| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8] > | Poll: Would you agree with lowering the weekly limits of KudoZ questions to 45/15 for member/non-members? Thread poster: ProZ.com Staff
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| Why the whole discussion | Jul 29, 2006 |
Mats Wiman wrote:
I hate to see all these negative commentators in various fora vent their spite upon people who are asking for (from their elevated vantage point) too much or too simple help and who are not as professional and knowledgeable as the self-appointed critics.
I still vote for the principle 'live and let live', i.e. do not institute any official limits on anything regarding KudoZ.
Let nature (i.e. the particpants) separate the wheat from the chaff. The can read and separate, can't they?
Aurora Humarán wrote:
no dictionary, book or Internet link will help as much as prozmates do. I have mentioned this a couple of times: in certain fields the speed of life will not help us find answers in any of the above sources.
Well, I admit...
I already asked "silly" questions and I already gave "silly" answers (not that I am happy about it) . I am human and therefore not perfect. Of course Kudoz should be a last resort but it is also supposed to be a unique help tool for translators. I see a certain necessity to restrict the use of it, to keep it under control but feel quiet sad about the whole discussion.
Besides help, I enjoy Kudoz as a place where I can learn things besides my own fields of speciality, where I "meet" other translators and their professional opinions and where I sometimes also learn, that I need to learn more about certain things - that is, why the "proz.com term search" including KUDOZ with all its discussions is a basic research tool for me.
Why should this be further restricted. Personally I would hardly ask up to 60 questions a week (even if I try hard, it seems to be unlikely to get that many questions together) but it is a feeling of a certain freedom and in the end "service to the paying customer" that the possibility exists - how realsitic it might be or might not be.
Rather than voting out "silly" questions (I actually thought there are no silly questions???) or "silly" answers why not finally take step against people that are chronically not grading the answers (I still stumble a lot about that either as answerer or as researcher...)....And for all the "all-knowing" translators around here: we all have started out being translators one day in the (more or less) far, far past - we are not born as it.
Kind Regards,
Stefanie
[Edited at 2006-07-29 14:39]
| | | | Sandra C.
France
Local time: 03:55
English to French
+ ...
| I don't see why all the fuss either... | Jul 29, 2006 |
Lesley Clarke wrote:
I agree with Parrot that it would be nice to work on the Glossary, but as someone who occasionally asks questions and uses the glossary almost daily, I would be happy if more questions were asked so that I could find more answers in the Glossary.
But even if I didn't see that use, I really do not understand why there is so much fuss about the questions and answers. I just don't see it. How does it affect people? Even if people are doing their translations on the basis of asking questions, who does that harm? It strikes me as a very cumbersome way to do a translation.
I totally agree with you, Lesley.
What's the big deal? As far as I'm concerned, it could be unlimited, I could care less; if there's too many questions, I will simply stop providing answers for them!
Live and let live is what I say, too...
There's been so much said already, nothing for me to add.
[Edited at 2006-07-29 14:36]
| | | | | Dear Enrique, | Jul 29, 2006 |
What do you want to achieve with the limitation?
Please enlighten us!
Sven.
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Wow, six pages, and perhaps more else to come!
Kudoz would be more fine, only if "offline" professionals would join us here.
Samy
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Dyran Altenburg (X) 
United States
Local time: 21:55
English to Spanish
+ ...
| I don't care... | Jul 29, 2006 |
...in the sense that I don't do Kudoz, so whatever is decided doesn't really affect me.
But, if I asked/answered terminology questions, and if I paid to be a member, I'd be on the side of those who want quality instead of quantity.
--
Dyran
(who didn't start from scratch)
| | | | Irene N
United States
Local time: 20:55
English to Russian
+ ...
| On a lighter side | Jul 29, 2006 |
In case of "worthy only" questions (i.e. regarded by everyone as truly challenging, last-resort type, rightfully asked by those who claim proficiency in the field etc.), I'm afraid all Kudoz addicts will have to find another toy to play with - there will be ~10 questions per month left in each pair:-)
Cheers,
Irene
| | | | | Leave it as is - what is the benefit of changing? imho... | Jul 29, 2006 |
The more questions, the more in the glossary and database!
