New letters of the alphabet
Thread poster: Gül Kaya

Gül Kaya  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:50
Turkish to English
+ ...
Jun 21, 2013

Don't know if this is quite the place for this but if not I'm happy to be told off.

I was emailed this by a colleague. Aside from the Ottoman Star Wars theme (awesome enough in itself) the writer is implying that the letter V, which doesn't exist in classical Arabic, has been added to the alphabet to accommodate Vodaphone. I find this hard to believe. Surely this isn't true@

http://burritojustice.com/2013/06/10/دارث-فادر-darth-fader/


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Ty Kendall  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:50
Hebrew to English
Seems to be a Kurdish borrowing... Jun 21, 2013

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ve_(Arabic_letter)

Its use seems to be pretty restricted though (to the transliteration of foreign words).

[Edited at 2013-06-21 12:22 GMT]


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Yael Ramon  Identity Verified
Israel
Local time: 08:50
German to Hebrew
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Indeed - but not quite new!!! Jun 21, 2013

i found this passage in the Hebrew Wikipedia for the term "Arabic":
לצורך כתיבת עיצורים שאינם קיימים בערבית בעת כתיבת שמות לועזיים, משתמשים דוברי הערבית באותיות ערביות קרובות או באותיות שאולות מן הפרסית. כך למשל, העיצורים בי"ת רפה, פ"א דגושה וגימ"ל, שאינם קיימים בשפה הערבית, ייכתבו כ-ﻑ, ﺏ ו-ﻍ (בהתאמה) או כ-ڤ, پ ו-چ (בהתאמה)

In English: for consonants that don't exist in Arabic, such as in Latin names (V, P, Gu/Ga/Go), Arabic speakers use close or "borrowed" letters from the Persian Alphabet. such as ڤ, پ or چ.

However, this explanation does not appear in the English version of the same term in Wikipedia. wonder why...


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Balasubramaniam L.  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 12:20
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
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Interesting question Jun 21, 2013

In the case of Hindi, we we have had a new vowel entering our alphabet in recent years. This is ऑ (which represents the o sound in words like doctor (the first o)). This sound does not exist in Hindi. With more and more English words creeping into Hindi, the need to include this new vowel was acutely felt and it is now almost universally accepted.

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Susanna Garcia  Identity Verified
Local time: 07:50
Italian to English
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WELSH Jun 21, 2013

How about CH then - ;;ike the German?

http://www.madog.org/dysgwyr/gramadeg/gramadeg1.html

NPS DDA

Suzi


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Balasubramaniam L.  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 12:20
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
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The story of India Jun 22, 2013

It is said that India got this name (India) because the Arabs could not pronounce Sindhu correctly because the "S" sound does not exist in Arabic. Sindhu (known to English speakers as the Indus) is the first big river that people coming from the west of India encounter. The Arabs pronounced it as Indus and the people living near it were called by them as Indus which later became Hindus. and the land of the Indus became India. The Arabs didn't go beyond the Indus and most of them settled in what is today Sindh. Of course, there were many merchant Arabs settled in other coastal areas of India such as those of Kerala, and these Arabs had reached there thousands of years ago, much before the rise of Islam. They reached India by sea routes.

With the Arabs these geographical terms spread the world over, and I think the crusades had a lot to do with this mingling of cultural and scientific knowledge. Things like the zero and the decimal system went from the Indians to the Arabs and from them to the Western world, triggering off the renaissance and other knowledge revolutions in Italy first and later in Britain and other parts of Europe.

[2013-06-22 02:19 GMT पर संपादन हुआ]


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esperantisto  Identity Verified
Local time: 09:50
Member (2006)
English to Russian
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Something wrong about the story Jun 22, 2013

Balasubramaniam L. wrote:

It is said that India got this name (India) because the Arabs could not pronounce Sindhu correctly because the "S" sound does not exist in Arabic.


The Arabic language does have it. In fact, it has two s sounds, a normal and an emphatic one represented by س and ص. So, the story seems to be wrong.


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Ty Kendall  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 07:50
Hebrew to English
Indeed Jun 22, 2013

esperantisto wrote:

Balasubramaniam L. wrote:

It is said that India got this name (India) because the Arabs could not pronounce Sindhu correctly because the "S" sound does not exist in Arabic.


The Arabic language does have it. In fact, it has two s sounds, a normal and an emphatic one represented by س and ص. So, the story seems to be wrong.


One of the most renowned Arabic words contains it (Salaam), not to mention الإسلام (iSlam) and مسلم‎ (muSlim).

The Greeks did traditionally lack a voiceless alveolar sibilant though, although not in all dialects (Cypriot Greek has it, for example).

[Edited at 2013-06-22 20:03 GMT]


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Balasubramaniam L.  Identity Verified
India
Local time: 12:20
Member (2006)
English to Hindi
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The India story - More Jun 23, 2013

Here are two links on this topic:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_India


http://www.indiamike.com/india/chai-and-chat-f73/how-did-india-get-its-name-trivia-t10997/


The first sort of corroborates Ty's comment, in that it is early Greek that lacked the S sound.

According to the second, it is Persian, which is a sister language of Sanskrit. In Persian, Sindhu is pronounced as Hindu and the land where this river flows became Hindustan (Hindu + stan, stan meaning land). This term was later picked up by the Arabs when they conquered Persia.

So I was in error when I attributed the lack of S sound to Arabic. It is in fact either Greek or Persian.

[2013-06-23 05:00 GMT पर संपादन हुआ]


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