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Kudoz Collusion?
Thread poster: John Cutler

Henry Hinds  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 00:02
English to Spanish
+ ...
In memoriam
It has happened Mar 1, 2007

There was a notorious case involving a Kudoz leader who was apparently doing just that. Some people will stop at nothing to get attention. I think efforts have been made to prevent such things from happening, but it would be hard for them to be foolproof.

Maybe the staff can give some better infromation here.


 

lexical  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 08:02
Portuguese to English
Does it matter? Mar 1, 2007

I think the Proz authorities have made rod for their own backs with the Kudoz system. Awarding points for helipng people invites point grabbing and badly thought out answers, and is the source not only of ill temper in Kudoz pairs but also of misleading entries in the database. There are no points for advising people in the Forums but it doesn't stop people being generous and sharing their expertise and experience - and Forum posts tend on average to attract more answers than Kudoz.

... See more
I think the Proz authorities have made rod for their own backs with the Kudoz system. Awarding points for helipng people invites point grabbing and badly thought out answers, and is the source not only of ill temper in Kudoz pairs but also of misleading entries in the database. There are no points for advising people in the Forums but it doesn't stop people being generous and sharing their expertise and experience - and Forum posts tend on average to attract more answers than Kudoz.

Those who chase after points are, in my view, misguided if they think it will secure them more work, but if you turn it into a competition, you shouldn't be surprised if people cut corners or even cheat.

Until the Proz authorities recognise that there is a problem and reform Kudoz, I think we'll have to live with the consequences.
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Enrique Cavalitto  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 04:02
Member (2006)
English to Spanish
Controls are in place Mar 1, 2007

It is possible that some small scale collusion or cheating could happen in KudoZ but there are control mechanisms in place, so larger-scale situations are eventually detected and administrative actions applied.

Regards,
Enrique


 

ViktoriaG  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 02:02
English to French
+ ...
Just had to point this out Mar 2, 2007

Most of the people who take part in these discussions are busy people - or so I guess, judging from the content of the discussions. But not all ProZ users are so busy. Most of those starting out have no contracts for months on end. They are hungry for work. They have a lot of time on their hands. They want to polish their profiles. I am not saying they do play with the KudoZ system in a twisted way, but I am sure many of the site users actually do have the time for it, and often the motivation t... See more
Most of the people who take part in these discussions are busy people - or so I guess, judging from the content of the discussions. But not all ProZ users are so busy. Most of those starting out have no contracts for months on end. They are hungry for work. They have a lot of time on their hands. They want to polish their profiles. I am not saying they do play with the KudoZ system in a twisted way, but I am sure many of the site users actually do have the time for it, and often the motivation too.Collapse


 

Francis Lee (X)
Local time: 08:02
German to English
+ ...
Kim Metzger is a prime example Mar 2, 2007

... no, not of collusion (most definitely not, in fact) but of the "Google wizards" and genuinely helpful answerers he himself refers to!

Kim Metzger wrote:
I've seen KudoZ questions answered in 5 minutes with the kind of documentation that a professional translator needs for reassurance that he's not going to get into hot water with his client. But collusion is a definite possibility, too.


Kim is known in the Ger-Eng section of Kudoz for his very thoroughly researched - and quick - answers. If only there were more like him ...

On a related point, compare this:
Kim Metzger wrote:

... I have also experienced all sorts of fraudsters and point grabbers, whose sole aim is to amass points to stand out from the crowd when it comes to jobs or perhaps to boost their egos. These folks are not interested in building a reliable glossary for future users; they just want as many points as they can grab. You won't find them carefully documenting their answers because that takes too much time and skill. They wouldn't be the first to answer the question and would thus have the odds reduced of having their answers selected.


with this:
Christine Andersen wrote:
In all honesty, I owe a lot of my KudoZ points to my former office colleagues, but some are not members of ProZ.com. at all, while others are not very active... and I am an unabashed points grabber!

Now I appreciate Christine may only be referring to particular questions, but the above does not make a healthy impression IMO.

Christine Andersen wrote:
If you can answer a KudoZ question, grab the points

Again, it would be unfair to condense Christine's comments to the above, but I just don't see this approach as helpful.
a) A quickly posted answer might turn out to be wrong when the wider context becomes clear. I have seen questions closed too quickly by Askers (and let's be honest, some colleagues are clearly out of their depth) who have been misled by points-grabbers.
b) Potentially valuable contributors are put off by the "I was first!" mentality after seeing their input overlooked, and soon lose interest in Kudoz. I know a couple of colleagues where this is the case.

There's nothing wrong with a bit of healthy competition, but there comes a point where it's of no help to the Asker and can even be counter-productive.

As for collusion? I can't say I've seen a concrete example, BUT I have definitely witnessed cases of people giving the points to "friends". I then just don't bother asking any of such Askers' questions ...

p.s. @ Kim: I'm preparing a question to post on Kudoz: check your mail-box ...


 

John Cutler  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 08:02
Spanish to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Getting what I paid for Mar 2, 2007

Hi again, I've already said that I'm happy at proz and now even more.
I've read each person's entry in the forum and have learned something from each one. That's why I joined and paid the fee to be a member; I wanted to know more of what was going on "out there" in the world of translating. It's worth hearing (reading) the various comments and especially those that give good explanations (Kim M.. Fernando T.).
In the end, I'm not convinced that collusion doesn't occur, but it's nice
... See more
Hi again, I've already said that I'm happy at proz and now even more.
I've read each person's entry in the forum and have learned something from each one. That's why I joined and paid the fee to be a member; I wanted to know more of what was going on "out there" in the world of translating. It's worth hearing (reading) the various comments and especially those that give good explanations (Kim M.. Fernando T.).
In the end, I'm not convinced that collusion doesn't occur, but it's nice to know that moderators or others will do something about it.
To tell the truth, I'm actually becoming quite a "browniz" fan. I'm having a good time putting together personal glossaries, and all the other ways there are of obtaining the browniz points.
If anyone has or can direct me toward glossary compilation or software, please give a shout.
Thanks all
John
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