If people don't care to answer them, they don't.
I cannot see any benefit to lowering the numbers. There is no obligation to answer someone's questions and frankly, answering questions and the little boost of winning points, motivates some people to use the site more.
If it ain't broke, don't fix it. ; )
| | | | Andrea Hauer
Germany
Local time: 03:55
English to German
+ ...
| Thanks, Stefanie! | Jul 29, 2006 |
Stefanie Neubert wrote:
I already asked "silly" questions and I already gave "silly" answers (not that I am happy about it) . I am human and therefore not perfect feel quiet sad about the whole discussion.
And for all the "all-knowing" translators around here: we all have started out being translators one day in the (more or less) far, far past - we are not born as it.
Kind Regards,
Stefanie
[Edited at 2006-07-29 14:39] [/quote
Thank you very much, Stefanie, for your reply.
I am really surprised that there are sooo many "all-knowing" peers who supposedly never accepted a job and - for whatever reason - got short in time to meet a deadline or who never found out after having accepting a job, that it was at first glance a legal document and found out on page 10 that it turned out to be deeply technical stuff ...
My point of view: Leave it as it is - I think it's very useful to have a limitation. But I agree with Robert who wrote: "On a particularly difficult project, it would be quite possible to reach the15/daily or 60/weekly limit ..." He is right and surely - this should not be the "daily quantity". I consider the "SOS, peers, I haven't slept since two nights, who may help me"-questions (which I've seen rather often) as one reason why proz.com is a really great help to all of us. Even if there are obiously a large number of peers who are perfect - the majority of the peers I know are HUMANS who work extremely professional.
Thanks, Stefanie for your reply! It's just what I felt when reading this sad discussion.
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| ... Hi Andrea | Jul 29, 2006 |
Andrea Hauer wrote:
Thanks, Stefanie for your reply! It's just what I felt when reading this sad discussion.
;O)
You are definitely welcome. Good to have a "partner in crime".
Have a nice weekend.
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Stefanie Neubert wrote: Andrea Hauer wrote:
Thanks, Stefanie for your reply! It's just what I felt when reading this sad discussion. ;O) You are definitely welcome. Good to have a "partner in crime". Have a nice weekend.
I'm with you two. Please, all you advanced, "truly professional" translators, don't cut us off! Answer questions, don't answer questions; help us, don't help us; filter us if you find us annoying. But don't tell us we're not allowed to ask!
I go along with limits; I won't be personally injured if they're lowered, since I've never come close to maxing out. But as Aurora (I think it was Aurora!) said, it's nice to know that I can ask if I need to.
| | | | Irene N
United States
Local time: 20:55
English to Russian
+ ...
| This is not about all-knowing | Jul 29, 2006 |
Just some basics, nothing personal
Andrea Hauer wrote:
> it was at first glance a legal document and found out on page 10 that it turned out to be deeply technical stuff ...
>quite possible to reach the15/daily or 60/weekly limit
1. I accept jobs after a second glance...
2. No, it is not in the true field of expertise. IMHO. When I see this rate of Q rolling at me from the file pages, I suggest to find somebody else. The outcome of such work will be disastrous by definition, noone can learn the subject by collecting a full bag of new terms in 2 days and deliver a decent job on the 3rd.
Sorry.
Irene
[Edited at 2006-07-29 19:39]
P.S. Legal turned technical is never a surprise, and the technical /specific subject matter is to be expected in 95% of all cases - legal/oil, legal/medical, legal/mining, legal/construction, legal/finance - all it takes is to check the industry of the client and think twice - do I know oil transportation enough to translate this contract?
[Edited at 2006-07-29 19:46]
Restrictions - who cares... I don't any more, even though there were times I believed in it. Maybe is because neither myself not Proz have managed to find an effective way to impose them with quality improving results. So what's the point?
