Fake offers
Thread poster: Nisreen Barakat

Fernanda Rocha  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 12:33
Member
English to Portuguese
+ ...

MODERATOR
Other threads regarding this situation. Aug 12, 2009

Hi Nisreen.

I don't know if you have seen the following threads - both are related to this job offer.
Please, take a look at them.

http://www.proz.com/topic/141905?start=0
http://www.proz.com/post/1188710#1188710

Kind regards,
Fernandaicon_smile.gif


 

Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:33
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
Posted on Proz or through your Proz email address? Aug 12, 2009

I doubt you saw this posted on Proz, rather that you received a message through your Proz email contact information. Unfortunately, that is open to anyone, as it should be, otherwise people not posting jobs on Proz, agencies, clients, etc., would never find you. What I and many others here do under these circumstances is search the Internet, search the forums, post a forum entry requesting opinions from colleagues, etc. I must say in this case I would have been suspicious from the get go.

If you receive job offers through your Proz account, ask yourself
Why me directly?
Why not post a job and find the most cost effective translator?
Who is this person, what information is out there that I can read about them?
Do they exist, are they for real?
What do my colleagues at Proz think about this?

Lastly, read all posts about similar scams, particularly the so-called Nigerian scams.

By the way, what was the offer? At some point he would have asked you to cash a check for him (higher than your estimate) and send him the difference because he was having some sort of problem doing it himself. And later you would have found out that it was a bad check. Or something like that. They are not even creative.

[Edited at 2009-08-12 13:46 GMT]


 

Geraldine Oudin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Japanese to French
+ ...
Posted on Proz Aug 12, 2009

Luisa Ramos wrote:

I doubt you saw this posted on Proz, rather that you received a message through your Proz email contact information. Unfortunately, that is open to anyone, as it should be, otherwise people not posting jobs on Proz, agencies, clients, etc., would never find you. What I and many others here do under these circumstances is search the Internet, search the forums, post a forum entry requesting opinions from colleagues, etc. I must say in this case I would have been suspicious from the get go.

If you receive job offers through your Proz account, ask yourself
Why me directly?
Why not post a job and find the most cost effective translator?
Who is this person, what information is out there that I can read about them?
Do they exist, are they for real?
What do my colleagues at Proz think about this?

Lastly, read all posts about similar scams, particularly the so-called Nigerian scams.

By the way, what was the offer? At some point he would have asked you to cash a check for him (higher than your estimate) and send him the difference because he was having some sort of problem doing it himself. And later you would have found out that it was a bad check. Or something like that. They are not even creative.

[Edited at 2009-08-12 13:46 GMT]


Dear Luisa,

This offer in particular was posted as a job on Proz and was promptly removed after I and other collegues submitted support tickets.


 

Stanislaw Czech, MCIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 16:33
Member (2006)
English to Polish
+ ...
I don't think that we can blame Proz here Aug 12, 2009

After all there is a Blue Board which is accessible to everyone and if you want to stay on the safe side - you can work only for clients with good BB record.

Best Regards
Stanislaw


 

Philippe Etienne  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 17:33
Member
English to French
Easy replies to the first two questions Aug 12, 2009

Luisa Ramos wrote:
...If you receive job offers through your Proz account, ask yourself
Why me directly?
Why not post a job and find the most cost effective translator?
...

Reply #1: because my profile is on proz.com for a reason
Reply #2: because some outsourcers don't want everybody to know that they are in dire need of a translator into a very common language, they don't want to detail projects publicly, they don't want to be flooded with inappropriate applications and/or they are not the least interested in finding the cheapest translator on Earth.

Most of my new business comes from such contacts, and many of them have a profile and a BB. It is not because they contact you directly that they are more suspicious than job posters.
Nevertheless, I do get all sorts of offers through proz email, so the remaining questions stated by Luisa are very helpful and should be observed at all times, including deep Internet searches on individual/company names, document and email titles or sentences, IP address checks for consistency, phone numbers, company registrations, domain names, etc., etc.

More generally, there is something called "social engineering" in any crook's toolbox, and you're just as exposed on proz.com than you are on Facebook or whatever other social network or auction site.

Be sensible, but not paranoid,
Philippe


 

Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:33
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
Exactly my point Aug 12, 2009

France-Japon wrote:

[This offer in particular was posted as a job on Proz and was promptly removed after I and other collegues submitted support tickets.


Even if it appeared on Proz, you just confirmed my point! What made you think there was something fishy, so fishy you asked that it be removed?

I did not see the job posted yet I would have dismissed it, especially after searching the Web and finding nothing.

What I mean is be careful, not paranoid certainly, just be careful, be savvy, be wary, do some research before jumping at the chance of any opportunity.


