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Happy New Year from Proz. Non-paying members become paying non-members. Enter the 'Quote Fee'.
Thread poster: writeaway

writeaway  Identity Verified
Dutch to English
+ ...
Jan 3, 2019

Well, for a change, I saw a job posting that tempted me. Naturally it was restricted to paying members but this time, it closed late enough to allow non-paying members to bid.
However once the form was filled out, surprise!! This turned up:
Quote fee: $1 USD (You need to add money to your wallet before quoting.)
Ok, so now it costs a buck to bid. However adding to the 'wallet' can only be done in increments of $20.00 a pop. Plus VAT (21% in my high-tax country of reside
... See more
Well, for a change, I saw a job posting that tempted me. Naturally it was restricted to paying members but this time, it closed late enough to allow non-paying members to bid.
However once the form was filled out, surprise!! This turned up:
Quote fee: $1 USD (You need to add money to your wallet before quoting.)
Ok, so now it costs a buck to bid. However adding to the 'wallet' can only be done in increments of $20.00 a pop. Plus VAT (21% in my high-tax country of residence). I don't pay VAT when I buy from other US firms, but that's another topic.
So people who don't -or who no longer- pay are again paying the price for abstinence and the noose keeps tightening.
A Happy New Year treat I could have done without. Or should I say a New Year surprise. If it was announced in advance, I never saw it. Of course my final membership category (partial-member jobs) and other beneficial features (think use of Browniz to buy BB access) also disappeared without warning so I guess the 'surprise' element is just Proz policy/strategy. Business as she now is in today's cut-throat world.

[Edited at 2019-01-04 00:02 GMT]
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Andy Watkinson
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Rachel Fell  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:25
French to English
+ ...
Well... Jan 3, 2019

I don't usually bid on these jobs, but the idea that you have to pay to do so is quite a disillusioning surprise to me, and then the concept of a "wallet": definitely a marked change in how Proz used to or could be.

Andy Watkinson
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Tom in London
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Vadim Kadyrov  Identity Verified
Ukraine
Local time: 08:25
Member (2011)
English to Russian
+ ...
PROZ is primarily for those who enter the market Jan 4, 2019

This is the only audience which can be talked into paying fees like that - i.e. having a thought that 'if I just win this client this time at any cost, I can have her loyalty forever'. When you don`t know anything about marketing, direct clients, etc., you usually do it like that. And there is nothing wrong with that, you just don`t want to stay in this segment forever.

Once you get several more or less stable clients (either through PROZ, or otherwise), you don`t need PROZ anymore.
... See more
This is the only audience which can be talked into paying fees like that - i.e. having a thought that 'if I just win this client this time at any cost, I can have her loyalty forever'. When you don`t know anything about marketing, direct clients, etc., you usually do it like that. And there is nothing wrong with that, you just don`t want to stay in this segment forever.

Once you get several more or less stable clients (either through PROZ, or otherwise), you don`t need PROZ anymore. And the owners of PROZ are well aware of the fact, so, what they do is that they target precisely this category PLUS people from countries with much lower rates for translation (my country, for example).

Of course it is a crazy idea to pay for being able to quote. But you are not forced to do just that. There are dozens of ways to use PROZ for free and still get clients. Just experiment with its database of outsourcers/translators, for example.

This being said, PROZ is perhaps the best online platform for translators - in terms of community, or Kudoz, or its forum.

[Edited at 2019-01-04 06:36 GMT]

[Edited at 2019-01-04 06:41 GMT]

[Edited at 2019-01-04 06:42 GMT]
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Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 07:25
Member
English to Italian
Simplification Jan 4, 2019

writeaway wrote:

Of course my final membership category (partial-member jobs) and other beneficial features (think use of Browniz to buy BB access) also disappeared without warning so I guess the 'surprise' element is just Proz policy/strategy. Business as she now is in today's cut-throat world.


Additionally, I remember reading someone from staff saying they were getting rid of the different membership categories and options (including paying $1 to bid) in order to simplify things and payments, but then they went on to introduce 2 membership levels and now this, again... Very linear.


writeaway
Richard Varga
 

writeaway  Identity Verified
Dutch to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I thought that $1 thing rang a bell! Jan 4, 2019

Mirko Mainardi wrote:

writeaway wrote:

Of course my final membership category (partial-member jobs) and other beneficial features (think use of Browniz to buy BB access) also disappeared without warning so I guess the 'surprise' element is just Proz policy/strategy. Business as she now is in today's cut-throat world.


Additionally, I remember reading someone from staff saying they were getting rid of the different membership categories and options (including paying $1 to bid) in order to simplify things and payments, but then they went on to introduce 2 membership levels and now this, again... Very linear.


Wouldn't it be great if Proz would also reinstate the use of browniz to pay for bidding and/or to buy access to Blueboard postings?

[Edited at 2019-01-04 11:42 GMT]


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Jean Dimitriadis  Identity Verified
France
Member
English to French
+ ...
Too much, too late Jan 4, 2019

Pay $1… only to arrive late at the party (once the waiting period for non-members has lapsed).

Tom in London
Angie Garbarino
Mirko Mainardi
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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 07:25
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER
@WriteAway Jan 4, 2019

writeaway wrote:
Quote fee: $1 USD (You need to add money to your wallet before quoting.)


Placing a small amount of money into a service that you might want to use one day, is a reasonable business expense. For example, I have $20 sitting in my Skype Call account even though I've only used Skype Call one or twice in the past decade, and I have $20 sitting in my PamFax account for a similar reason. I don't think I can get this money back, but it's a fair price for the convenience of being able to use the services immediately if I should need to use them at short notice.

