| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6] > | No Identity, No Profile Thread poster: Henry Hinds
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The actual target of this link is quite funny.
| | | | Henry Hinds 
United States
Local time: 15:27
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER In memoriam | Opinions Appreciated | Sep 25, 2014 |
I cannot know everyone's point of view without asking for it as I have done here. I do appreciate what everyone has said, and no, I have never been a victim of stalking or anything similar. There is also no one out there looking for me that I would rather avoid. For those in that position, it is preferable to either stay offline or if you go online, to not reveal your true identity.
I do believe that unprofessional psedonyms or avatars and anonymity can be damaging to a person's fam... See more I cannot know everyone's point of view without asking for it as I have done here. I do appreciate what everyone has said, and no, I have never been a victim of stalking or anything similar. There is also no one out there looking for me that I would rather avoid. For those in that position, it is preferable to either stay offline or if you go online, to not reveal your true identity.
I do believe that unprofessional psedonyms or avatars and anonymity can be damaging to a person's fame as a professional, but that is up to the individual. I reveal my true identity but I do not depend on Proz as a source of work. Others do not either and are not concerned about their image. They like me, just like to participate. It does bother me a bit to sometimes be dealing with people I know nothing about, but it does not keep me from participating.
I know, Jared, that ProZ.com is not a "free speech zone". You have given your opinion, and it's the only one that counts. In principle I can also agree with "the person with the need sets the parameters". We've had a good discussion here, that's the main thing. It's an interesting subject and the response has been terrific. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Paulinho Fonseca
Brazil
Local time: 18:27
Member (2011)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
| Discussing and learning | Sep 25, 2014 |
Henry Hinds wrote:
I cannot know everyone's point of view without asking for it as I have done here. I do appreciate what everyone has said, and no, I have never been a victim of stalking or anything similar. There is also no one out there looking for me that I would rather avoid. For those in that position, it is preferable to either stay offline or if you go online, to not reveal your true identity.
I do believe that unprofessional psedonyms or avatars and anonymity can be damaging to a person's fame as a professional, but that is up to the individual. I reveal my true identity but I do not depend on Proz as a source of work. Others do not either and are not concerned about their image. They like me, just like to participate. It does bother me a bit to sometimes be dealing with people I know nothing about, but it does not keep me from participating.
I know, Jared, that ProZ.com is not a "free speech zone". You have given your opinion, and it's the only one that counts. In principle I can also agree with "the person with the need sets the parameters". We've had a good discussion here, that's the main thing. It's an interesting subject and the response has been terrific.
I know, Jared, that ProZ.com is not a "free speech zone". You have given your opinion, and it's the only one that counts. In principle I can also agree with "the person with the need sets the parameters". We've had a good discussion here, that's the main thing. It's an interesting subject and the response has been terrific. [/quote]
It has been a learning thing here. I must agree that everyone had her/his say, expressing different points of view and with due wording. Another good thing is I have done my homework and researched. History has shown that here and there people from different cultures have, for many reasons, chosen to be anonymous. I keep my opinion on the professional side and do find it relevant.
I am sure Andrea Riffo pointed it well here, although ends do not meet:
key sentence
If one wants to succeed in a career....'why play with names?'.
That's it.
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:27
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| Native in English | Sep 26, 2014 |
To be a native British English speaker, a translator into English, and to be based in London, where British English is at its most highly developed and up-to-date, and comes in so many variations, is a big plus.
That's why my name is "Tom in London". I'm not trying to hide my identity. I'm enhancing my profile. And the photograph you see really *is* me. That helps too.
[Edited at 2014-09-26 09:08 GMT]
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Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:27
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| We have Catherine Cookson! | Sep 26, 2014 |
Tom in London wrote:
To be a native British English speaker, a translator into English, and to be based in London, where British English is at its most highly developed and up-to-date, and comes in so many variations, is a big plus.
That's why my name is "Tom in London". I'm not trying to hide my identity. I'm enhancing my profile. And the photograph you see really *is* me. That helps too.
