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OneDocument Translation Workspace powered by Proz?
Thread poster: Jo Macdonald

Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 13:56
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
May 8, 2017

Hi folks,
Is this a legit job request or a scam?
I clicked on the "To learn more about the translation center click here" link and got what looks like a Proz page http://www.proz.com/proz-translation-center

I answered the mail saying, "Thanks, but I'm not available" and received two more mails saying:
"A new OneDocument account has been created for you. Click the url below to activate your account and select a password!"
and
"We would like to acknowledge that we have received your request and a ticket has been created."

I haven't requested any account be created or sent a request, and the links in these mails no longer go to Proz but to something called Freshdesk.
https://freshdesk.com/?utm_source=email&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=freemium

Original mail received from support@onedocument.freshdesk.com
OneDocument Translation Workspace

Dear .......,

OneDocument is managing language-related jobs in a translation center powered by ProZ.com. In order to include you in these projects, we are sending this invitation to enable your access to the OneDocument Translation Workspace.

Personal message from OneDocument, S.L.:

Greetings, I hope you are well!

Please could you help us with a urgent Italian to English translation task? The specialism is Banking and Finance.

There is only 1 file to be translated, 330 words.

The deadline is for as soon as possible, so please could you confirm when you could have this done by?

Please do let me know if you can help with this, I look forward to hearing from you.

Thanks!

Best regards,

....

Click here to get started

To learn more about the translation center
click here

The OneDocument team


 

Josephine Cassar  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:56
Member (2012)
Italian to English
+ ...
Same message with same words May 8, 2017

Hi, I received the same message with the same request and info but was suspicious as there was no company information I could check. When I clicked on 'if you want to know more' I was directed to a Proz. site where I still could not tell what company it was and was going to submit a support ticket to ask Proz as I do not think it is a genuine offer and would have liked to check what it was. Now that you have gone public, I hope Proz. team will take action about this. I haven't answered them so far as I wanted to search in the forums before and just happened to see your post. Thank you.

[Edited at 2017-05-08 13:10 GMT]


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:56
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Massive own goal? May 8, 2017

It looks to me as though ProZ.com has set up a site area without really introducing translators to it at all. I mean, I've heard about this "Workspace" as I actually use it for TWB pro bono work, but it's never been sold to me as a translator. When you, as a translator, go to the page linked to in Jo's post you'll see that not a word of it is addressed to you - every word is addressed to the outsourcer. Well, if it's going to be a workspace, and we're the ones doing the work, should we not be addressed in some way?

Perhaps the outsourcer that's sending these job offers imagines that you'll know exactly why you're receiving them and what it all means. I think the outsourcer has to be a corporate member of ProZ.com, so this isn't some fly-by-night scammer. But they might as well be for all we're concerned. When we get that type of anonymous request then our first impression is going to be that it's a scam. That page talks about "valid translators". Who's a "valid translator"? Do we get to know that we are or aren't one? Or is that not reckoned to be of any importance to us?


 

Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 13:56
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
No info May 8, 2017

Hi Josephine,
I searched for info on Proz before posting but found none.

Thanks Shiela,
I'm also getting the impression it's legit as the post has been moved to the "Proz job system" section but know absolutely nothing about it.

If it is a legit job offer where can I find out more about this system?
Also, if an account has been created in my name and/or a request created can you not create accounts or generate requests or anything else of the kind without my permission please?



[Edited at 2017-05-08 14:37 GMT]


 

Josephine Cassar  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:56
Member (2012)
Italian to English
+ ...
Could not check company May 8, 2017

What I did not like is that I could not tell what company it was and, therefore, I could not check its BB entry, company contact numbers or address or email address and I do not think it is fair either that we do not have this information so I hesitated to answer even if it might be legit as, maybe, it is apparently.

 

Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:56
Member
English to Italian
Translation Workspace May 8, 2017

Jo, that seems to be a legitimate offer from a legitimate company using the Translation Workspace. You have their name, so you can just check them up on the BB. You could then contact them directly for further info.

As for me, I used to receive "offers" from a company using this "Translation Workspace". The mails came from translationcenter@[companyname].com. However, I was first contacted by them via ProZ mail, answered with my rates, and then started receiving those offers for (mostly) small to tiny projects (even < 50 words) at about 50-60% of the (per word) rate I asked... :-/

I ended up never working with them.

Sheila Wilson wrote:

That page talks about "valid translators". Who's a "valid translator"? Do we get to know that we are or aren't one? Or is that not reckoned to be of any importance to us?


"With manual assignment the PM will edit a task to manually assign it to one of the valid translators."

