Using CAT during monolingual editing
Thread poster: Samuel Murray

Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 04:24
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Feb 8, 2012

G'day everyone

I'm wondering whether editors of monolingual texts commonly use CAT tools, for the ability of the CAT tool to ensure consistency.

Do any of you who do monolingual editing load the file into a CAT tool and "translate" it, while adding terms to the glossary and blacklist, and using the TM search and using the reference document search (or even possibly the MT feature, though I can't think how)?

I can imagine that using an MS Word-based tool for editing MS Word files can be useful, and that using a standalone tool could pose difficulties because the editor can't edit the tags (e.g. formatting tags).

Your thoughts on the matter?

Samuel


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Katalin Sandor  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 04:24
English to Hungarian
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Gigantic manual editing project Feb 8, 2012

I do not do monolingual editing as a rule but I worked on a huge project a while ago that would have been living hell without a CAT (even with a CAT, it was a borderline case).

It was a set of manuals for a family of devices consisting of 70+ files that I received in batches, with months between the spurts. There is no way I could have remembered the terminology and in particular the phrases I agreed with the client months back (e.g., the title of a particular chart or the exact wording of an error message). The authors themselves had difficulties remembering such stuff: the bulk of my work was to standardize their usage throughout the package.

I used memoQ, a standalone CAT. I simply pretended the two versions were different flavours of the same language. Tags were no problem, I just left them alone (I am not sure I understand you concerns about them). I obviously had lots of repetitions and I also made extensive use of TM searches and the term base. As for MT, I never use it and this project was no exception (I have no clue how it could have been used, anyway).

So if you have a technical project where consistency is crucial but difficult to maintain, a CAT could be your friend. The technicalities of setting up the project, exporting/cleanup, re-reading the final document etc. will take time (it took a LOT of time with the number of documents I had) and working in the CAT can be slower than reading a Word document but it saves you time and grey hairs in other ways.

Hope this helps

Katalin


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 04:24
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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TOPIC STARTER
@Vladimir Feb 8, 2012

Vladimir Shelukhin wrote:
I do. ... I do use memoQ 5 for multi-round editing and version control in my own translations (as I was using DVX earlier for editing purposes). A good TEnT is very useful for monolingual editing too.


On other mailing lists where I had asked this question, the way MemoQ or DVX uses two columns were also mentioned as useful in editing. And in those tools one can use a filter to search for similar expressions in the same file that were previously edited, to see how they were edited.

Does this "version control" relate to a type of tracked changes?


[Edited at 2012-02-08 13:51 GMT]


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Stephanie Ezrol  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 22:24
Member (2009)
English
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Does not seem possible in Trados Feb 8, 2012

I tried to use Trados Studio 2009 once for such a project and I could not figure out how to make it work. Perhaps there is a way. I might have given up too easily, but I do agree with Katalin that some kind of tool would be very helpful in those types of large jobs.

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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 04:24
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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TOPIC STARTER
@Stephanie Feb 8, 2012

Stephanie Ezrol wrote:
I tried to use Trados Studio 2009 once for such a project and I could not figure out how to make it work.


I seem to recall that Trados 2007 used to disallow projects in which the source and target languages are the same. Is this still the case, perhaps?



[Edited at 2012-02-08 13:52 GMT]


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 04:24
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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TOPIC STARTER
@Katalin Feb 8, 2012

Katalin Sandor wrote:
I used memoQ, a standalone CAT. I simply pretended the two versions were different flavours of the same language. Tags were no problem, I just left them alone (I am not sure I understand you concerns about them).


Well, suppose you have the sentence "The black cat is on the white mat" and the word "black" is bold in the original, would you be able to make both the words "black" and "white" to be bold? You can do that in an MS Word-based tool, but it may be difficult or outright impossibl ea standalone tool that tags formats. If your answer to the above is "yes", then ask whether you can keep "black" as bold but change "white" into italics. That can't be done with tag-based standalone CAT tools at all, right?

As for MT, I never use it and this project was no exception (I have no clue how it could have been used, anyway).


Well, suppose you edit a text in Language A that was written by a person whose native language is Language B, then you might use MT in Language A to Language B to see if any of the odd expressions in the text turn out in the MT system as recognisable phrases that should have been "translated" differently by the original author of the text.


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Katalin Sandor  Identity Verified
Hungary
Local time: 04:24
English to Hungarian
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Basic formatting is possible Feb 8, 2012

Samuel Murray wrote:

Well, suppose you have the sentence "The black cat is on the white mat" and the word "black" is bold in the original, would you be able to make both the words "black" and "white" to be bold? You can do that in an MS Word-based tool, but it may be difficult or outright impossibl ea standalone tool that tags formats. If your answer to the above is "yes", then ask whether you can keep "black" as bold but change "white" into italics. That can't be done with tag-based standalone CAT tools at all, right?


I would not know about standalone CAT tools in general, I have only ever used memoQ (I was a Trados user before but that was in pre-Studio times), but this is what memoQ can/cannot do:

It allows you to apply bold/underline/italics as you please, with the buttons familiar from Word. That is, each of the scenarios you describe is possible.
No other "fancy" formatting (highlighting, subscript/superscript, character colours) can be applied without tags AFAIK.

Well, suppose you edit a text in Language A that was written by a person whose native language is Language B, then you might use MT in Language A to Language B to see if any of the odd expressions in the text turn out in the MT system as recognisable phrases that should have been "translated" differently by the original author of the text.



I see. I have never thought of that. Thanks for the tip, it may come in useful one day.


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xxxchristela
I do Feb 8, 2012

Samuel Murray wrote:
Do any of you who do monolingual editing load the file into a CAT tool and "translate" it, while adding terms to the glossary and blacklist, and using the TM search and using the reference document search (or even possibly the MT feature, though I can't think how)?


I use Wordfast exactly in this way. I feed the source text and then make corrections. Next time the same errors are there, the TM will suggest me the same target segment. And it is also handy for TM Lookup.
My files are in Word, so they can be handled in WF Classic and in WF Pro. I prefer WF Classic as I can mix up two or three source languages.


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Emma Goldsmith  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 04:24
Member (2010)
Spanish to English
Formatting in Studio Feb 8, 2012

Samuel Murray wrote:
whether you can keep "black" as bold but change "white" into italics. That can't be done with tag-based standalone CAT tools at all, right?


In Studio you can insert bold/underline/italics/subscript/superscript/different quotation mark styles with tags or using Word-like short cuts (Ctrl+B, etc.)
However, you can't highlight text or use different colours.

HTH,
Emma


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Nancy Greenleese  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 04:24
Member (2013)
Italian to English
+ ...
CAT tool for monolingual -- which one selected? Sep 11, 2014

Dear Samuel,

I came across your question and the helpful answers regarding CAT tools for monolingual editing.

Would you be willing to tell me and the others which tool you selected? And if you're happy with it?

Best,
Nancy


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Using CAT during monolingual editing

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