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How do job deadlines work at ProZ.com?
Thread poster: Ketty Federico

Ketty Federico  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 03:34
Member (2011)
German to Italian
+ ...
Mar 3, 2011

Hi everyone!
I am a bit confused every time I want to quote for a job, the following information is displayed:

(es.)

- Quoting deadline: march 16th
- delivery deadline: march 19th

Proz members may quote unitl: march 4th at 12.00'

and later, when I want to submit a quote, I am asked again when I can deliver.

I must say, this is not very clear to me.

Is our deadline for quoting march 4th? What abot march 16th?

Delivery deadline is the date when the outsourcer sends out the translation or when I have to deliver it?

Why am I asked to suggest a delivery date again later?

I am sure you can help me with that!

thanks,

Ketty


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 03:34
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
@Ketty Mar 3, 2011

Ketty Federico wrote:
- Quoting deadline: march 16th
- delivery deadline: march 19th
Proz members may quote unitl: march 4th at 12.00'


No-one may quote after 16 March. Non-members may not quote before 4 March. So non-members can only quote from 4 March to 16 March, but members can quote any time until 16 March. The date that the completed translation should be delivered is 19 March.

I wish the job system would also include a "latest go-head date" in addition to the "latest deliver date", but I wonder how many clients would fill that in correctly (or honestly).

Samuel


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 00:34
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Some frequent inconsistencies Mar 3, 2011

We all know that job posters are sometimes careless, e.g. they want an EN-to-PT translator exclusively living in, say, Uzbekistan.

Timewise, what I often see is something like:
Job posted on Jan 1st (to make it easier to envision)
Volume: 15,000 words
Quoting deadline: Jan 20th
Delivery deadline: Jan 21st

I guess that regardless of the subject and complexity, any decent translator could do that in 1-2 weeks. However if the outsourcer will hold their decision until the 20th, and then require delivery within 24 hours, this will be a mission:impossible!

I don't think Proz (nor anyone) could embed any sensible parameters for software to raise a red flag when such circumstances are laid out, so the best they could do would be to include some advice that some time should be allotted for doing the job.


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Alejandro Cavalitto
Local time: 23:34
SITE STAFF
Deadlines Mar 3, 2011

Hello,

Thank you Samuel for correctly explaining what the different deadlines stand for. I just wanted to point out that when submitting a quote, users are allowed to put in a projected delivery date of their own. They can put in the same date as specified by the job poster or a different one. The field is there to give more flexibility to job quotes.

Please let us know if you have any more questions.

Best regards,
Alejandro


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Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 03:34
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Undefined quoting deadline Mar 3, 2011

José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:
I don't think Proz (nor anyone) could embed any sensible parameters for software to raise a red flag when such circumstances are laid out, so the best they could do would be to include some advice that some time should be allotted for doing the job.


An alternative solution may be to not force job posters to specify a quoting deadline, or... to have an option called "undefined quoting deadline". The problem with setting the quoting deadline too early is that if you don't get a suiteable translator in that time, the job post expires (right?), so outsourcers place very generous quoting deadlines in their job posts, when they really want to say "I'll keep accepting quotes until I see something that I like".


[Edited at 2011-03-03 14:54 GMT]


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Ketty Federico  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 03:34
Member (2011)
German to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
If I understood it... Mar 3, 2011

Ok, let me see.

this example>

Title: xxxxxxxxx
Delivery deadline: 2011-03-07 16:00:00
Quoting deadline: 2011-03-05 16:00:00
This job is available only to ProZ.com members until 2:31am Mar 4 GMT

As a PROZ member I may quote for this job from now, immediately, until 2011-03-05 at 16.00 (instead, non-members may usually start submitting their quotes twelve hours later).

The finished translation has to be delivered to the client until 2011-03-07 at 16.00.

Is this correct?

If it is, I find it a bit weird not to know when I exactly get the translation form the client (that is smth we need to know in order to suggest a different delivery deadline). In this case, it is not so bad BUT if quoting deadline was march 5th and delivery deadline march 12th, and the volume of words very high, I would definitely need to know when the client sends out the text to be translated, in order to guess when I can deliver.

Do you also find this might be a problem or is it me?

