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Certain Exchange posts for sharing among Certified PROs
Thread poster: Susan Welsh

Susan Welsh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Member (2008)
Russian to English
+ ...
Sep 10, 2009

What conceivable justification is there for offering "Accounting Terms" in the Proz Exchange only to people with the Red P? I tried to look at it, and was blocked. Do only people with Red Ps need to know accounting terms?

http://www.proz.com/exchange/2288

Susan


[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2009-09-10 20:34 GMT]


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Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
Members only? Sep 10, 2009

Hi Susan.

I must be getting the wrong page but I did not see where it says that the access to that particular glossary is limited to "people with the red P". I am one, and I cannot access it either. It seems it must be discussed with the colleague who posted it, and only if you are a Proz member. So you should be able to write to him. It says it is free of charge, I mean the glossary.

Now, if you go to the site of the American Accounting Association you will notice that the glossary is not there either. If you try to access it through, for instance, the site of FIU (Florida International University) it also mentions membership as a requisite. So, I figure it is a matter of the AAA restricting their glossary to either accountants or accounting students registered with them. This is just an idea or, rather, an speculation. If so, how snobbish!

[Edited at 2009-09-10 17:04 GMT]


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Susan Welsh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Member (2008)
Russian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
error message Sep 10, 2009

When I click on the link on the homepage, I get an error message that says "Only Certified PROs can see this message." You apparently got further than I did, since you could see the sender's name and address.

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Lucia Leszinsky
SITE STAFF
New glossary exchange option for members of the Certified PRO Network Sep 10, 2009

Hello Susan and Luisa,

The post you see published in the Exchange main page is related to a glossary exchange option just introduced for members of the Certified PRO Network.

This option was implemented based on Certified PRO feedback in order to provide PROs with an area to share glossaries among other Certified PROs.

As this is a recently-introduced option, it is still being tested. I apologize for the confusion this may have caused you.

Hope this explains.

Please let me know if you need more clarification.

Regards,

Lucia


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Susan Welsh  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Member (2008)
Russian to English
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
To Lucia: I find this offensive Sep 10, 2009

Allow me to repeat my original question:

Susan Welsh wrote:

What conceivable justification is there for offering "Accounting Terms" in the Proz Exchange only to people with the Red P? ... Do only people with Red Ps need to know accounting terms?



I think it is offensive for fully paid members to be excluded from cooperative access to terminology bases, especially those that are advertised on the homepage.

Susan


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Sarah Appleby  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:15
German to English
Part of a bigger issue Sep 10, 2009

Susan has raised a very interesting issue with regard to the Certified Pro network and the way it seems to create a more exclusive, higher level tier of membership (despite the implication in the FAQs (http://www.proz.com/faq/5053#5053) that it is not elitist).

As a full, paying Platinium member, I find it bizarre to be excluded from certain areas of the site. Obviously I could apply to the Certified Pro network myself but I actively dislike the way it devalues my existing membership of the site. I think it is already possible to identify qualified translators from their profiles...


"What is the ProZ.com Certified PRO Network?

The ProZ.com Certified PRO Network is a new initiative of the ProZ.com community, the purpose of which is to identify qualified translators and translation companies working in various language pairs, and provide them with the option of networking and collaborating in an environment consisting entirely of screened professionals."


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Luisa Ramos, CT  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Member (2004)
English to Spanish
Susan, I agree Sep 10, 2009

I am a Certified Pro but I believe exclusivity about this type of resources makes no sense, and more harm than good.

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Jessica Noyes  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Spanish to English
+ ...
This happened to me today, also Sep 10, 2009

It was quite distressing to click on an interesting link, only to find, after the fact, that I could not access it. I suppose if it had said, "for certified pros only" before I clicked, it would not have felt like a slap in the face.
After reading the explanation above, I wonder how many ProZ badge holders, in their "feedback", said it was important to keep other members out of their glossary exchange?


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Stanislaw Czech, MCIL  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:15
Member (2006)
English to Polish
+ ...
Should it not be left to the poster? Sep 10, 2009

From what I see Antony wants to share something free of charge - if he feels like sharing it with Certified Pro members - should it not be left to him?

