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Thread poster: Libero_Lang_Lab

Nathalie M. Girard, ALHC (X)  Identity Verified
English to French
+ ...
Mutual love between two people is like a fire Dec 15, 2002

I think we must have buried him alive Au!!!



Well, these thoughts are from *yours truly*, and this actually came in my sleep last night in a very vivid dream (all comments are welcome & feel free to add on to it!)... Dan, is this profound enough for you?





\"Mutual love is like a fire - there are only a few options:



1) If one of the two persons does not pay attention to that mutual love, takes it for granted and turns his/her back on it: The flame may simply extinguish itself, running out of fuel to live on. This person runs the risk that he/she won\'t be able to revive that precious flame one day when they decide that they really need/want it...once it has gone cold, that particular flame is gone for ever. You can try to start another fire from the ashes, but will it ever be the same?





2) If one of the two persons has a habit of wanting to keep a few different fires alive at the same time (!): The wind may rise in the neighborhood and around one of these fires, blow on it, activate it, make it run wild, join with the other fire, burn everything on their path before running away out of sight, leaving you totally alone behind...alone and cold, with everything burnt around you... One should only tend to one fire at a time otherwise accidents may happen, the same goes for that special love.





3) If both people mutually decide to truly respect, care and feed that special love every single day, the flame will burn eternally rich and beautiful for the rest of their lives - giving light, comfort, joy, beauty, it will feed both (giving them inner strength) and keep them warm eternally... There is nothing more beautiful to see a warm strong burning mutual fire between two people.\"




- Nathalie Girard-Grace December 15, 2002





Have a wonderful Sunday filled with love...



Yours truly,

Nath

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-12-15 13:08 ]


 

Aurora Humarán (X)  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 08:38
English to Spanish
+ ...
Jorge Luis Borges.... worth the time.... :-)))) Dec 16, 2002

Words to be enjoyed...

I highlighted my favourite ones.

What about the last one? Wow....

Have a Monday!

Au





It may be that universal history is the history of the different intonations given a handful of metaphors.

\"The Fearful Sphere of Pascal\"



Every novel is an ideal plane inserted into the realm of reality.

\"Partial Magic in the Quixote,\"



A book is more than a verbal structure or series of verbal structures; it is the dialogue it establishes with its reader and the intonation it imposes upon his voice and the changing and durable images it leaves in his memory. A book is not an isolated being: it is a relationship, an axis of innumerable relationships.

\"A Note on (toward) Bernard Shaw\"



A man sets out to draw the world. As the years go by, he peoples a space with images of provinces, kingdoms, mountains, bays, ships, islands, fishes, rooms, instruments, stars, horses, and individuals. A short time before he dies, he discovers that the patient labyrinth of lines traces the lineaments of his own face.

Afterword to El hacedor, 1960



This was the first time Remington rifles were used in the Argentine, and it tickles my fancy to think that the firm that shaves me every morning bears the same name as the one that killed my grandfather.

Autobiographical essay 1970



Of course, like all young men, I tried to be as unhappy as I could -- a kind of Hamlet and Raskolnikov rolled into one.

Autobiographical essay 1970



I found America the friendliest, most forgiving, and most generous nation I had ever visited. We South Americans tend to think of things in terms of convenience, whereas people in the United States approach things ethically. This -- amateur Protestant that I am -- I admired above all. It even helped me overlook skyscrapers, paper bags, television, plastics, and the unholy jungle of gadgets.

Autobiographical essay 1970



Truly fine poetry must be read aloud. A good poem does not allow itself to be read in a low voice or silently. If we can read it silently, it is not a valid poem: a poem demands pronunciation. Poetry always remembers that it was an oral art before it was a written art. It remembers that it was first song.

Lecture entitled \"The Divine Comedy,\" 1977



Films are even stranger [than theater], for what we are seeing are not disguised people but photographs of disguised people, and yet we believe them while the film is being shown.

Lecture entitled \"The Divine Comedy,\" 1977



The aesthetic event is something as evident, as immediate, as indefinable as love, the taste of fruit, of water. We feel poetry as we feel the closeness of a woman, or as we feel a mountain or a bay. If we feel it immediately, why dilute it with other words, which no doubt will be weaker than our feelings?

\"Poetry,\" 1977



A writer -- and, I believe, generally all persons -- must think that whatever happens to him or her is a resource. All things have been given to us for a purpose, and an artist must feel this more intensely. All that happens to us, including our humiliations, our misfortunes, our embarrassments, all is given to us as raw material, as clay, so that we may shape our art.

\"Twenty Conversations with Borges”



One of the schools in Tlön has reached the point of denying time. It reasons that the present is undefined, that the future has no other reality than as present hope, that past is no more than present memory . . . Another maintains that the universe is comparable to those code systems in which not all the symbols have meaning, and in which only that which happens every three hundredth night is true.

\"Tlön, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius\"



Nowadays, one of the churches of Tlön maintains platonically that such and such a pain, such and such a greenish-yellow colour, such and such a temperature, such and such a sound, etc., make up the only reality there is. All men, in the climactic instant of coitus, are the same man. All men who repeat one line of Shakespeare are William Shakespeare.