Ketty


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 00:34
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Not exactly Mar 3, 2011

Ketty Federico wrote:

Ok, let me see.

this example

Title: xxxxxxxxx
Delivery deadline: 2011-03-07 16:00:00
Quoting deadline: 2011-03-05 16:00:00
This job is available only to ProZ.com members until 2:31am Mar 4 GMT

As a PROZ member I may quote for this job from now, immediately, until 2011-03-05 at 16.00 (instead, non-members may usually start submitting their quotes twelve hours later).

The finished translation has to be delivered to the client until 2011-03-07 at 16.00.

Is this correct?


No, Ketty.
  • Proz members may quote any time between "now" and 2:31am Mar 4 GMT.
  • Non-members may quote any time between 2:31am Mar 4 GMT and the Quoting deadline: 2011-03-05 16:00:00

Ketty Federico wrote:
If it is, I find it a bit weird not to know when I exactly get the translation form the client (that is smth we need to know in order to suggest a different delivery deadline).
(snip)
Do you also find this might be a problem or is it me?


Yes (it's a problem), no (it's not you).
This was precisely the point in my previous post.


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Ketty Federico  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 03:34
Member (2011)
German to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
It's clear now... Mar 3, 2011

...and I perfectly see you point, which is also mine.

In the end you don't know if you accepted to do the job in one week or in three days.
Maybe a minimum amount of time should be given and specified by the company outsourcing the job or it might come to serious issues between the translator and the client later on.


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José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 00:34
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Precisely! Mar 3, 2011

This calls for common sense and trade knowledge by the outsourcer.

If they are amateurs, they won't have either. A few of them actually seem to sincerely believe that if the translator has Trados ("whatever that is"), any translation - regardless of its size and complexity - can't take longer than just a couple of hours from start to finish.


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Katalin Horváth McClure  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 21:34
Member (2002)
English to Hungarian
+ ...
You can clarify and negotiate deadlines Mar 3, 2011

The deadline field on the quoting form is restricted to a calendar entry, but the "Completion date notes" field accepts any text. Therefore, you can leave the calendar field empty, and instead, write "3 days from go ahead" or "to be discussed" in the "Completion date notes" field.
You can always specify and clarify that in the main text of your quote, such as "I estimate I can do this work in X calendar/business days from the day I receive the source files".

It is always best to avoid giving a hard delivery date on the quoting form, unless it is absolutely clear from the job description when they are going to supply the files and what exactly is involved (file format, field, sample text, etc.).

Katalin


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Ketty Federico  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 03:34
Member (2011)
German to Italian
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Exactly Mar 3, 2011

I was thinking of the very same solution.

thanks Katalin!


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christeld  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:34
Norwegian to English
+ ...
Not just me then! Mar 3, 2011

José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:

We all know that job posters are sometimes careless, e.g. they want an EN-to-PT translator exclusively living in, say, Uzbekistan.


I am glad to hear I'm not the only one having come across something like this. The other day I went to look at a job listing to find a job poster based in Japan, looking for a English to Norwegian translator ... based in France.


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christeld  Identity Verified
Local time: 02:34
Norwegian to English
+ ...
Not just me then! Mar 3, 2011

José Henrique Lamensdorf wrote:

We all know that job posters are sometimes careless, e.g. they want an EN-to-PT translator exclusively living in, say, Uzbekistan.


I am glad to hear I'm not the only one having come across something like this. The other day I went to look at a job posting to find a job poster based in Japan, looking for a English to Norwegian translator ... based in France.


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Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member for the following reason: Removed by poster.

José Henrique Lamensdorf  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 00:34
English to Portuguese
+ ...
The source of urgent jobs Mar 4, 2011

Sebastian Witte wrote:
(Deleted for courtesy, as he deleted the original)


Not always, however more often than not, when I see large URRRRGENT!!!! jobs posted or offered directly, an inspection on file dates is likely to reveal that the outsourcer spent 2-3 weeks hunting for cheaper and cheaper translators. When the time before the deadline obviously makes it no longer feasible, all they want is to evade urgency surcharges.

LATER NOTE: This is to explain why the time allotted for bids is often much, much longer than for actually doing the job, regardless of its size.

[Edited at 2011-03-04 16:05 GMT]


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