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Consequences of "no deal" Brexit for freelance translators in the UK?
Thread poster: Samuel Espinho-Alves

Dan Lucas  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
IDLR? Dec 12, 2018

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote:
I'm not going to get a British passport... because... I'm not British and I don't feel British. ...

Very sensible - my wife feels the same way. Indefinite leave to remain, then?

Dan


 

Peter Shortall  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:49
Member
French to English
+ ...
Considering a move in the opposite direction Dec 12, 2018

I think Tom is right, there is just no way of being certain at this point about what will result from a UK exit from the EU with no deal in place. I fully expect that to happen eventually (after a second referendum) as there appears to be no majority in parliament for either a deal or no deal.

Because of that, and since you say that most of your clients are in the EU, personally I would try to put off the decision to come to the UK for a while longer if I were you, if your circumsta
... See more
I think Tom is right, there is just no way of being certain at this point about what will result from a UK exit from the EU with no deal in place. I fully expect that to happen eventually (after a second referendum) as there appears to be no majority in parliament for either a deal or no deal.

Because of that, and since you say that most of your clients are in the EU, personally I would try to put off the decision to come to the UK for a while longer if I were you, if your circumstances allow you to wait. I'm in the opposite situation to yours, I'm thinking of moving to the Canaries or mainland Spain and spending as much of the year there as I can. I would have to decide whether I will keep trading through my UK company or set myself up as an autónomo in Spain, and still haven't come to a decision. A significant proportion of my business comes from France, but UK clients also make up a large share. Luckily I have Irish citizenship as well as UK citizenship, so my right to live in Spain won't be affected, but there is still the question of cross-border trade.

The only conclusion I can come to at the moment is that now probably isn't the best time to be moving my business base from one country to another, I don't want to do anything that will be difficult to undo when the circumstances change!

[Edited at 2018-12-12 22:05 GMT]
Collapse


 

Chris S  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Swedish to English
+ ...
No way Dec 13, 2018

Tom in London wrote:
From now on I would advise any young British person: be careful not to fall in love with anyone from an EU member state. Don't marry them, don't have children with them. Don't think of studying in any university outside the UK. And if you really must go somewhere else in Europe, make sure you have private medical insurance. And don't think of working there, or anything like that.


And yet I managed to do all of those things in the days before the EU...

This is all way too Deadly Express. Name me one country that has no foreigners living and working in it. None of the possible Brexit outcomes involves chucking anyone out, or stopping EU citizens coming in.

I think it fair to say that the anti-immigration lobby in the UK only really wants to stop immigration from Asia and Africa, principally Muslims, and in some quarters Eastern Europe.

Remember that neither party in the UK actually wants or wanted Brexit, so they're not going to start coming over all UKIP/BNP all of a sudden. I wouldn't expect any problems for educated Western Europeans, much as there aren't for educated Americans today.

So much scaremongering. The media should be ashamed.


Jennifer Forbes
Thomas T. Frost
Dan Lucas
Thomas Pfann
Christine Andersen
Chris Spurgin
 

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
yes Dec 13, 2018

Dan Lucas wrote:

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote:
I'm not going to get a British passport... because... I'm not British and I don't feel British. ...

Very sensible - my wife feels the same way. Indefinite leave to remain, then?

Dan


After 28 years, I'm pretty sure I have indefinite leave to remain... I will still have to re-apply, though...


 

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
nope Dec 13, 2018

Chris S wrote:

Remember that neither party in the UK actually wants or wanted Brexit, so they're not going to start coming over all UKIP/BNP all of a sudden. I wouldn't expect any problems for educated Western Europeans, much as there aren't for educated Americans today.

So much scaremongering. The media should be ashamed.


Well, all sorts of stories are emerging about the behaviour of the home office regarding immigration and the hostile environment created under May, when she was the Interior Minister... definitely NOT scaremongering...


B D Finch
Tom in London
Gareth Callagy
Daryo
Helen Shiner
 

B D Finch  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 13:49
Member (2006)
French to English
+ ...
Disaster Dec 13, 2018

Tom in London wrote:

Sheila Wilson wrote:
What a total mess


I still think it isn't going to happen.


I wish I agreed!
I'm trying to be an ostrich, but think the sand is running out.


Chris S
Sheila Wilson
 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Unravel Dec 13, 2018

B D Finch wrote:
I wish I agreed!
I'm trying to be an ostrich, but think the sand is running out.


I just don't think it's possible to unravel 43 years of legislation and jurisprudence. A close look at T. May's proposed agreement reveals thousands and thousands of unresolved, and unresolvable matters.

[Edited at 2018-12-13 09:53 GMT]


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:49
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
But when will the close look be? Dec 13, 2018

Tom in London wrote:
I just don't think it's possible to unravel 43 years of legislation and jurisprudence. A close look at T. May's proposed agreement reveals thousands and thousands of unresolved, and unresolvable matters.

I entirely agree with that, Tom. But I have a nasty feeling that those matters won't get looked at until after 29/3/2019 and the UK is in some sort of half-way house or totally adrift. What will happen then is anyone's guess, but it won't be pretty.