[Edited at 2014-09-26 09:08 GMT]
Although I see where you're coming from, some might disagree with you there; for example, the lovely citizens of Hastings (East Sussex), home to both Lewis Carroll (for a while) and … Catherine Cookson. Oh yeah, and don't forget Aleister Crowley!
Michael
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 23:27
French to English
| how does knowing my name help you to know me? | Sep 26, 2014 |
Henry Hinds wrote:
It does bother me a bit to sometimes be dealing with people I know nothing about
But if I told you my name you still wouldn't know that much about me. My first name is a female name in some countries and male in others for starters. My surname is obviously English, but then it's perfectly obvious from my profile and my posts that I'm a native English speaker, so it's not like you'd be finding anything out.
| | | | Henry Hinds
United States
Local time: 15:27
English to Spanish
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TOPIC STARTER In memoriam | More than the name | Sep 26, 2014 |
In dealing with people in normal off-line life, when people meet it is just common courtesty to introduce yourself by name and maybe say a bit about your background such as what you do for a living, maybe your education, etc. (understand profile).That may be a cultural thing, but it is a part of both cultures I belong to so it shapes my thinking. If I am dealing with someone who represents themselves by some kind of pseudonym and/or provides scarce personal information, then to me it is a warnin... See more In dealing with people in normal off-line life, when people meet it is just common courtesty to introduce yourself by name and maybe say a bit about your background such as what you do for a living, maybe your education, etc. (understand profile).That may be a cultural thing, but it is a part of both cultures I belong to so it shapes my thinking. If I am dealing with someone who represents themselves by some kind of pseudonym and/or provides scarce personal information, then to me it is a warning sign that they may have something to hide and cannot be trusted. Then again, many people I know well by name and other information I would not trust either.
But at least here at Proz I do not make deals with anyone except persons who have been well-known to me on the site for a long time and who use their true name. However, when I answer someone's questions, identity is not an issue because there is nothing at stake.
There was a site user who recently asked about a former Proz participant who used the pseudonym "Oso". Since I know a lot about that story, I told her what I could recall. "Oso" was indeed an outstanding participant and had a great personality that really shone. But "Oso" hid behind a pseudonym without revealing his true identity and was very cagey about giving specific details although he did have a profile, real or invented. "Oso" was eventually unmasked as a fraud and turned out to be a woman, not a man, and left Proz in disgrace.
Even if someone enters a real-sounding name, a plausible photo and a pretty complete profile does not mean they are not a fraud, nor does it mean that an anonymous user is a fraud. In answering questions I do not discriminate, but in a business deal I would. All I can say is that on my part I use my true name that can be verified on the Net from other sources, and my photo is me, though a bit old now. Maybe that's why I have no stalkers. Still, I am proud of being who I am and I am not reluctant to present myself openly to the world. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:27
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Texte Style wrote: Henry Hinds wrote:
It does bother me a bit to sometimes be dealing with people I know nothing about
But if I told you my name you still wouldn't know that much about me. My first name is a female name in some countries and male in others for starters. My surname is obviously English, but then it's perfectly obvious from my profile and my posts that I'm a native English speaker, so it's not like you'd be finding anything out.
It's just nice to know whether to write ‘he’ or ‘she’ when referring to a person in the forums or KudoZ area, rather than have to resort to awkward he/she constructions, etc. That's all. I would prefer to know a bit more than that, but hey, everyone has a right to their privacy. I do understand that. I would be quite satisfied if people with no info on their profiles and who are active in the KudoZ area would merely tell us whether they are male of female. And yes, I know that there are all kinds of problems with this and that it might be considered sexist, irrelevant, etc. It just makes communicating with people more fun if you have a tiny bit of info about who you are talking to. No big deal really, just nice.
Michael
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Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:27
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| There's much sense in what you say | Sep 26, 2014 |
Henry Hinds wrote:
Still, I am proud of being who I am and I am not reluctant to present myself openly to the world.
I agree with some of your points. I'm using my real name on this site and I use it because I believe that extra degree of transparency helps build trust and ultimately credibility.
However, there are many legitimate reasons why somebody might want to remain anonymous on ProZ. If we force people into using their real names we will end up with a more "professional" but less vibrant community.