\"Tlön, Uqbar, Orbis Tertius\"



I cannot think it unlikely that there is such a total book on some shelf in the universe. I pray to the unknown gods that some man -- even a single man, tens of centuries ago -- has perused and read this book. If the honor and wisdom and joy of such a reading are not to be my own, then let them be for others. Let heaven exist, though my own place may be in hell. Let me be tortured and battered and annihilated, but let there be one instant, one creature, wherein thy enormous Library may find its justification.

\"The Library of Babel\"



It seemed incredible that this day, a day without warnings or omens, might be that of my implacable death.

\"The Garden of Forking Paths\"



What one man does is something done, in some measure, by all men. For that reason a disobedience committed in a garden contaminates the human race; for that reason it is not unjust that the crucifixion of a single Jew suffices to save it.

\"The Form of the Sword\"



That history should have imitated history was already sufficiently marvellous; that history should imitate literature is inconceivable. . . .

\"Theme of the Traitor and Hero\"



There are no moral or intellectual merits. Homer composed the Odyssey; if we postulate an infinite period of time, with infinite circumstances and changes, the impossible thing is not to compose the Odyssey, at least once.

\"The Immortal\"



No one is anyone, one single immortal man is all men. Like Cornelius Agrippa, I am god, I am hero, I am philosopher, I am demon and I am world, which is a tedious way of saying that I do not exist.

\"The Immortal\"



Do you want to see what human eyes have never seen? Look at the moon. Do you want to hear what ears have never heard? Listen to the bird\'s cry. Do you want to touch what hands have never touched? Touch the earth. Verily I say that God is about to create the world.

\"The Theologians\"



I have always imagined that Paradise will be a kind of library.

\"Poema de los Dones\"



\"Being with you and not being with you is the only way I have to measure time.\"

\"The Threatened One\"



Not granting me the Nobel Prize has become a scandinavian tradition; since I was born -August 24, 1899- they have not been granting it to me.



I am not sure that I exist, actually. I am all the writers that I have read, all the people that I have met, al the women that I have loved; all the cities that I have visited, all my ancestors . . . Perhaps I would have liked to be my father, who wrote and had the decency of not publishing. Nothing, nothing, my friend; what I have told you: I am not sure of anything, I know nothing . . . Can you imagine that I not even know the date of my death?



 

Arthur Borges
China
Local time: 19:38
English
+ ...
Need such a line exist? Dec 17, 2002


On 2002-12-12 12:57, amh wrote:

Correct me if I\'m wrong, but hasn\'t the fine line between sanity and madness

gotten finer?





David Cooper and RD Laing had loads to say on the subject.



 

Libero_Lang_Lab  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:38
Member (2006)
Russian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
"You can't fool me... Dec 17, 2002

there ain\'t no such thing as a Sanity Clause.\"



As Chico Marx once said on being read a contract by lawyer Groucho in \"At the Circus\"

[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-12-17 15:46 ]


 

Jacek Krankowski (X)  Identity Verified
English to Polish
+ ...
The last one, Au? Dec 17, 2002

About the Scandinavian reservations: Did Borges try to make us understand that literature should not have anything to do with politics? A tough question! I am touchy about this...

 

Aurora Humarán (X)  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 08:38
English to Spanish
+ ...
Borges and the Nobel Prize... Dec 17, 2002

Tough subject my friend...very tough...Let´s see what a humble translator and greedy reader can think of... to somehow figure out what Borges tried to say, or tried not to say (do not forget that Borges is considered as the creator of Fiction as a literary genre, followed by ufff... Cortazar, Ecco et al).



Being Jorge Luis Borges such an important part of my world ... I have many times wo/andered about the decision not to give him the Nobel Prize. He himself wrote a lot about that, it was not a subject he would avoid or set aside, on the contrary.

And famous/great writers also devoted lines and lines to try to understand the Academy´s decision not to give him the prize.



Borges was very often questioned and criticized in my country for not getting involved in politics (although he was clearly anti-Peronist) So, judging from his non-political attitude, I guess that (in these words we are commenting...) he may be trying to say what you suggest, that literature should have nothing to do with politics (i.e. a writer´s political position should have no influence on a jury considering the possibility of giving him or not a literary prize). Idea which I strongly second. Borges was criticized after his visit to a polemic South American president and some people think, this may have discouraged the Academy from giving him the (deserved) prize.



This is what I think, dear Jacek. A humble translator, a greedy reader and one of Borges (many) admirers.



But...he should have been awarded the prize, shouldn´t he?



Tough question.... Your call....



Au







[ This Message was edited by: on 2002-12-17 22:38 ]


 

Jacek Krankowski (X)  Identity Verified
English to Polish
+ ...
Dear Au, Dec 18, 2002

Yes, Borges deserves the Nobel prize!



(We also had in Poland for years a very strong candidate, Zbigniew Herbert, who did not live to seet this materialize.)