[Edited at 2019-01-05 19:54 GMT]


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Angie Garbarino  Identity Verified
Member (2003)
French to Italian
+ ...
Change, new? Jan 4, 2019

Rachel Fell wrote:

I don't usually bid on these jobs, but the idea that you have to pay to do so is quite a disillusioning surprise to me, and then the concept of a "wallet": definitely a marked change in how Proz used to or could be.


This not new indeed, I remember when I first registered in 2003, I tried to bid and was requested 1 USD, I then decided to pay for a membership (at the time platinum member).

Nothing new then.


Kay-Viktor Stegemann
 

Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:25
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Shooting in the foot Jan 4, 2019

Rachel Fell wrote:

I don't usually bid on these jobs, but the idea that you have to pay to do so is quite a disillusioning surprise to me, and then the concept of a "wallet": definitely a marked change in how Proz used to or could be.


I think Proz is shooting itself in the foot here. Nobody will pay just to be able to bid. Mad idea !

[Edited at 2019-01-04 13:03 GMT]


 
Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member because it was not in line with site rule

Richard Mendes Ribeiro
Brazil
Local time: 03:25
English to Portuguese
+ ...
In my case Jan 4, 2019

I joined Proz back in April 2018, and the community has been great to me and helped me a lot!

I even meet 2 clients (Translation companies) here, and, even if they don't always send me work, they are good clients, and helped me to start my career.

I was also disappointed when I tried to bid for here and saw that I had to pay $1...

Nowadays I only contact potential clients that post jobs here via e-mail, that worked twice so far after all.

In 2
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I joined Proz back in April 2018, and the community has been great to me and helped me a lot!

I even meet 2 clients (Translation companies) here, and, even if they don't always send me work, they are good clients, and helped me to start my career.

I was also disappointed when I tried to bid for here and saw that I had to pay $1...

Nowadays I only contact potential clients that post jobs here via e-mail, that worked twice so far after all.

In 2019 I'm going to revamp my resume and start contacting translation companies, I will create a professional website for my business, I will be more active on social média and try to find ways to promote myself more! And my main objective will be to build a clientele and forge long-term professional relationships.

The idea is to not need sites like job platforms and Proz to find jobs, and use them just for the community you know? Maybe I'm dreaming too much, but I'm going to try!

Speaking of which, I'm still new around here, and I have 300 Browniz, what can I do with them?

P.S: Thank you, Tom, you gave me some good advice back then and helped me go through some anxious times.
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Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:25
Member (2008)
Italian to English
WHat was that? Jan 4, 2019

Richard Mendes Ribeiro wrote:

P.S: Thank you, Tom, you gave me some good advice back then and helped me go through some anxious times.


Thanks Richard, but I don't remember ! Please send me a private message to remind me


 

Thayenga  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 07:25
Member (2009)
English to German
+ ...
Unlikely Jan 6, 2019

[quote]writeaway wrote:

[quote]Mirko Mainardi wrote:

writeaway wrote:

Wouldn't it be great if Proz would also reinstate the use of browniz to pay for bidding and/or to buy access to Blueboard postings?

[Edited at 2019-01-04 11:42 GMT]


This probably won't happen because ProZ is a business and needs to generate income. However, it would be great if they reinstated it.


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Jared Tabor
Local time: 03:25
SITE STAFF
Dollar quoting has been around a long time. The removal of the browniz option was announced in 2009. Jan 7, 2019

Dollar quoting has been around for much longer, but it was announced that the option to quote via browniz points would be removed about nine years ago now: https://www.proz.com/topic/152417

For those who only very occasionally quote on a posted job and are not interested in the other benefits of membership, wallet deposits can be made (in increments of 20 USD) to cover this. For any remaini
... See more
Dollar quoting has been around for much longer, but it was announced that the option to quote via browniz points would be removed about nine years ago now: https://www.proz.com/topic/152417

For those who only very occasionally quote on a posted job and are not interested in the other benefits of membership, wallet deposits can be made (in increments of 20 USD) to cover this. For any remaining sums not used, a user may request a wallet withdrawal (usually payable via PayPal).

Jared
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Maxi Schwarz  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:25
German to English
+ ...
responding to job requests Jan 7, 2019

I was going to give this the title of "why bid?" but decided to change it to something broader. When I see someone looking for a translation, then as a professional I see it as a request for a service. Just like when I want my annual income tax done by an accountant I look for a competent accountant and he/she tells me his fee (and competence). In that case I'm the one seeking a service. I'm not offering a job to the accountant, and I don't expect him to bid for the privilege of providing me... See more
I was going to give this the title of "why bid?" but decided to change it to something broader. When I see someone looking for a translation, then as a professional I see it as a request for a service. Just like when I want my annual income tax done by an accountant I look for a competent accountant and he/she tells me his fee (and competence). In that case I'm the one seeking a service. I'm not offering a job to the accountant, and I don't expect him to bid for the privilege of providing me with that service.

People seem to take it for granted that we have a relationship (in these types of things) where we are offered something and are supposed to bid (undercut each other) for the privilege of receiving this offered thing. Maybe this is where to start. OP, in another thread you referred to low prices with which folks are undercutting each other in such ventures. That was on my mind when I came to this thread.

It makes no sense to me, if somebody is requesting a service, for me to pay money in order to respond to their request. I would only change my mind about that if it turned out that the $1.00 covered some kind of administrative costs incurred by the host, in relation to that translation request. But then, might not the entity requesting translations be the one to pay such a fee?
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Mirko Mainardi
 
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Happy New Year from Proz. Non-paying members become paying non-members. Enter the 'Quote Fee'.

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