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Receiving wages via Paypal - who pays the fees?
Thread poster: Anna ZANNELLA

Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
Aug 7, 2011

I know this might sound like an obvious question, but who pays the Paypal fees for receiving wages via Paypal? (Ive looked through Proz but the data base is dense nowadays I cant find anything specific)

I accept that I will have to pay to convert the currency from the Currency of my Invoice to the currency of which ever account I withdraw it into, but just to receive it?

I thought payroll costs were the employer's costs?

I dont remember people being billed for paper envlopes and the price of printing a payslip, and I have never had an employer deduct the cost of a bank transfer, whether domestic or international.

Im just wondering what the general consensus is for Paypal? (Obviously this has just happened to me. Paypal fees were deducted from my wages).

Thanks.


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 13:10
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

MODERATOR
Why do you think so? Aug 7, 2011

Anna ZANNELLA wrote:
I thought payroll costs were the employer's costs?

I dont remember people being billed for paper envlopes and the price of printing a payslip, and I have never had an employer deduct the cost of a bank transfer, whether domestic or international.


Why do you think so? For the outsourcer, paying the transfer costs means paying you more than agreed. This may be of no problem for the outsourcer, and there may be various solutions, however you need to agree such things with the outsourcer beforehand.


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Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
EXCUSE ME? Aug 7, 2011

Ive never had to pay an employer to receive my wages via bank transfer which is how it is done now, and Ive never been charged Paypal fees before

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Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
And Bank Transfers? Aug 7, 2011

Do you ask your employer if you have to pay to receive your wages via bank transfer? NO. Why? Because its the employer's payroll cost? Why is Paypal different?

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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 04:10
English to German
+ ...
Please clarify Aug 7, 2011

Anna ZANNELLA wrote:

Ive never had to pay an employer to receive my wages via bank transfer which is how it is done now, and Ive never been charged Paypal fees before



Your profile page states "freelancer" which means that you are nobody's employee (i.e. a full-time employee at a translation firm or an in-house translator at any other business). Therefore you are not receiving any wages, but you are acting as a business entity and your overhead expenses - in this case bank or Paypal fees - should be included whenever you calculate your rates.


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xxxhazmatgerman
Local time: 13:10
English to German
clarification Aug 7, 2011

needed: are you talking about "wages", i.e. payment for hourly work received by a permanent employer or are you talking about "payment" for services rendered? In the latter case see N.Schnell's post.
Regards.


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Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
Stick to bank transfers then .... Aug 7, 2011

This is the first time in 9 years that I have paid to receive a payment as a Freelancer, whether it was though Paypal or through Bank transfer. I just thought was understood all this time. Isnt that amazing.

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LEXpert  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 06:10
Member (2008)
Croatian to English
+ ...
"Wages"? "Employer"? Aug 7, 2011

If you're receiving the payments for your work by PayPal, I'm going to go out an limb (hopefully not a too short one) and surmise that you are not actually an employee, but a freelancer. If that's true, the party sending you money is not your employer but your customer, and what an "employer" would or wouldn't do for an employee isn't relevant in any way.

Just deal with PayPal fees like any other expense - build it into directly your fee for the job, negotiate for the sender to pay the fee (good luck with that, though...), or build it into your overhead.


[Edited at 2011-08-07 21:48 GMT]


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Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
USA Aug 7, 2011

Well in Italy or in Europe I have never paid a fee to receive a wage or a paymet for any one-off job because of the medium used, including Paypal.

Usually if you want to pay an Invoice or pay for goods using merchant services, if you are not paying by cash, YOU pay for the use of a credit card or whatever. The service provider gets exactly what they charge on their invoice, no less.

As I said, Ive never had to negotiate this fee before.

Well now I know.

THANKS


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2G Trad  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Member (2000)
English to Italian
+ ...
Negotiation Aug 7, 2011

If you don't want to pay Paypal fees for receiving payments, when you make arrangements and negotiate your rates with your clients, you can say them you charge an extra fee for Paypal payments.

I suggest you to clarify all these payment conditions with your clients (especially with extra-EU clients) BEFORE starting any project.

Some extra-EU clients have the bad habit to charge you even for a bank transfer, but they just tell you when they are ready to send the payment...

That's why I automatically raise my usual rates when I deal with extra-EU clients. In this way, I can cover all their payment charges.