O_o


 

Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:56
Member
English to Italian
Personal message from XXX May 8, 2017

Josephine Cassar wrote:

What I did not like is that I could not tell what company it was and, therefore, I could not check its BB entry, company contact numbers or address or email address and I do not think it is fair either that we do not have this information so I hesitated to answer even if it might be legit as, maybe, it is apparently.


Their name is actually there in the message Jo quoted: "Personal message from XXX:".

[Edited at 2017-05-08 14:53 GMT]


 

Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 13:56
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
That explains a lot May 8, 2017

Thanks Mirko,
I've now looked up OneDocument and they look like an OK agency.
So it's a message from the agency OneDocument sent using Proz Translation Workspace and it's not Proz who are creating an account or generating a ticket but OneDocument using an online job PM platform called Freshdesk?

Maybe I'm dense but I just totally missed that. The subject of the original message was [OneDocument Workspace] Invitation to OneDocument Translation Workspace. I read that as it's OneDocument's Translation Workspace not a message from OneDocument sent through Proz.com's Translation Workspace.


 

Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:56
Member
English to Italian
You're welcome May 8, 2017

Jo Macdonald wrote:

So it's a message from the agency OneDocument sent using Proz Translation Workspace and it's not Proz who are creating an account or generating a ticket but OneDocument using an online job PM platform called Freshdesk?


I'm not familiar with Freshdesk, but it appears to be some sort of external FAQ/support/customer service website.

I noticed there appears to be a specific section for ProZ: http://prozcom.freshdesk.com/support/home

"Instructions for service providers" seems to explain a bit how the whole thing works.


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:56
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
If it's a time saver for trusted collaborations, it shouldn't be used for urgent first jobs May 8, 2017

Mirko Mainardi wrote:
Sheila Wilson wrote:
That page talks about "valid translators". Who's a "valid translator"? Do we get to know that we are or aren't one? Or is that not reckoned to be of any importance to us?

"With manual assignment the PM will edit a task to manually assign it to one of the valid translators."

But it's lacking so much clarity, from what I've read. It doesn't seem as though there was a direct link to their ProZ.com profile and BB entry. And if it's for "valid translators", why is it being used first for an urgent job? Surely it should be used for tried-and-tested relationships - on both sides.

Jo Macdonald wrote:
I answered the mail saying, "Thanks, but I'm not available" and received two more mails saying:
"A new OneDocument account has been created for you. Click the url below to activate your account and select a password!"
and
"We would like to acknowledge that we have received your request and a ticket has been created."

So it doesn't look as though the translator's response is being read. The cogs just churn away regardless. More of the worrying trend to rush freelancers into doing jobs for "partners" they know nothing about.


 

Alejandro Cavalitto
SITE STAFF
This is a legitimate offer May 8, 2017

Hello,

Thank you for raising this question. I confirm that this is a legitimate offer from an outsourcer using the Translation Center to source their projects.

It is true that most of the information at http://www.proz.com/proz-translation-center is aimed at outsourcers, as they are the parties interested in channelling their operations through the Translation Center. However, I agree that more information aimed at translators should be shown there.

For the time being, you can find more information about using the Translation Center as a service provider at the Freshdesk* article titled instructions for service providers. (Thank you Mirko for sharing this article here).

To clarify on the specific questions asked here:

  • A company can create an instance of the Translation Center to run their operations. In that instance, they must load the service providers they choose to work with. Loading the service providers creates an account AT that instance of the Translation Center, and then each user can accept the invitation by activating the account and selecting a password. The invitation you received is asking you to do that (if you want to activate your account), Jo.

  • The mention of "valid" translators refers to the assignment process used in the Translation Center. First, a group of translators is selected and then invitations are sent to them for the project to be sourced. This is similar to the system used by TWB, where volunteers working in a specific language pair are invited only to the relevant projects, and in batches automatically sent by the system.


I hope this answers your questions. It is true that invitations could include more information about the Translation Center, to help those who have been invited to make a decision. What kind of information would you like to see included in these invitations? A link to the ProZ.com profile and Blue Board record of the outsourcer would be a good start. Can you think of other relevant information that you would be interested in seeing there?

Please let me know if you have any other questions, I will be glad to answer them. Thank you.

Best regards,
Alejandro


* Freshdesk is a third-party customer support platform that is currently used by ProZ.com to hold documentation relative to the Translation Center.


 

Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 12:56
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Thanks Alejandro May 8, 2017

Alejandro Cavalitto wrote:
It is true that invitations could include more information about the Translation Center, to help those who have been invited to make a decision. What kind of information would you like to see included in these invitations? A link to the ProZ.com profile and Blue Board record of the outsourcer would be a good start. Can you think of other relevant information that you would be interested in seeing there?

