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How much money and time have you lost because of undocumented/unprofessional reviews?
Thread poster: Eleftherios Kritikakis

Eleftherios Kritikakis  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 06:02
Member (2003)
Greek to English
+ ...
Jun 9, 2009

Thoughts about a future Software Suite (are you listening SDL?)
Yes, this is a "money matters" topic. More than most.

We all waste a lot of time (money) to entertain the different versions of sentences that the "client's reviewers" send to us.

Source (English): "I saw the light turning green"
Translator (in Greek): "I saw the light turning green".
Reviewer 1 (Gr): "I looked and the light turned green"
Reviewer 2 (Gr): "When I looked, the light turned green"
Reviewer 3 (Gr): "The light turned green when I looked"
etc etc.
Project manager: "I don't speak Greek so I can't tell."

Translator: "What if we ask the reviewers to explain their changes?".

Voice in the background: "No, because it will prove that some of them are just trying to generate business unethically, and their suggestions worth nothing, and who wants that".

However: In the future, translation software will be able to provide us with lots of different versions of the same sentence.

The translator will click on a button (Options --> Tools --> Versions) and the software will produce 100 alternative translations to send to the client - all of them valid, and some of them with variations of the terms as they are in dictionaries, google, databases, etc.

The translator will send all of them to the agency. If the client comes back with something different, then the translator will go to "Options --> Tools --> Advanced --> 10,000 Versions".

To Translators: How much money and time have you lost because of such undocumented/unprofessional reviews so far?

To Project Managers: How much time have you lost because of such undocumented/unprofessional reviews so far? Isn't it annoying? Your job is difficult anyway, and those reviewers are making it even more difficult.

To Agency Owners: How much money have you lost because of such undocumented/unprofessional reviews so far?

(of course you could just ask the reviewers and editors to do what you paid them for: document and explain their work - but since nobody's asking, let's just wait for that software).



[Edited at 2009-06-09 01:51 GMT]

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2009-06-09 04:38 GMT]

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2009-06-09 04:38 GMT]


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Yasutomo Kanazawa  Identity Verified
Local time: 20:02
English to Japanese
+ ...
As they say... Jun 9, 2009

PM: It's completely Greek to me!

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Jack Doughty  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:02
Member (2000)
Russian to English
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As we say... Jun 9, 2009

Reviewer 1 (English): It's all Greek to me!

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Steven Capsuto  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 07:02
Member (2004)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Not an issue Jun 9, 2009

Maybe it's because I'm selective about who I work for, but this is not a problem I've experienced.

On the rare occasions when a client complains about the difference between synonymous sentences, it takes about 30 seconds to explain the situation and that's that.


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Aniello Scognamiglio  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 13:02
English to German
+ ...
... Jun 9, 2009

Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:

However: In the future, translation software will be able to provide us with lots of different versions of the same sentence.



...to make translation life more complex and complicated? No, thanks, Eleftherios!
My opinion is that the world needs more professional translators and less translation tools in the hands of amateurs (generally speaking).

The translation goal is not to have a lot of different versions of the same sentence but to hit the nail on the head at the first shot.


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Eleftherios Kritikakis  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 06:02
Member (2003)
Greek to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Didn't get it Jun 9, 2009

Dear Aniello,

My posting is supposed to be humorous. It's supposed to say "if reviewers base their critique on synonyms and paraphrasing/rephrasing, then let's give them 10,000 versions in advance to keep them busy for a while so that they leave us alone".

"The translation goal is not to have a lot of different versions of the same sentence..."


Reviewer 1: The goal of the translation is not to have many different versions...

Reviewer 2: It is the goal of a translation not to have many different versions...

Reviewer 3: Many different versions is not the goal of a translation...

See my point? Then they come to you and they tell you "please comment on the reviewer's changes for free - he got paid, but you won't."


What if I could send them 100 versions from the beginning, along with a message "chose any version you like and leave me alone".







[Edited at 2009-06-09 06:58 GMT]


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Williamson  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:02
Flemish to English
+ ...
Define Jun 9, 2009

Aniello Scognamiglio wrote:

Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:

However: In the future, translation software will be able to provide us with lots of different versions of the same sentence.



