in maintaining a good dictionary style.

Though it was not part really part of this forum question, but still belongs to the KudoZ issues - I think the "your confidence level"-function is one of the most important ones and should under no circumstances be abolished.

So, I'll rest my case and hope to "meet" you all at KudoZ again!



Ulrike


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