Well, for a start I'm sure it would be helpful to see this:
* Freshdesk is a third-party customer support platform that is currently used by ProZ.com to hold documentation relative to the Translation Center.

Then an assurance that the entity contacting you is a corporate member of ProZ.com and has endorsed those guidelines. That would be reassuring.

I'm also wondering what this feedback mentioned on the Centre's page is about:
Feedback for each translator can then be left and is visible to all of your project managers.

Is that something new? Who else is it shared with? The translator?


 

Jo Macdonald  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 13:56
Member (2005)
Italian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
No effective communication between translator and client May 9, 2017

Thanks Alejandro and Mirko for clearing this up.

Alejandro to answer your question, I'd really prefer to be contacted in a way that makes communication between the person who has a job to do and the person who will be doing it both effective and simple.
The difference between someone who simply sends me an Email asking me to do a job and this system, which appears to make the whole process incredibly complicated, impersonal and easy to misunderstand, is huge.

This was my experience:
I received an Email that looked like a mass mail and appeared to be a scam, with a misleading title.
I found no info on Proz about this system.
I replied to the mail and instead of simply receiving a mail from someone (a real person) who replied, an account was automatically created in my name without my permission and a support ticket generated on another web site that I have to register on and go through to exchange Emails with the client and should receive an answer within 24 hours...seriously???

The idea of going through a third party customer support web portal to simply send Email and maybe get an answer within 24 hours for an urgent job to me sounds like it's not gonna work. When I signed up to Freshdesk I thought it was the agency's PM portal but it's not, it's a support ticket/customer help system. Do I need support/help to send and receive Email? I don't think so.

Thanks for giving us and potential clients another way of getting in touch but please try to make the communication process a LOT more effective and simple.

After Mirko explained this is a job offer from an agency I checked the Blue Board, a link to which should really be in the contact mail imo, and this looks like a good agency but I will probably not be working with them because of this incredibly complicated system used NOT to communicate, so that imo is a missed opportunity to put a translator and client in touch with each other and I don't think that is really Proz's intention.


 

Mirko Mainardi  Identity Verified
Italy
Local time: 13:56
Member
English to Italian
Agree May 9, 2017

Jo Macdonald wrote:

Alejandro to answer your question, I'd really prefer to be contacted in a way that makes communication between the person who has a job to do and the person who will be doing it both effective and simple.
The difference between someone who simply sends me an Email asking me to do a job and this system, which appears to make the whole process incredibly complicated, impersonal and easy to misunderstand, is huge.


I agree with everything Jo said and I just wanted to add one thing. As I was saying, last year an agency added me to their database and I started receiving these offers through the Translation Workspace, and in addition to the whole thing feeling extremely (definitely too much IMO) impersonal, aseptic and automated, those clearly were offers directed at several translators on a first come, first served basis, with a rate set by the agency (without taking into consideration my rates), without minimum fees or rush rates whatsoever, tight deadlines, etc. In other words, that felt very much like one of those online translation platforms that churn out cheap translations made by God knows who as fast as possible and definitely not a professional (and well... human...) approach to translation AND translators (who are still people, after all...). And that was all the more disappointing coming from a platform created and (conjointly) operated by ProZ.

Not sure if my experience and feeling about this approach were mostly influenced by the way that specific company used the system or by the system itself, but it felt like the Translation Workspace didn't really help any in that respect.


 

OneDocument, S.L.
Spain
Local time: 13:56
Member (2004)
French to Spanish
+ ...
Answer from OneDocument May 9, 2017

Dear all,

Please let me introduce myself, I'm Miguel Ángel Reyes Riera, Managing Director of OneDocument. Having read this thread, I would like to share with you the answer I sent to Jo about this, so you can have our view as the Company mentioned in this post.

-----------------
Hi Jo,

Thanks for your answer. First of all, please let me apologize for the mass email sent out in an effort to place this job. I saw in Proz that you opened a thread expressing your concerns.

OneDocument is a 10 year old translation company with an excellent track record on Proz's blueboard, we try to treat our lingusits fairly and respectfully. We started using Proz's Translation Center some months ago and one of its features lets us invite translators from Proz's directory, and that is why you received this invitation.

Why do we use Freshdesk? It is very convenient to track all queries, technical issues, etc. from here, and we can also create a knowledge base to share with our teams.

Please let me know if there is anything else I can do for you. Otherwise, I look forward to working with you in the future.

Thanks and best regards,

Miguel

------------------

We have been using Proz Translation Center and Freshdesk for months and it has dramatically improved our processes. A big thank you to the Proz.teamicon_smile.gif

Again, my apologies if we did something that caused any trouble to anyone, that was far from our purpose.

Thank you all and have a good evening,

Miguel


 
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