Double Dutch
Thread poster: Williamson

Williamson  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 08:31
Flemish to English
+ ...
Jan 22, 2006

or Dutch perceived by a student of the language.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/4631362.stm

Unlike in German, where the neue Rechtschreibung was introducted and nothing much changed (?) eversince,in Dutch,the "Taalunie" (association of professors and professionals of Dutch) finds it necessary to change the spelling every 5 years. Difficult to keep up. By the time, you assimilated the changes of the previous five years, you can start all over again.

[Edited at 2006-01-22 10:06]


Direct link Reply with quote
 
RHELLER
United States
Local time: 01:31
French to English
+ ...
why eliminate hyphens? Jan 22, 2006

It does sound difficult, especially if they make a lot of changes.
I wonder why they eliminated hyphens? In English, they make complicated sentences much easier to understand.


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Gerard de Noord  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 09:31
Member (2003)
German to Dutch
+ ...
Short long-distance runner Jan 22, 2006

Rita Heller wrote:

It does sound difficult, especially if they make a lot of changes. I wonder why they eliminated hyphens? In English, they make complicated sentences much easier to understand.


Many native English speakers aren't sure whether they should spell e.g. proof-read, proofread or proof read.

In the Dutch speaking countries we have the same problem. The general rule is: compound nouns are written as one word, with the following exceptions...

In principle this makes our lives easier, because there are far less exceptions now and we now have better rules to incorporate barbarisms (mostly Americanisms). In practice: since three weeks we have to spell 'humanresourcesmanagement' en 'freelancevertaler'...

Regards,
Gerard


Direct link Reply with quote
 
RHELLER
United States
Local time: 01:31
French to English
+ ...
I don't really see your point Jan 22, 2006

As you know, many forms of English exist. Each of us chooses a standard to follow (UK or U.S.). The hyphenated proof-read is more often found in the UK, and when used in the U.S., usually indicates the writer is a Brit or was educated abroad. (10% immigrants in the U.S.)

proof-read
• verb - read (printer’s proofs or other material) and mark any errors.

— DERIVATIVES proof-reader noun.
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/proofread?view=uk
--------------------------
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000.

proofread
TRANSITIVE VERB: To read (copy or proof) in order to find errors and mark corrections.
INTRANSITIVE VERB: To read copy or proof for purposes of error detection and correction.
-----------------------------------------------
proof
ADJECTIVE: 3. Used in proving or making corrections.
VERB: Inflected forms: proofed, proof·ing, proofs
http://www.bartleby.com/61/65/P0596500.html

re: barbarisms
humanresourcesmanagement
was that a joke?

[Edited at 2006-01-22 17:39]


Direct link Reply with quote
 

avantix  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 09:31
German to Dutch
+ ...
Time will tell Jan 22, 2006

Rita Heller wrote:

re: barbarisms
humanresourcesmanagement
was that a joke?

[Edited at 2006-01-22 17:39]


Unfortunately, Rita, this was not a joke!! However, there is quite some resistance against the latest rules. Leading language professionals (e.g. newspaper/magazine punblishers) have already announced that they are not going to implement these.

Obviously those "language experts" a) do either not have any "common sense feeling" with regard to the function of language or b) want to see the Dutch language die a.s.a.p. to be replaced by English. Well, that's only a personal opinion, of course.

To be honest, the Dutch language has quite some illogical rules. What to think about the sentence: A number of people IS walking in the street (opposite to: Ten people ARE walking...). Just because some GREAT THINKER once found out that the subject in this sentence is NUMBER and not PEOPLE and number is not a plural word. As a consequence, these days many people (even the tv-news readers) say: Half a million Dutch HAS (because they consider 'half' to be the subject!!) but 499.000 Dutch HAVE, etc. etc.

But do not despair: I will certainly write human resources management in future, as I do today.

And to Williamson: You're wrong! The official rules don't change every 5 years. It's only every 10 years.

Herman de Kruyff


Direct link Reply with quote
 

Csaba Ban  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 09:31
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
A Hungarian example Jan 23, 2006

You may wonder why this would be relevant to this topic. Hungarian too has a very large number of compound words, most of them mirror translations from German.

In Hungary, it's the Academy of Sciences that determines spelling, by issuing an official list of correctly spelled words as well as a set of clearly defined rules. These do not change very often. The famous "11th edition" came out around 1980 and was in power until very recently. The most recent edition includes several neologism, but the underlying principles remain unchanged.

As for the spelling of long compound words, we have the so-called 6/2 rule. A compound word should be written without any hyphens as long as it does not exceed 6 syllables or 2 elementary words. Anything longer than 6 syllables or consisting of at least three elementary words should be spelled with a hyphen to facilitate reading and understanding.

Now, the application of these (and other spelling) rules is a different thing. As a mass producer and reader of texts, I am shocked to see that in the past 10 years or so, there is an ever-increasing number of cases of poor and illogical spelling, even in respected printed and online media.

Csaba


Direct link Reply with quote
 


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Double Dutch

Advanced search






SDL Trados Studio 2017 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 250,000 translators.

SDL Trados Studio 2017 helps translators increase translation productivity whilst ensuring quality. Combining translation memory, terminology management and machine translation in one simple and easy-to-use environment.

More info »
CafeTran Espresso
You've never met a CAT tool this clever!

Translate faster & easier, using a sophisticated CAT tool built by a translator / developer. Accept jobs from clients who use SDL Trados, MemoQ, Wordfast & major CAT tools. Download and start using CafeTran Espresso -- for free

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search