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word count : % for repetitions
Thread poster: François-Xavier Pâque

François-Xavier Pâque
Belgium
Local time: 13:10
Member (2010)
Russian to French
+ ...
Jul 29, 2009

Hi, i'm new to the independant translation market and I would need your help

What do people understand by "let us know what is your % for repetitions" ?

Do they mean the money we charge for the already translated repetitive TU or something else i don't fathom ?

thank you !!


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Russell Jones  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:10
Italian to English
CAT analysis Jul 30, 2009

Hi François-Xavier

CAT tools have an analysis feature which tells you the number of words in repeated or similar segments.
Some clients, especially agencies, expect you to offer a discount on these as they object to paying twice for the same phrases.
Some translators believe that only they should benefit from the increased efficiency that their investment in a CAT tool has provided.
Some are prepared to consider such discounts on a case by case basis.
I hesitate to suggest typical discounts but, on occasion, I have offered 67% on 100% matches and 50% on 75%+ matches - for a regular client on specific jobs that appeal to me and warrant such a discount - but only on request.
HTH

Russell


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Neil Coffey  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:10
French to English
+ ...
I don't give a discount for repetitions Jul 30, 2009

Admittedly, I work almost exclusively with direct clients so I don't get asked this too often. But just out of interest, does anybody just answer "I don't give a discount for repetitions"?

Just because a word/phrase/sentence is repeated doesn't necessarily mean it'll have the same translation each time. If THEY want to take the risk that the translation wll be the same, then as far as I'm concerned, THEY can cut out the repetitions and paste back the translation later...!


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Russell Jones  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:10
Italian to English
Yes but ... Jul 30, 2009

Neil; I take the same approach as you most of the time. To be fair, though, François-Xavier is not asking whether we do or don't discount, he just wants to understand the principle and, as a Newbie (to freelancing), it is something he will certainly be faced with.

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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 08:10
English to Portuguese
+ ...
I do, but... Jul 30, 2009

Neil Coffey wrote:
"I don't give a discount for repetitions"


I never give any discount whatsoever for fuzzy matches, however I give repetitions absolutely free only when:
a) The job involves more than 5,000 words, and
b) payment is COD.

So far, nobody ever showed interest.


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Franco Cappelletti
Local time: 13:10
English to German
+ ...
Excellent argument... Jul 30, 2009

Neil Coffey wrote:

Admittedly, I work almost exclusively with direct clients so I don't get asked this too often. But just out of interest, does anybody just answer "I don't give a discount for repetitions"?

Just because a word/phrase/sentence is repeated doesn't necessarily mean it'll have the same translation each time. If THEY want to take the risk that the translation wll be the same, then as far as I'm concerned, THEY can cut out the repetitions and paste back the translation later...!



which I have not thought of so far. You are absolutely right. If they do not wish to pay for repetitions, you will not be able to charge your translation of the term "Seller", which may appear 80 times in a sale and purchase agreement, more than once. (The same would apply to words like "and", "or", or "if", which do appear quite often in any text.)

So - gross word count be and remain final word count and not be deducted to some "net word count" (without repetitions).


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LegalTransform  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 07:10
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Discounts on a case-by-case basis Jul 30, 2009

I do not use CAT tools, but if I did, I would not offer a discount for repetitions (especially for text I did not translate). Instead, I would modify the system I currently use:

If a text contains a few repeated sentences, headings or paragraphs here and there, I will not discount for those. Charging by "the word" is a convenient way to bill, but has nothing to do with how difficult a text is. Each individual "word" does not take me the same amount of time and effort to translate. Therefore, even if technically I earn more per word on some words (ex: because of a few repetitions), it all balances out in the final price for the job.

Having said that, if there are several pages of exact duplication inside of a large document (ex: multiple contracts that are essentially the same except for the parties involved, object of the contract, price, etc.), I do not offer a discounted rate for this text, but instead, I will lower my final word count by an amount of my choosing. This amount will not be a fixed percentage, but based on how difficult and time-consuming it was for me to check the repeated text to make sure that there are no small, minor changes as well as the difficulty level of the non-repeated text. In other words, if the text is a very difficult one, I will deduct fewer words for repetitions and vice-versa.

In this manner, I can always make sure that the final invoice represents the amount of time and effort I put into each individual project. Clients are usually happy because their final bill is less than they expected.

[Edited at 2009-07-30 21:23 GMT]


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Russell Jones  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:10
Italian to English
We're straying of topic Jul 30, 2009

François-Xavier asked:
What do people understand by "let us know what is your % for repetitions" ?


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 08:10
English to Portuguese
+ ...
OOPS! Maybe I was misunderstood Jul 30, 2009

I don't charge for COMPLETE SEGMENTS repeated. What I mean is that if the same section or chapter title is repeated on every page of that part, on the the TOC, again in the index, etc. for jobs over 5,000 words and COD payment, I'll charge each of them only once.

I won't be retranslating them, the CAT tool will be just keeping consistency.


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Narasimhan Raghavan  Identity Verified
Local time: 16:40
English to Tamil
+ ...
Is it my fault whenever there are repetitions? Jul 31, 2009

Repetitions are not under my control. They are there for a reason that was important for the original writer. In which way am I then concerned here? I never agree to repetitions being charged less for translating.

I make this clear to all my prospective clients and so far I have never given any discounts. And I get a lot of assignments, thank you.

Regards,
N. Raghavan


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chica nueva
Local time: 00:10
Chinese to English
previous 'rates_considering_word_repetitions' thread Jul 31, 2009

Russell Jones wrote:

François-Xavier asked:
What do people understand by "let us know what is your % for repetitions" ?


Perhaps this is a similar topic (with some extra links): http://www.proz.com/forum/money_matters/140654-rates_considering_word_repetitions.html


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 08:10
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Some confusion about REPETITIONS Jul 31, 2009

Translation rates are usually per word. A repetition is considered a whole segment - viz. phrase, sentence - repeated.

A CAT tool like WordFast (and I guess Trados too) will analyze a text and say that there are X repeated segments, which comprise Y words.

As the total price is calculated multiplying the per-word rate by the word count, any discount on repetitions would apply to the quantity of words in repeated segments, and not the words repeated alone throughout the whole text.

Repeated segments are a no-brainer. In WordFast, it's just an Alt+DnArrow to accept repeating the previous segment translation.


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Lingua 5B  Identity Verified
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 13:10
English to Croatian
+ ...
Same in English- Different in Serbo-Croat Jul 31, 2009

Neil Coffey wrote:

Just because a word/phrase/sentence is repeated doesn't necessarily mean it'll have the same translation each time. If THEY want to take the risk that the translation wll be the same, then as far as I'm concerned, THEY can cut out the repetitions and paste back the translation later...!


Precisely. Especially with languages such as mine where there are case/number/gender aspects and phrases easily change forms in various contexts, while staying the same IN ENGLISH. Clients fail to realize that. Therefore, I only offer discounts if there are fixed paragraphs ( entire paragraphs) repeating in a document.


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