I am not in a position to judge the whole situation, though, because I do not know all the details and, in particular, I do not know how Borges himself felt about visiting Pinochet, etc.



My feelings about dictators are very clear because they come from having lived in a totalitarian state myself. So when a delegation of Polish nerds went to London to pay homage to Pinochet in that hospital, I could not believe idiocy in politics could go that far.



Having said that, I have to refrain from making any comments about the meaning of Borges\'s travel because, as I said, I do not know all the circumstances. I agree that for a free spirit like himself, having been warned by the Nobel Committee not to undertake that trip may have meant he had to go to show everyone that politics should not interfere with literature. Yet, my general feeling is that ANY visible person should be careful about his/her actions because they are subject to a particular scrutiny.



As far as our political choices go, one of our Nobel prize winners in literature I like very much also participated in the communist literary realities of her times, because it was so to say \"normal\" (well, it would not have been so for me) 50 years ago to do so. Time has revealed, though, how wrong that \"normalcy\" was. Again, I do not know how Borges felt about Pinochet and whether his opinions evolved over time as details of atrocities were revealed.



When in the field of arts, I definitely appreciate artists based on the value of their work. I love Picasso and no information about his mistreating women can detract me from admiring him. No trip undertaken by Borges can belittle him as a writer in my eyes!


 

Jacek Krankowski (X)  Identity Verified
English to Polish
+ ...
This is getting "lighter and lighter side of translation" Dec 18, 2002



[ This Message was edited byn2002-12-18 08:40]

[ This Message was edited by:on2002-12-18 08:41]


 

Aurora Humarán (X)  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 08:38
English to Spanish
+ ...
Borges and Pinochet Dec 18, 2002

Dear Jacek,



For different reasons or in different ways Argentina has also been a totalitarian state for many years. So my feelings about dictators are probably the same as yours, principally about Augusto Pinochet and the Argentine military dictators.



I have Borges´ comments on his visit to Pinochet but...where? I´ll look for these words which I remember as a \"different approach\" if not an explanation or an excuse.




I may take more time than I wished, as I can´t remember the book or file where that paragraph was, but I´ll be back with his words.



I agree 101% with you about artists´ personal lives and their artistic production.




I could not believe my eyes when I read one of Wagner´s biographies...but then... are we interested in his selfishness / his ego or the masterpieces he left behind?

We may even conclude that some great men (creators that for certain reasons are out of the media) have their black parts (let´s agree we all have those unconfessed sides, our Mr. Jekyls) even blacker... a price Somebody imposes on them to somehow \"compensate\" a certain Special Gift?



Nice talking with you, my dear Polish friend

Au



[ This Message was edited by:on2002-12-18 09:45]


 

Jacek Krankowski (X)  Identity Verified
English to Polish
+ ...
Yes Dec 18, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-12-18 09:27, amh wrote:



some great men have their black parts ... a price Somebody imposes on them to somehow \"compensate\" a certain Special Gift?





Very true!

 

Kay Fisher (X)
German to English
+ ...
just a few more... Dec 18, 2002

\"The past is a foreign country. They do things differently there.\" from L.P. Hartley\'s book The Go-Between



\"If we knew what we were doing, it wouldn\'t be called research.\" -Albert Einstein



Opportunity is missed by most people because it is dressed in overalls and looks like work. -Thomas Edison



Even if you are on the right track, you will get run over if you just sit there. -Will Rodgers



\"If at first an idea is not absurd, then there is no hope for it.\" by Albert Einstein







 

Aurora Humarán (X)  Identity Verified
Argentina
Local time: 08:38
English to Spanish
+ ...
Albert the Great.... Dec 18, 2002

Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen.





God does not care about our mathematical difficulties. He integrates empirically.





Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.





Do not worry about your difficulties in mathematics, I assure you that mine are greater. (I wouldn´t be so sure Albert...)





I like to think that the moon is there even if I am not looking at it





All religions, arts and sciences are branches of the same tree





And my favourite:



I do not know with what weapons World War 3 will be fought, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks and stones...





Albert Einstein


 

Jeremy Smith  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:38
French to English
+ ...
:) Dec 18, 2002

\"Into the face of the young man who sat on the terrace of the Hôtel Magnifique at Cannes there had crept a look of furtive shame, the shifty, hangdog look which announces that an Englishman is about to speak French\" (PG Wodehouse - The Luck of the Bodkins)



***



\"If a man, standing in the middle of a forest, says something, and no woman can hear him, is he still wrong?\" (Woody Allen)



***



Reporter (in a telegram): How old Cary Grant?

Cary Grant (in reply): Old Cary Grant fine. How you?


 

Nathalie M. Girard, ALHC (X)  Identity Verified
English to French
+ ...
:-))) Dec 18, 2002

Quote:


On 2002-12-18 14:17, Jeremy Smith wrote:



***



\"If a man, standing in the middle of a forest, says something, and no woman can hear him, is he still wrong?\" (Woody Allen)



***







Mais bien entendu!!!! But of course!!!!







Good one!



Nath

 
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