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German test translation proofread by client
Thread poster: Thomas Zeisler

Thomas Zeisler  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 19:46
Member
English to German
+ ...
Feb 6, 2009

Good morning all,
I'm not sure if this is the right forum, please move the topic if not.


I did a short test translation for a new client, sent the test translation and received a judgement on my translation. I'd like to hear your comments on the translation and the judgement.

This is the original:

Shaft Outside Diameter
Use a micrometer to measure rocker arm shaft diameter in at least four places (Figure 3-15). See Rocker Arm and Shaft on page 6-6 for the service limit.

Inspection of Valve Guides
Guide Inside Diameter
Visually inspect the valve guides for distortions, scoring or other damage.
Use a test indicator and micrometer to measure the inside diameter at each end of the valve guide. See Intake / Exhaust Valve and Guide on page 6-5 for the service limit.
Inspection of Cylinder Head
Cylinder Head Distortion
Place the cylinder head flat and inverted (combustion side up) on the bench. Use a straight edge and feeler gauge to measure the amount of cylinder head distortion (Figure 3-15). See Cylinder Head on page 6-5 for the service limit.


Inspection of Intake and Exhaust Valves
Visually inspect the intake and exhaust valves.
Replace any valves that are obviously discolored, heavily
pitted or otherwise damaged.

Valve Stem Diameter
Use a micrometer to measure the valve stem diameter. Measure the valve stem near the combustion end and near the opposite end (Figure 3-16). See Intake / Exhaust Valve and Guide on page 6-5 for the service limit.


Valve Stem Straightness
Place the valve stem on a flat inspection block or layout bed. Roll the valve until a gap can be observed between a portion of the valve stem and the surface of the block or bed. Use a feeler gauge to measure the gap (Figure 317). See Intake / Exhaust Valve and Guide on page 6-5 the service limit.


This is the german translation I delivered:

Außendurchmesser Achse
Verwenden Sie eine Messschraube, um den Durchmesser der Kipphebelachse an mindestens 4 Stellen zu messen (Abbildung 3-15). Siehe Kipphebel und Kipphebelachse auf Seite 6-6 für die Verschleißgrenze.

Abbildung 3-14
Inspektion der Ventilführungen
Innendurchmesser Ventilführung
Prüfen Sie die Ventilführungen auf Verzug, Riefenbildung oder andere Schäden.
Verwenden Sie eine Messuhr und eine Messschraube, um den Innendurchmesser an beiden Enden der Ventilführung zu messen. Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.

Inspektion Zylinderkopf
Zylinderkopfverzug
Legen Sie den Zylinderkopf flach mit dem Brennraum nach oben auf die Werkbank. Verwenden Sie ein Haarlineal und eine Fühlerlehre um den Verzug des Zylinderkopfes zu messen (Abbildung 3-15). Siehe Zylinderkopf auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.

Abbildung 3-15


Inspektion Ein- und Auslassventile
Prüfen Sie die Ein- und Auslassventile optisch.
Ersetzen Sie alle Ventile, die deutlich verfärbt, stark angefressen
oder auf andere Weise beschädigt sind.

Ventilschaftdurchmesser
Verwenden Sie eine Messschraube, um den Ventilschaftdurchmesser zu messen. Messen Sie den Ventilschaft im Bereich des Ventiltellers und am entgegengesetzten Ende (Abbildung 3-16). Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.

Abbildung 3-16

Geradheit Ventilschaft
Legen Sie den Ventilschaft auf einen ebenen Prüfblock oder eine andere ebene Fläche. Drehen Sie das Ventil, bis ein Spalt zwischen einem Teil des Ventilschafts und der Unterlage festgestellt werden kann. Messen Sie den Spalt mit einer Fühlerlehre (Abbildung 3-17). Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.


This is the comment I got back from the client:
We have checked your sample file but I am afraid to tell you that we found numbers of insufficient words and phrases in your text.
Maby we should meet with other project later.


Thanks for your comments!

Thomas

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2009-02-06 10:40 GMT]


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Rebecca Hendry  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:47
Member (2005)
Spanish to English
+ ...
Why not ask the client? Feb 6, 2009

Hi Thomas,

I don't know German, so can't help with the specifics, but wouldn't it be a good idea to ask the client where these "insufficient words" are? It's all very well for them to reject your test translation, but a little more detail would help you to understand your mistakes, if there are any.

Good luck!

Rebecca.


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Thomas Zeisler  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 19:47
Member
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I've already asked Feb 6, 2009

Hi Rebecca,
I've already sent a mail asking for a copy of the corrected test translation. I'm just curious what other translators say.

Thanks, Thomas

P.S. How's you snow?