[Edited at 2006-07-29 20:13]
| | | | | Nobody's mentioned it, so... | Jul 30, 2006 |
....I thought I would.
I admit I'm not a supporter of the attitude that the Kudoz system is used to help people take on jobs they otherwise wouldn't manage to complete, either through lack of time or lack of willingness or lack of skill to do their own research. But, as others have said, live and let live - the filter exists, I can (and do) ignore them, others ARE willing to help (or do other people's work for them), etc. All well and good - up to point.
But what DOES a... See more ....I thought I would.
I admit I'm not a supporter of the attitude that the Kudoz system is used to help people take on jobs they otherwise wouldn't manage to complete, either through lack of time or lack of willingness or lack of skill to do their own research. But, as others have said, live and let live - the filter exists, I can (and do) ignore them, others ARE willing to help (or do other people's work for them), etc. All well and good - up to point.
But what DOES annoy me is the knock-on effect on other askers when one or two individuals decide to post an entire batch of questions in a short space of time, which is to push earlier questions further down the kudoz questions list, and ultimately off the first page, where they sink into oblivion. Answers are rarely proposed once a question is on page 2 (or later) on the kudiz list, in my experience. Hence I would like to see stricter limits imposed, if only in the interests of giving EVERYONE a fair chance to get answers to their questions. ▲ Collapse
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| Ditto Charlie! | Jul 30, 2006 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
But what DOES annoy me is the knock-on effect on other askers when one or two individuals decide to post an entire batch of questions in a short space of time, which is to push earlier questions further down the kudoz questions list, and ultimately off the first page, where they sink into oblivion. Answers are rarely proposed once a question is on page 2 (or later) on the kudiz list, in my experience. Hence I would like to see stricter limits imposed, if only in the interests of giving EVERYONE a fair chance to get answers to their questions.
That is exactly why I voted yes. On several occassions, my question has been quickly bumped to page 2 after the same person posts 4+ questions in a 5 minute period. It can be frustrating since I generally use kudoz as a last resort. I'm glad you mentioned this, hopefully others will make an effort to space out their questions, regardless of the outcome of the poll.
| | | | Henry Hinds
United States
Local time: 19:55
English to Spanish
+ ...
In memoriam
I vote to leave it the same. Actually, I don't care, the more, the merrier, and like someone wise (was it Mats?) said earlier, time will separate the wheat from the chaff.
Have fun, be happy.
Let's all be glad we're here.
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kero wrote:
I think the present limit is ok. I sometimes have urgent jobs that need to be completed in just a few hours so I do not have enough time to check everything in google and i just use kudoz. Why would users want a reduction?
Wow, this opens up new possibilities - specialise in rush jobs with a 20% surcharge and get the drones on Proz to do all the research. 45 terms a week allows plenty of leeway. Just paste in a sentence or two for some context, forget about the please and thank you - it only wastes time. And I'd not be the only one, we have a few of these people with the German>English combination.
Hmm, on the other hand....
I've always believed that it is not the quality of questions answered that reflects a translator's skills, but the quality of the questions asked because this is where we inevitably reveal the gaps in our knowledge and understanding.
After 25 years of translation, my dictionaries are well-filled and my googling skills are honed so I need less help. I realise that beginners will need to post more questions than old hands, but I think quite a large proportion of the questions could be reduced by simple googling. After all, this will also turn up related texts and reference materials as well. Nevertheless, 45 questions/week is a very high limit and should be sufficient for anyone who has not taken on a translation that is over their heads. Just imagine if 100 or so actually went for this limit in a particular language pair (notably the major languages), the quality of the answers would suffer as no-one would have time to take a look at them all, not even the point grabbers. And with so many up for grabs, Kudoz points would become meaningless; the total would reflect the time spent researching for others rather than actually working.
One thing that does bother me though is the increasing number of "takers" on this site, such as people with over 1000 questions asked and 5 answered. Are they incompetent, selfish or just totally lazy? Is their time too precious to waste on helping others who have helped them? I am all for discouraging such behaviour if possible.
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