Bye!
Gianni

[Edited at 2011-08-07 22:21 GMT]


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LEXpert  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 06:10
Member (2008)
Croatian to English
+ ...
Your example is backwards Aug 7, 2011

Anna ZANNELLA wrote:

Well in Italy or in Europe I have never paid a fee to receive a wage or a paymet for any one-off job because of the medium used, including Paypal.

Usually if you want to pay an Invoice or pay for goods using merchant services, if you are not paying by cash, YOU pay for the use of a credit card or whatever. The service provider gets exactly what they charge on their invoice, no less.

As I said, Ive never had to negotiate this fee before.

Well now I know.

THANKS


Um, no. You've got it backwards. It's the BUYER who pays the SELLER exactly what is on the SELLER'S invoice, and the SELLER bears their own costs associated with receiving the chosen method of payment. Have you ever used a credit card to pay for anything and ended up paying the merchant more than the stated/billed cost? I'd be on the phone to my credit card company's fraud division in a heartbeat if that ever happened to me.


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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 04:10
English to German
+ ...
Usually you don't negotiate this expense Aug 7, 2011

Anna ZANNELLA wrote:

As I said, Ive never had to negotiate this fee before.


You know where your customer is located and what kind of fees for incoming moneys to expect. If your customer is located on a different continent for example, you know that Paypal will deduct 3.8% plus the currency exchange rate from every amount you receive and if you don't want to swallow that amount (such expenses are tax deductible, though), then you have to increase your rate a little bit. Negotiating such small percentages with a customer looks a bit odd and needy.

PS. As a freelancer you are also on nobody's payroll.


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Alexandre Maricato
Brazil
Local time: 09:10
Member (2009)
English to Portuguese
Receipt of the money = cost of doing business Aug 7, 2011

When you pay your bills at the bank or use a credit card, the amount payable is exactly the stated one.

Unless the banks/credit card companies are very kind and receive the payment for free (bearing all the costs associated with the "receipt of the money"), someone has to pay for them.

Who pays?

You = the client, who pays for the services

The service provider = the one who issued the bill/invoice

I agree with you: it is very weird to think that banks/credit card companies are interested on making money and that service providers should account for such costs...


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Anna ZANNELLA
Italy
Local time: 13:10
Italian to English
TOPIC STARTER
USA only Aug 7, 2011

Rudolf Vedo CT wrote:
Um, no. You've got it backwards. It's the BUYER who pays the SELLER exactly what is on the SELLER'S invoice, and the SELLER bears their own costs associated with receiving the chosen method of payment.


that's IN THE USA ..... not necessarily everywhere else in the world ....

If you buy something from an Italian online pharmacy for example, you pay according to the method YOU SELECT to pay with. You can COD, or you can pay by credit card or you can sometimes pay by bank transfer, .... but EACH has a different cost associated with HOW you pay. Not all do this, but many do. Its added to the delivery cost. If you pay CASH then of course there's no question.

In the USA only .....

... can you imagine what the UNIONS would do over here if a person employed to do a one off casual job was charged to receive his wages??? Ive worked for plenty of Italian and UK agencies, with and without any kind of signed formal collaborative contract, and NOT ONE of them has charged me to receive my payment. Ever. Whether I had a VAT number or was just an 'occasionale' ....

In the USA only .....

Try travelling to Italian or German cities with a Credit Card and see how far you get in terms of purchasing goods with it. .... You'd also be hard pressed to find to two ATMs within 500m of each other even in central Milan.

So my question really just highlights what you should be aware of when dealing with the USA perhaps.

[Edited at 2011-08-07 23:13 GMT]

[Edited at 2011-08-07 23:13 GMT]

[Edited at 2011-08-07 23:15 GMT]

[Edited at 2011-08-07 23:33 GMT]


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Tina Vonhof  Identity Verified
Canada
Local time: 05:10
Member (2006)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Negotiate Aug 7, 2011

PayPal has been charging me fees right from the start. When my bank completes a transaction for me, I have to pay the fees too. When I pay by credit card, the seller pays the fees. If you want the buyer (your client) to pay the fees, you would have to negotiate that before you accept the job but I think most would refuse.



[Edited at 2011-08-08 00:44 GMT]


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