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Sushan Harshe
India
Local time: 00:17
English to Hindi
+ ...
The interviewers also may fall short to your knowledge level! Feb 6, 2009

Hi Thomas,
I too have experienced this return in my tests. To me I am well convinced that I hold enough good command over my pairs, I am enough good in technology. What I see is; we are in a field where we can not estimate someone’s knowledge simply by his language proficiency and technology sense. There are many more things, which should be considered while putting someone in reviewers’ role. The person authorizing a translator to review a translator’s job, must have ability to gauge knowledge of the both. Unfortunately, most of the PM’s are unaware about the other important things in translation, other then language proficiency and technology knowhow.
When an agency rejects my test, I simply put it my black list. Keeping in mind that these people are unaware about; logically consistent but practically orthodox translation, End User’s difficulties on understanding such a translated content, users feedback to there clients, and resulting setback to there reputation.
I have learned from experience that, don’t feel nervous just because you are rejected, The interviewers also may fall short to your knowledge level!


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Aniello Scognamiglio  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 19:47
English to German
+ ...
"Insufficient words and phrases" is an "insufficient answer" Feb 6, 2009

Thomas Zeisler wrote:

This is the comment I got back from the client:
We have checked your sample file but I am afraid to tell you that we found numbers of insufficient words and phrases in your text.



Thanks for your comments!

Thomas


I do not understand from your post: Is that all your client said?
"Insufficient words and phrases" is an "insufficient answer".
I'm sorry, I cannot comment on the translation because it's not my area of specialization.

Hopefully, you got paid for your test translation!

My 20 cents
Aniello

[Edited at 2009-02-06 09:51 GMT]


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Roy Williams  Identity Verified
Austria
Local time: 19:47
German to English
Re: proofread Feb 6, 2009

Hello Thomas,

I only translate into english but from reading your german text, I can't see anything that indicates "insufficient wording". Although it's difficult to say since the feedback is vague; it's impossible to know exactly what the client is looking for.

Have they responded to your request for clarification?

[Edited at 2009-02-06 09:53 GMT]


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Thomas Zeisler  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 19:47
Member
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
for free Feb 6, 2009

Aniello Scognamiglio wrote:

Hopefully, you got paid for your test translation!

Aniello


Hi Aniello,
they asked me before starting how much I want for the test, but I said that I do small test translations for free.


The thing is, that I've experienced proofreaders that seem to have to justify the money they get paid and correct more than is neccessary, or aren't even able to evaluate a translation because of their missing specific knowledge.
If, for example my potential client doesn't speak German and the proofreader tells him my translation is rubbish, he can only trust me or trust the proofreader.

And in this certain case it is a pity to loose a potential big job because of a incapable proofreader.

Or my translation is rubbish....

Thomas


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xxxNMR
France
Local time: 19:47
French to Dutch
+ ...
This happens in all language pairs Feb 6, 2009

It also happens that the end client is not a good proofreader.

The question is: can you work under such conditions (lack of confidence instead of trying to work together to get a good job)?


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Translation-Pro  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 19:47
Member (2007)
English to German
+ ...
A few things I noticed Feb 6, 2009

Hi Thomas,

That's too bad! I hope you'll get a chance to take a look at their corrected or "corrected" version.

By the way, here are a few things I noticed:

- Why did you translate "shaft" as "Achse" in this context?

- In the German translation of "visually inspect the valve guides" "optisch" is missing.

- Why did you translate "near the combustion end" as "in der Nähe des Ventiltellers"?

Just my 2 cents...
And your translation is NOT rubbish! I hope they'll give you a chance to improve it if necessary.

Christa


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Maria Ramon  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:47
Dutch to English
+ ...
Some proofreaders think they are a 'god'.... Feb 7, 2009

Just this week I received 'disqualifying' comments on a test translation of a very simple, ordinary text.
The 'proofreader' told the agency that my test translation was 'bad quality'.
So I asked what the proofreaders qualifications are and to see the corrections.
The answer was that all their proofreaders are 'high quality professionals' and the 'corrected' test translation was attached: from the 'corrections' that this proofreader did I could only see that it was a matter of word preference, nothing else.
I wrote back that I do complicated legal translations for several clients and they are all repeat clients sending me more legal, or financial and business texts to be translated every time; texts which are a whole lot more complex than this simple, ordinary text, and I have not received any complaints.
So the proofreader thinks he/she is a 'god' because he/she 'disqualified' a person because that person did not use the same words he/she uses; like I said a matter of preference only.
If that is what they take as a standard I have no business working for them, it would only create problems in the future which only take too much of my valuable time, which in turn I could put to good use for someone else!
Don't get discouraged because of those comments; I cannot judge your translation because I am not familiar with that subject.
Most of the time whatever a proofreader says is a matter of personal opinion (and we don't have to share that opinion, necessarily) or personal preference for certain words in a certain context, which (if used appropriately) can be either one or the other word without 'devalueing' the translation.