...to make translation life more complex and complicated? No, thanks, Eleftherios!
My opinion is that the world needs more professional translators and less translation tools in the hands of amateurs (generally speaking).

The translation goal is not to have a lot of different versions of the same sentence but to hit the nail on the head at the first shot.


OT:
Define: "Professional translator".
Define ": to hit the nail on the head at the first shot": If you give a sentence to translate to five different persons, you will get five different versions.


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Spencer Allman
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:02
Finnish to English
Common problem Jun 9, 2009

The unncessary alteration of sentences by revisers is a common problem and needs to be satmped out.

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Laurent KRAULAND  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 13:02
French to German
+ ...
My definition Jun 9, 2009

Williamson wrote:

OT:
Define: "Professional translator".
Define ": to hit the nail on the head at the first shot": If you give a sentence to translate to five different persons, you will get five different versions.


If you give a sentence to translate to 5 different professional translators, they will hit the nail on the head at the first shot, although their translations may vary from one translator to the other.
There would not be any need to edit those translations as per using false tenses, making countersenses, using inappropriate vocabulary, over-translating, and so on.

Laurent K.


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 13:02
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Wrong target user Jun 9, 2009

Eleftherios Kritikakis wrote:
The translator will click on a button (Options --> Tools --> Versions) and the software will produce 100 alternative translations to send to the client - all of them valid, and some of them with variations of the terms as they are in dictionaries, google, databases, etc.


On a more serious note (well, I hope not!), perhaps you should target reviewers themselves. Instead of "10 000 Versions", let the program come up with "Random version for all random selection of sentences in text".


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 13:02
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Off-topic? Jun 9, 2009

Spencer Allman wrote:
The unncessary alteration of sentences by revisers is a common problem and needs to be satmped out.


Since this is a humorous post, does that mean serious discussion of the topic is now off-topic?


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Laurent KRAULAND  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 13:02
French to German
+ ...
Approved! Jun 9, 2009

Samuel Murray wrote:

On a more serious note (well, I hope not!), perhaps you should target reviewers themselves. Instead of "10 000 Versions", let the program come up with "Random version for all random selection of sentences in text".


Change approved, Samuel! There's no possible discussion over randomness. It "just happens"... except if the reviewers are in for some deep mathematical search on how "it just happens". I guess they are not.

Laurent K.

[Edited at 2009-06-09 07:45 GMT]


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Martin Wenzel
Germany
Local time: 13:02
English to German
+ ...
The explosive pile... Jun 9, 2009

When I worked for a translation agency in London, I detected two different meanings in my source sentence, so I asked a colleague...My colleague came up with another interpretation of his own (not just different stylistic translation – we are talking about fundamental interpretations of a neat short sentence embedded in context). We asked another translator, who actually found a forth interpretation. I eventually put a translator's note explaining that the source text could be interpreted in various ways a, b, c and d...

This colleague of mine used to collect the translations she wasn't sure about 100% in a pile, which she called her explosive pile, because she was expecting a customer to complain at any time. I asked her if she spent lots of sleepless nights because of this. Her reply was sometimes, but I started to smoke to compensate...

Well, anyway, I found this explosive pile theory quite funny...because it never exploded while I worked there.

If it was possible and feasible moneywise, translators should check each other's work, I believe, perhaps, as a result, there would be less explosive piles and fewer smokers...

I am very suspicious of the reviewers agencies employ these days because they MUST FIND something, as they want to keep their jobs...

Eleftherios, I agree with you that if the project managers haven't got a clue about the respective languages they are handling, they may be wasting a lot of company money...


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Giles Bickford  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:02
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
Blimey Jun 9, 2009

I had a few minutes to spare while waiting for my wife to decide on which shoes to wear and I spent it going through this thread. Well, there's five minute of my life I won't see again. Who are you all that you have time for such nonsense?

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Steven Capsuto  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 07:02
Member (2004)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Amen Jun 9, 2009

Giles Bickford wrote:

I had a few minutes to spare while waiting for my wife to decide on which shoes to wear and I spent it going through this thread. Well, there's five minute of my life I won't see again. Who are you all that you have time for such nonsense?



When posting humor, please mark it as such for the benefit of the folks who don't have time for this stuff.

Thanks!


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