Swedish mispronunciations for your scrutiny
Thread poster: Mats Wiman

Mats Wiman  Identity Verified
Sweden
Local time: 00:06
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
+ ...

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Dec 17, 2009

Very often, English words are mispronounced by non-English speaking persons.

Here is a Swedish bouquet:

1. DeveLOPPment instead of deVELLopment.

2. InternaTCHional instead of internashonal.

3. RushIa or AsIa insted of Rusha and Eysha.

4. PrOUject instead of prOject.

5. LOndOn instead of LAndn.

Are the errors prevalent in other language areas or are they typically Swedish?

What say you?

Mats


[Edited at 2009-12-17 13:21 GMT]


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David Wright  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 00:06
German to English
+ ...
Get them all the time in Austrian pronunciation Dec 17, 2009

BUT: since when has London been pronounced Landn?? Without phonetic symbols I would think that the closest is the "u" sound of "fun". Landon strikes me as the typical "cockney" representation, which is not, as far as I know, the standrad pronunciation

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Mats Wiman  Identity Verified
Sweden
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Member (2000)
German to Swedish
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TOPIC STARTER
Quite right David! Dec 17, 2009

Now I made an error myself.

Of course it should be "Lundn". (I slipped into Swedish on this one. Our short a is pronounced like 'u' in 'fun' (Swedish 'katt' (cat) or like the the 'a' like in 'father' (the latter is often heard in Austrian German).

Mats


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Tim Drayton  Identity Verified
Cyprus
Local time: 01:06
Turkish to English
+ ...
'Mosque' in Turkey Dec 17, 2009

Most people in Turkey seem to think that the English word 'mosque' consists of two syllables and pronounce it 'mosk-wee'.

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Paul Dixon  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 21:06
Portuguese to English
+ ...
In Brazil Dec 17, 2009

In Brazil, people also say "deveLOPment" instead of "deVElopment".

Other mispronunciations include ManSHESter instead of MANtchester and putting extra vowels at the beginning (so "school" becomes "eskúúl") or the end of words (so "work" would be pronounced "wâ(r)ki")

There is a series of words where Brazilians sometimes add an extra "a", because of the equivalent Portuguese word. For example: "equipament" instead of "equipment", "apartament" instead of "apartment", "passaport" or "passaportchee" instead of "passport".

I hope this insight is of help.


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david young  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 00:06
Member (2009)
French to English
The French Dec 17, 2009

have the same problem with "development", and correct pronunciation of the French word (DEYvelopment) was one of the hardest for me to master on arriving in France.
Chocolate (chocOlet instead of choclet) is another particularly difficult one for the French.
Perhaps a neurolinguist could explain?


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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:06
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
correct pronunciation Dec 17, 2009

david young wrote:

correct pronunciation of the French word (DEYvelopment) was one of the hardest for me to master


Regarding "dey[sic]velopment", there still might be some room for improvement ... No offence meant, my own pronunciation is far away from perfect. Just couldn't help noticing the ubiquitious English diphthong combined with the reference to "correct pronunciation".

[Bearbeitet am 2009-12-17 10:51 GMT]


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xxxblomguib  Identity Verified
Local time: 21:06
English to Flemish
+ ...
just for a laugh Dec 17, 2009

have a look at this joke about the french pronunciation of EN....the beginning is in Dutch and explains the wife of a french president having to make a speech for the queen of England....she ( the president´s wife) wants to talk about happiness and realizes that the French have a problem with the stressed syllables....so she starts her speech shifting the stress....and this is the result....just sit out the Dutch part until he starts speaking EN.....

of course the link might be useful: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyiWK4vUPyE


[Edited at 2009-12-17 11:09 GMT]


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david young  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 00:06
Member (2009)
French to English
I stand corrected. Dec 17, 2009

efreitag wrote:

david young wrote:

correct pronunciation of the French word (DEYvelopment) was one of the hardest for me to master


Regarding "dey[sic]velopment", there still might be some room for improvement ... No offence meant, my own pronunciation is far away from perfect. Just couldn't help noticing the ubiquitious English diphthong combined with the reference to "correct pronunciation".

[Bearbeitet am 2009-12-17 10:51 GMT]


How does one represent the é phonetically?


