Incorrect VAT number on French agency's web site
Thread poster: Samuel Murray

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 00:00
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Apr 30, 2017

G'day everyone

On the web site of a French client of mine, they give their VAT number and business registration number as follows:
SIRET 222 333 444 55555 - TVA FR 11 222 444 55555 - R.C. B 222 333 444
(I changed the actual numbers for this post)

But I have learnt the hard way that one must always check new clients' VAT numbers on VIES before issuing the invoice, because you don't want to realise that the VAT number is wrong by the time you do your tax returns. And of course, "FR 11 222 444 55555" turned out to be an invalid VAT number. I also had no luck finding them in the French chamber of commerce register.

I'm not alone, it turns out. According to this helpful article:
On more than one occasion, I have had issues obtaining a valid intracommunity VAT number (numéro de TVA intracommunautaire) from French clients or service providers. ... Sometimes I have been given a 16-digit or 14-digit number instead of an 11-digit number. This is because the client or service provider is confusing their VAT number with their SIRET number.
...I was eventually able to figure out what their actual VAT number is: FR 11 222 333 444

Samuel


 

Ricki Farn
Germany
Local time: 00:00
Member (2005)
English to German
Interesting! Apr 30, 2017

Is there a general rule for deriving the VAT number from the other ones?

 

Nikki Scott-Despaigne  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:00
French to English
France: SIREN and SIRET Apr 30, 2017

The SIREN number comprises 9 digits: 123 456 789
The SIRET number comprises 14 digits: 123 456 789 00011
My SIREN number has been the same since 1994, when I set up. Successive changes of address have not altered the SIREN number, but the last five digits of the SIRET number have changed each time I have changed address.

The EU VAT number is based on the SIREN number. It is preceded by FR, and then, in my case, one number and then one letter, thus: FR0A 123 456 789. So my European VAT number comprises 13 digits.

No, there is no general rule. The FR is the obvious bit. As for the number and the letter that follow, I had to ask my tax office to provide me with the number. I don't think it can be guessed at or worked out.

[Edited at 2017-04-30 22:11 GMT]


 

Tomás Cano Binder, BA, CT  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 00:00
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Always good to check in advance May 1, 2017

In order to avoid any issues with your international clients' VAT, it is best to check yourself in the "VIES VAT number validation".

You can do so easily here:
http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/vies/


 

Christine Andersen  Identity Verified
Denmark
Local time: 00:00
Member (2003)
Danish to English
+ ...
Danish companies can be found in the Companies Register, CVR May 1, 2017

You type in the name of the company and click. If that doesn't work, e.g. if you have not spelled it exactly as registered, or you don't know the exact name, try the owner or the street address.

https://datacvr.virk.dk/data/

The CVR number = VAT number will be shown.

There is an English option if the Danish is not clear enough.

I don't know any rule for 'guessing' or working it out, but it always has 8 digits. Mine is DK 27093892
It is not the same as the 8-digit phone number.


 

Lori Cirefice  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 00:00
French to English
Always check vies May 2, 2017

For new clients, and once a year for long-standing clients.

But shouldn't have noticed earlier? Do you not have monthly intracom vat declarations like we do in France (DES)?


 

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 00:00
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
@Lori May 3, 2017

Lori Cirefice wrote:
But shouldn't have noticed earlier? Do you not have monthly intracom vat declarations like we do in France (DES)?


Quarterly. Which was when I noticed it.


 

cvz
France
Local time: 00:00
French to Dutch
+ ...
this site helps May 4, 2017

http://www.ebsoft.org/mambo/ressources/clefs.htm

For French companies you type in the SIREN (which you can always find on Internet) and this site will give you the correct VAT of that company


 

Adelaida López  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 00:00
English to Spanish
+ ...
Proz VAT number invalid Jan 17

Does anyone know about the Vat number of Proz that is not registered into VIES? Did you have the same problem when you did the annual tax?

 

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 00:00
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
@Adelaida Jan 17

Adelaida López wrote:
Does anyone know about the VAT number of Proz that is not registered into VIES?


VIES contains only EU VAT numbers. If ProZ.com does have a VAT number, it aint an EU one.


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 23:00
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
On the contrary Jan 17

Samuel Murray wrote:
VIES contains only EU VAT numbers. If ProZ.com does have a VAT number, it aint an EU one.

I believe VIES contains the VAT numbers issued by the member states, whereas the VAT number that ProZ.com uses is an EU-issued one. This is because the company is registered in the US but nevertheless needs a VAT number as it collects so much money from individuals in EU member states (aka us icon_smile.gif).

[Edited at 2018-01-17 16:07 GMT]


 

Adelaida López  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 00:00
English to Spanish
+ ...
EU VAT Number Jan 17

Thanks both.

Why they have an EU VAT number starting with two letters that do not belong to a specific country but to the European Union and when you make a payment you can deduct yourself this VAT as they were registered (21 % in my case)?
The problem arises later when you are doing the annual tax with the government and they do not accept PROZ as an European VAT company registered on VIES. I have just received a letter from the taxation office telling me that I cannot include this company for a taxation deduction and I have to redo all my paperwork, as I have done many purchases with ProZ.

I read in a thread that they had registered in Germany and I put the German country code instead of the EU, but still is not valid. I attach the doc; in any case anyone can help or had the same case and how they proceeded.

Thanks in advance and sorry for my ignorance in this case.

Ade

q2wemg1y5rre4x3ogwfx.jpg

[Edited at 2018-01-17 19:48 GMT]


 


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Incorrect VAT number on French agency's web site

Advanced search







Déjà Vu X3
Try it, Love it

Find out why Déjà Vu is today the most flexible, customizable and user-friendly tool on the market. See the brand new features in action: *Completely redesigned user interface *Live Preview *Inline spell checking *Inline

More info »
SDL Trados Studio 2019 Freelance
The leading translation software used by over 250,000 translators.

SDL Trados Studio 2019 has evolved to bring translators a brand new experience. Designed with user experience at its core, Studio 2019 transforms how new users get up and running and helps experienced users make the most of the powerful features.

More info »



Forums
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search