This is just 'my' opinion)


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Thomas Zeisler  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 19:47
Member
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Thanks for the comment Feb 7, 2009


By the way, here are a few things I noticed:

- Why did you translate "shaft" as "Achse" in this context?

- In the German translation of "visually inspect the valve guides" "optisch" is missing.

- Why did you translate "near the combustion end" as "in der Nähe des Ventiltellers"?

Just my 2 cents...
And your translation is NOT rubbish! I hope they'll give you a chance to improve it if necessary.

Christa


Hi Crista,
thanks for your comments!

1) Kipphebelachse and Kipphebelwelle are both used. Probably Kipphebelwelle is more common.
2) You're right
3) I think "auf der Verbrennungsseite" sounds strange if you look at a valve. I think that "in der Nähe des Ventiltellers" is more apt.

Thomas


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Laurent KRAULAND  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 19:47
French to German
+ ...
+1 Feb 7, 2009

WilRoy wrote:

Hello Thomas,

I only translate into english but from reading your german text, I can't see anything that indicates "insufficient wording".


Same feeling/impression/feedback here.

Laurent K.


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Thomas Zeisler  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 19:47
Member
English to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I got feedback Feb 9, 2009

I got feedback from the potential client:

"Dear Thomas Zeisler
This was the feedback from other expert.
He didn't tell me how to change the phrases but told me yellow is minor faults and
severe faults are pink."

I put the minor faults in italic and the major faults in bold.



Außendurchmesser Achse
Verwenden Sie eine Messschraube, um den Durchmesser der Kipphebelachse an mindestens 4 Stellen zu messen (Abbildung 3-15). Siehe Kipphebel und Kipphebelachse auf Seite 6-6 für die Verschleißgrenze.

Inspektion der Ventilführungen
Innendurchmesser Ventilführung
Prüfen Sie die Ventilführungen auf Verzug, Riefenbildung oder andere Schäden.
Verwenden Sie eine Messuhr und eine Messschraube, um den Innendurchmesser an beiden Enden der Ventilführung zu messen. Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.
Inspektion Zylinderkopf
Zylinderkopfverzug
Legen Sie den Zylinderkopf flach mit dem Brennraum nach oben auf die Werkbank. Verwenden Sie ein Haarlineal und eine Fühlerlehre um den Verzug des Zylinderkopfes zu messen (Abbildung 3-15). Siehe Zylinderkopf auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.

Inspektion Ein- und Auslassventile
Prüfen Sie die Ein- und Auslassventile optisch.
Ersetzen Sie alle Ventile, die deutlich verfärbt, stark angefressen
oder auf andere Weise beschädigt sind.

Ventilschaftdurchmesser
Verwenden Sie eine Messschraube, um den Ventilschaftdurchmesser zu messen. Messen Sie den Ventilschaft im Bereich des Ventiltellers und am entgegengesetzten Ende (Abbildung 3-16). Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.


Geradheit Ventilschaft
Legen Sie den Ventilschaft auf einen ebenen Prüfblock oder eine andere ebene Fläche. Drehen Sie das Ventil, bis ein Spalt zwischen einem Teil des Ventilschafts und der Unterlage festgestellt werden kann. Messen Sie den Spalt mit einer Fühlerlehre (Abbildung 3-17). Siehe Ein- / Auslassventil und Ventilführung auf Seite 6-5 für Angabe der Verschleißgrenze.


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Stanislav Pokorny  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 19:47
English to Czech
+ ...
No tracked changes? Feb 12, 2009

Hi Thomas,
when I proofread a document, I always track my changes in Word. If the client only told you that their proofreader hadn't told them how to change the phrases, I don't think this is a sufficient reply. It makes me think the proofreader doesn't know a thing about proofreading.


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Tomás Cano Binder, BA, CT  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 19:47
Member (2005)
English to Spanish
+ ...
Just my 2 cents Feb 13, 2009

Thomas Zeisler wrote:
Christa wrote:
- Why did you translate "near the combustion end" as "in der Nähe des Ventiltellers"?

3) I think "auf der Verbrennungsseite" sounds strange if you look at a valve. I think that "in der Nähe des Ventiltellers" is more apt.


Hm... I'm affraid I do not agree. I don't translate into German so I cannot evaluate the translation as Christa so kindly did, but if the text says "near the combustion end", that's what the German text had to say.

If something sounds simply impossible or odd, it might be better to translate it literally and include a note at delivery time (or even better, ask at translation time). To a proofreader (to whom "near the combustion end" might sound perfectly correct), this change was a mistake.


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