Best Regards
Stanislaw

[Edited at 2009-09-10 19:17 GMT]


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Russell Jones  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 20:15
Italian to English
Posters' choice Sep 10, 2009

Stanislaw Czech wrote:
From what I see Antony wants to share something free of charge - if he feels like sharing it with Certified Pro members - should it not be left to him?
Stanislaw

[Edited at 2009-09-10 19:17 GMT]


Jared (staff) is currently suggesting this sort of approach in another thread:
http://www.proz.com/forum/prozcom_technical_support/145046-if_proz_exchange_is_for_members_only_why_am_i_getting_bombarded_with_emails.html


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Jared Tabor
Local time: 16:15
SITE STAFF
Exchange post options for Certified PROs Sep 10, 2009

Hello all,

The Certified PRO Network offers members an opportunity to more closely network with a group of screened professionals. In this context, allowing Certified PROs to exchange glossaries as part of the networking makes sense. This in no way limits the regular use of the Exchange as it has been until now (in fact, as Russell points out, some improvements will be made to how it currently runs).

This feature of the Exchange is still in a very early stage. I wouldn't rule out the possibility of it being offered on a larger scale at a later time, but for the time being it is being tried out within the CPN.


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Antony Price  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 21:15
Member (2007)
Spanish to English
copy of glossary Sep 10, 2009

Dear all,

Well, well, I honestly was not fully aware when I posted the glossary that it would be limited to a certain sector of the site. For those of you who are really working on an accounting translation right now and would like a copy, read on.

It was the result of discussions on a separate thread and I was trying out an option that Patrick had made available. The idea of posting it was associated with the remark made on thay same thread, which is worth at least a quick scan.

http://www.proz.com/forum/collaboration_tools_and_features/142057-sharing_resources_within_the_network-page4.html#1209296

Now ProZ is a forum and that for me means discussion of possibilities; different options have to be tried out. There are plenty of questions over sharing resources and publicly available material should probably remain in the public domain. Was it privatized in a way when it was added to the ProZ Pro list?

There is no real harm in sharing information like this, as it is made available through a company (unless it was available unwittingly) although there are certainly plenty of legal questions, and after all, one wouldn't throw carefully crafted TMs before the gutter press, I suppose.

In the above thread...

"If uploading material however, you might also want to check with your lawyers regarding the question of copyright and file sharing of copyright material. There are many copies of dictionaries/glossaries on various file servers which may or may not be subject to copyright.

Best wishes,

Antony"

This particular glossary is publicly available which is why I did not have any qualms about posting it and thought it would be a good example. Others can access it straightaway now.

http://media.wiley.com/product_data/excerpt/64/04712657/0471265764.pdf

It may not last though, if and when this is brought to the attention of John Wiley and Sons. And for those who do download the file, what do you think CCC Sanchez would make of it all?

[Edited at 2009-09-10 21:42 GMT]

[Edited at 2009-09-10 21:43 GMT]


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Jessica Noyes  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 15:15
Spanish to English
+ ...
Change the way it's offered, then Sep 10, 2009

Jared wrote:

This feature of the Exchange is still in a very early stage. I wouldn't rule out the possibility of it being offered on a larger scale at a later time, but for the time being it is being tried out within the CPN.



If you must have private certified pro features, please don't announce them to us mere paid members. Either make them invisible to us or mark them as "certified pro only" or the like, so we don't click on a feature we are interested in and then realize, too late, that we are shut out. It wastes our time, and feels insulting.

I do appreciate Antony's open approach to sharing materials. Thank you!


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Nicole Schnell  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:15
English to German
+ ...
I agree, Jessica. Sep 10, 2009

Jessica Noyes wrote:

If you must have private certified pro features, please don't announce them to us mere paid members. Either make them invisible to us or mark them as "certified pro only" or the like, so we don't click on a feature we are interested in and then realize, too late, that we are shut out. It wastes our time, and feels insulting.


Especially when members are excluded, who provided the evaluation for numerous "Certified Pro label"-owners, even if they never bothered to get one for themselves.



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Christina Paiva  Identity Verified
Brazil
Local time: 16:15
Portuguese to English
+ ...
I second you, Nicole, Jessica, Luisa, Sarah and Susan! Sep 10, 2009

First of all, I'm concerned with principles.

I’ve decided to become a member because I believe in community work, people helping people … Not only at this site, but in real life! Not a slogan!

Learning that translators who wear a red badge are considered to belong to an exclusive club is very upsetting to say the least… Nothing against the red P! I consider it as a tool to market services. Just to make myself clear: earning a good position and jobs in the market IMO is an every day task, gaining experience, learning… It doesn’t matter if one has a pile of certificates…

On the other hand, marketing 'products' that are not avaiable to everyone(subliminal advertising?) is IMO a bad omen. I fell as if walls are being built, as in gated communities. Separating people in caste, classes …

I just can’t put in words how disappointed I am…

BTW – I was not able to see the thread mentioned by Anthony – It says … Something went wrong ….


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