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Paul Dixon  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 21:06
Portuguese to English
+ ...
Place Names in the UK - a global difficulty Dec 17, 2009

Brazilians (as, I guess, most visitors to the UK) have great problems with place names in the UK. Who would guess that Leicester is /lésta/, Southwark is /sutthuck/, Holborn is /hoe-bun/ - and in my birth town of Coventry we have Styvechale which is /sty-ch'll/ and Cheylesmore is /charles-more/.

A teacher friend of mine once told me of a situation she faced in London:

Tourist - Could you tell me the way to Leicester /lay-sesta/ Square?
Cop [in the Queen's English, BBC accent] - No, madam. [raising voice somewhat] It's LEICESTER /lésta/ SQUARE - and it's over there!


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Mats Wiman  Identity Verified
Sweden
Local time: 00:06
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
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Phonetics Dec 17, 2009

david young wrote:
How does one represent the é phonetically?


Exactly! Often it is difficult to do it 'in english. TIME Magazine has taught me some things.

Actually I think English-speaking persons would accept 'é' as the pointed close 'e' that it is
like in French loan words 'né/née', 'passé' etc.

Please read my new thread about phonetic alphabets: http://www.proz.com/topic/153623

Mats


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 21:06
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Phonetics over borders Dec 17, 2009

Mats Wiman wrote:
Actually I think English-speaking persons would accept 'é' as the pointed close 'e' that it is
like in French loan words 'né/née', 'passé' etc.


A problem is what an accent means in each language.

In French the acute accent (') stands for a closed sound, on an "E", it should sound like the "A" in "bait". The grave (`) accent stands for an open sound, like the "E" in "get".

In Brazilian Portuguese (in Portugal they barely pronounce the vowels, if ever), the acute accent when justified, stands for an open sound, like "árvore" (="tree"). The grave accent, only on the "A" is when two As are merged together, i.e. "a" (to) + "a" (the, fem.), which we write "à". In the telegraph/telex days it was customary to write "AA". We use the circumflex (^) accent, when justified, for the closed sound, as in "romântico" (=romantic).

So any French pronunciation tip in PT-BR would backfire.

Yet there are interesting situations. The name in French is Hélène.
In Brazil it has no accent: Helena. Nevertleless, down South the first "E" is pronounced closed, while up North, it's wide open. The second one is always closed.
And in English, the "H" gets pronounced!


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Geoffrey Barrow
Local time: 18:06
Norwegian to English
My favourite Norwegian mispronunciation Dec 17, 2009

My favourite is the Norwegian "WARshington" ("war" being pronounced as in "Second World "War"). I have never been able to figure out where that comes from, but it seems to be ubiquitous in the media.

To be honest, having heard some of the ludicrous pronunciations my own son learned in English lessons in Norwegian elementary school, nothing really surprises me.

I also have personal experience from a course in Merkantilt Institutt in Oslo, in which a (Norwegian) lecturer in "English" insisted that there is no difference in pronunciation between "beer" and "bear". Even when I demonstrated the pronunciation of each word, she was incapable of hearing the difference!

Geoff


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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 00:06
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
+ ...
correct phonetic representation is impossible with normal writing Dec 17, 2009

david young wrote:

efreitag wrote:

david young wrote:

correct pronunciation of the French word (DEYvelopment) was one of the hardest for me to master


Regarding "dey[sic]velopment", there still might be some room for improvement ... No offence meant, my own pronunciation is far away from perfect. Just couldn't help noticing the ubiquitious English diphthong combined with the reference to "correct pronunciation".

[Bearbeitet am 2009-12-17 10:51 GMT]


How does one represent the é phonetically?


That indeed is a problem. I think there is no way of representing this sound by writing in English, as it just doesn't occur in English. Without using IPA, maybe you can't come closer than with your suggestion


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Stanislav Pokorny  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 00:06
English to Czech
+ ...
Czech Dec 18, 2009

Hi all,
mispronounced words typical of Czech speakers of English:
1. TONGUE pronounced as TONG'YOO instead of TAŋ
2. HOTEL pronounced as 'HOUTL instead of HOU'TEL

The problem is that the development of English writing stopped much earlier than that of the English pronounciation. In Czech we read as we write, or the other way round, i.e. we've developed diacritics to help us:
ě = ie
š = sh
č = tsh
ř = (approx.) rž
ž = j (as in the French "Jean")
ý = i:
á = a:
í = i:
é = e:
etc...

No problems with words like "through" or "enough" (we would simply write "inaf") the ortography of which has little to do with their actual pronunciation.


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