 

Kay Denney  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 13:49
Member (2018)
French to English
alienation Dec 13, 2018

[quote]Sheila Wilson wrote:

Tom in London wrote:
We still struggle with the Spanish language, but we'll do everything we can to qualify for citizenship (in four years' time) if it's necessary to avoid losing our rights. In fact, if we could we'd renounce British citizenship tomorrow, very gladly, whatever the eventual outcome. Being denied a vote in our future has well and truly alienated us. !



How long do you have to live in Spain to qualify for citizenship?
I believe the Spanish government announced that the Brits are welcome to stay?

I fully agree about the alienation, I no longer want anything to do with England. (My son is in Scotland.)

You actually have to pay to renounce your British nationality (yes, I checked!).

Samuel, I reckon the biggest headache would be to actually settle in the UK, since you'd be a TCN (third country national). Unless you're married to a Brit or have British parents or children, it'll probably be a muddled process for a good while until reciprocal agreements have been reached with each separate EU member state. This is a point on which each state retains full sovereignty, the EU cannot help.

Editing to add that you'd be better off making the move before Brexit, it'll be harder to make you leave than prevent you coming.

[Edited at 2018-12-13 10:16 GMT]

[Edited at 2018-12-13 10:17 GMT]


 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2008)
Italian to English
A closer look Dec 13, 2018

Sheila Wilson wrote:

Tom in London wrote:
I just don't think it's possible to unravel 43 years of legislation and jurisprudence. A close look at T. May's proposed agreement reveals thousands and thousands of unresolved, and unresolvable matters.

I entirely agree with that, Tom. But I have a nasty feeling that those matters won't get looked at until after 29/3/2019 and the UK is in some sort of half-way house or totally adrift. What will happen then is anyone's guess, but it won't be pretty.


Here's a summary of some of the things that will not work.

http://tinyurl.com/ybt4ergm


 

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2004)
English to Italian
My view Dec 13, 2018

I believe we will end up with a Norway style agreement, which is like being in the EU without all the advantages... it works fine for Norway, since there's only 5.2 millions of them and they have oil... not sure how it will work out for the UK... with 66 millions...

Tom in London
 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:49
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
I was around before the EU too Dec 13, 2018

Chris S wrote:
And yet I managed to do all of those things in the days before the EU...

The world we live in today is pretty much unrecognisable from those days. People expect mobility nowadays - for everyday work and family reasons - whereas in those days only a small percentage crossed national borders at all, and then mostly for one holiday a year. All the laws are different, people's expectation of safety and their legitimate fears about safety are far different, everything's electronic... No, you can't just turn the clock back 40+ years in one country and expect things to mesh.

None of the possible Brexit outcomes involves chucking anyone out, or stopping EU citizens coming in.

Really? I believe people have already been chucked out of the UK. There have been a number of people who have lived there for most of their lives and yet have suddenly been deemed to be unwanted immigrants. Not just Windrush-related, either. Many non-UK women brought up kids there with their UK partners and now, following a divorce/death, they find that because their partner was the only breadwinner they have no official status there. But no, I haven't heard of any British citizens being chucked out of the EU countries.

I think it fair to say that the anti-immigration lobby in the UK only really wants to stop immigration from Asia and Africa, principally Muslims, and in some quarters Eastern Europe.

And for that we have to leave the EU??? Other countries have been managing immigration and the Freedom of Movement provisions: registration, ID cards, health cards...

So much scaremongering. The media should be ashamed.

I totally agree! The lies about the EU and immigrants have been an absolute disgrace.


Kay Denney
Teresa Borges
Helen Shiner
Isabelle Defévère
Christine Andersen
 

Chris S  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Swedish to English
+ ...
Alienation Dec 13, 2018

Kay Denney wrote:
I fully agree about the alienation, I no longer want anything to do with England.

Ironically, I think that's what led to Brexit...


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:49
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
@ Giiovanni and Kay Dec 13, 2018

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote:
I believe we will end up with a Norway style agreement, which is like being in the EU without all the advantages... it works fine for Norway, since there's only 5.2 millions of them and they have oil... not sure how it will work out for the UK... with 66 millions...

That would be better than a hard Brexit, although a ridiculous waste of money and influence. But the Norwegians have officially flatly rejected that idea. They don't want the UK being a thorn in their side.

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote:
How long do you have to live in Spain to qualify for citizenship?
I believe the Spanish government announced that the Brits are welcome to stay?

I don't believe they'll be chucking out anyone who's officially registered here, although in some cases individual officials, who either don't read their own rule books or have personal axes to grind, are being very difficult already when dealing with British residents. CAB in Spain, who don't receive any government support, are helping many "unofficial" residents to get their status formalised. The qualification period for citizenship is normally 10 years, but some countries' citizens qualify after a shorter period so there's a chance they'll make an exception.


 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 12:49
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Oil Dec 13, 2018

Giovanni Guarnieri MITI, MIL wrote:

I believe we will end up with a Norway style agreement, which is like being in the EU without all the advantages... it works fine for Norway, since there's only 5.2 millions of them and they have oil... not sure how it will work out for the UK... with 66 millions...


The UK has oil too but they have squandered the proceeds from it. Norway, very intelligently, created an "oil profits fund" (or something).


 
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