 

Fathy Shehatto  Identity Verified
Egypt
Local time: 17:33
Member
English to Arabic
+ ...
I got the same order Aug 12, 2009

Hi everybody,

I have got this fake order few one week ago. I checked the BB and there was nothing supportive.
Then I asked him to pay half of the amount in advance, then he accepted and sent me 2 pages for translation as sample, hence I could discover what is the trip I was going to drop in. I wrote an apologize that I don't do any sample translations and I have just got another assignment.

Suggested tips:

Google the sender's name
Ask him about his website if any
Check his Proz.com profile
check the BB
Ask for payment in advance if it is your first deal with him


 

Maha Ararat  Identity Verified
Qatar
Local time: 19:33
English to Arabic
+ ...
What if you did take the job Aug 12, 2009

Hi all,
I was just wondering what if a translator took a job from an outsourcer who turned out to be a bad payer...
What are the best ways to get back at such frauds even if you don't get your money?
Although I created my account two years ago I have been "prozing" for only 2 months and it just crossed my mind that a bad payer can go post a negative entry about a translator whom he has just fleeced off his effort. Isn't this a possibility?
Also, isn't it possible that an outsourcer could manage some way or another to have some fake positive entries posted for him on the Blue Board?
Moreover, a bad payer may be able to make as many proz accounts as he may want with a new IP address every time so he won't be really harmed by negative comments posted about him. I know one should stay safe but again I wish there was an effective way to deter everyone who thinks they can take a translator's effort and time for free


 

Geraldine Oudin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Japanese to French
+ ...
Nothing Aug 13, 2009

Luisa Ramos wrote:

France-Japon wrote:

[This offer in particular was posted as a job on Proz and was promptly removed after I and other collegues submitted support tickets.


Even if it appeared on Proz, you just confirmed my point! What made you think there was something fishy, so fishy you asked that it be removed?

I did not see the job posted yet I would have dismissed it, especially after searching the Web and finding nothing.

What I mean is be careful, not paranoid certainly, just be careful, be savvy, be wary, do some research before jumping at the chance of any opportunity.


Nothing was suspicious about the job offer itself, the user had a BB and everything. Which is why many people applied. When the first email came, I knew it was a scam (the email address did not correspond to the internet site provided in the BB, the document provided for translation made no sense in relation to the industry of the asker, he accepted high rates for more than 100 000 words without negociating, and the funniest part"Our donors will pay you through money cheques")
Hilarious.
I wonder if people really fall for this.
Anyway, maybe you should have a look at the other links on the subject, you would understand better the whole story. I don't want to write all the details again and again...


 

Geraldine Oudin  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Japanese to French
+ ...
Payment in advance Aug 13, 2009

Fathy Shehatto wrote:

Hi everybody,

I have got this fake order few one week ago. I checked the BB and there was nothing supportive.
Then I asked him to pay half of the amount in advance, then he accepted and sent me 2 pages for translation as sample, hence I could discover what is the trip I was going to drop in. I wrote an apologize that I don't do any sample translations and I have just got another assignment.




Interesting!
I asked for payment in advance and further payments in installments, specifying that I wouldn't start the job until the money is on my bank account, just to see his reaction.
As I expected, he never wrote backicon_wink.gif
He didn't even try to send me a sample...


 

Yasutomo Kanazawa  Identity Verified
Local time: 00:33
English to Japanese
+ ...
Our donors? Aug 13, 2009

France-Japon wrote:

Luisa Ramos wrote:

France-Japon wrote:

[This offer in particular was posted as a job on Proz and was promptly removed after I and other collegues submitted support tickets.


Even if it appeared on Proz, you just confirmed my point! What made you think there was something fishy, so fishy you asked that it be removed?

I did not see the job posted yet I would have dismissed it, especially after searching the Web and finding nothing.

What I mean is be careful, not paranoid certainly, just be careful, be savvy, be wary, do some research before jumping at the chance of any opportunity.


Nothing was suspicious about the job offer itself, the user had a BB and everything. Which is why many people applied. When the first email came, I knew it was a scam (the email address did not correspond to the internet site provided in the BB, the document provided for translation made no sense in relation to the industry of the asker, he accepted high rates for more than 100 000 words without negociating, and the funniest part"Our donors will pay you through money cheques")
Hilarious.
I wonder if people really fall for this.
Anyway, maybe you should have a look at the other links on the subject, you would understand better the whole story. I don't want to write all the details again and again...


Who? Shylock?icon_smile.gif


 

Nisreen Barakat  Identity Verified
Palestine
Local time: 18:33
English to Arabic
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Never again Aug 13, 2009

Well I see a lot of us have fallen for this trap... The lesson is to be careful! Thank you all for the suggestions and advice.

Good luck to all


 

Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 11:33
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
I am up to date Aug 13, 2009

France-Japon wrote:

Anyway, maybe you should have a look at the other links on the subject, you would understand better the whole story. I don't want to write all the details again and again...


I do, I do, all the time, which has served me well.
http://www.proz.com/forum/prozcom_job_systems/141905-possible_scam_posted_as_job_not_found_in_jobs_list_now_squashed.html


 


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