Your anecdote about "Oso" is telling. I don't know the whole story, but the thought that immediately comes to my mind is "okay, that person was not what people thought she was, but did her actions really harm the community?" Is the community better off without her or by outing her has it lost exactly the sort of person - an "outstanding participant" as you put it - that ProZ should be aiming to attract?
While my real name is visible on ProZ I am (hopefully) anonymous on all the many other forums in which I am active. Those forums are not related to my work; they concern various hobbies or technical interests of mine. I prefer to keep my private life private, which is the main reason I don't participate in Facebook, Twitter or Google+ as an individual.
No doubt there are people on ProZ who regard this forum as a kind of hobby in the same way. Clearly many people don't want their real identities on display here, just as I don't want my real identity on display in my other forums.
I say live and let live. Sure, I'm predisposed to be more skeptical of those participants using pseudonyms, at least at first. But if they speak sense in the forums and comport themselves like adults and generally make a positive contribution, well, that's good enough for me.
Dan
| | | | Henry Hinds
United States
Local time: 15:27
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER In memoriam
Dan, if you want to check it out, the post on Oso was originated by Lavinia Pirlog on Spet. 24. Just hit "Recent Translation Forum Posts" at the top of the current listing and you can find it. Both that thread and this one here have fallen off the current listing which only takes in maybe one day's posts. I gave her what I recall about the story in my answer.
What I say is that it was sad that the person involved was fraudlent; it's probable that she could have come clean and made i... See more Dan, if you want to check it out, the post on Oso was originated by Lavinia Pirlog on Spet. 24. Just hit "Recent Translation Forum Posts" at the top of the current listing and you can find it. Both that thread and this one here have fallen off the current listing which only takes in maybe one day's posts. I gave her what I recall about the story in my answer.
What I say is that it was sad that the person involved was fraudlent; it's probable that she could have come clean and made it on her own merits. It is very discouraging when people resort to dishonesty. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 23:27
French to English
Henry Hinds wrote:
In dealing with people in normal off-line life, when people meet it is just common courtesty to introduce yourself by name and maybe say a bit about your background such as what you do for a living, maybe your education, etc. (understand profile).That may be a cultural thing, but it is a part of both cultures I belong to so it shapes my thinking. If I am dealing with someone who represents themselves by some kind of pseudonym and/or provides scarce personal information, then to me it is a warning sign that they may have something to hide and cannot be trusted. Then again, many people I know well by name and other information I would not trust either.
But at least here at Proz I do not make deals with anyone except persons who have been well-known to me on the site for a long time and who use their true name. However, when I answer someone's questions, identity is not an issue because there is nothing at stake.
There was a site user who recently asked about a former Proz participant who used the pseudonym "Oso". Since I know a lot about that story, I told her what I could recall. "Oso" was indeed an outstanding participant and had a great personality that really shone. But "Oso" hid behind a pseudonym without revealing his true identity and was very cagey about giving specific details although he did have a profile, real or invented. "Oso" was eventually unmasked as a fraud and turned out to be a woman, not a man, and left Proz in disgrace.
Even if someone enters a real-sounding name, a plausible photo and a pretty complete profile does not mean they are not a fraud, nor does it mean that an anonymous user is a fraud. In answering questions I do not discriminate, but in a business deal I would. All I can say is that on my part I use my true name that can be verified on the Net from other sources, and my photo is me, though a bit old now. Maybe that's why I have no stalkers. Still, I am proud of being who I am and I am not reluctant to present myself openly to the world.
No need to be jealous of not having stalkers I'm in my fifties and I'm still getting hassled. Just the other night a guy tried hitting on me in a most obnoxious way. Luckily I was walking the dog and it's the kind of dog you do not want to mess around with, so he backed off pretty quickly.
I'm proud of what I am and my achievements but not of who I am. My gender, colour and nationality, which is how most people will identify me in real life, are nothing but geographical and biological hasard.
One thing I really like about the Internet is precisely that you can interact with people without them knowing who you are. I can talk about bicycles on a biking forum and people will say things like "yeah Texte knows his stuff, I'd follow his advice". I'm pretty sure a lot of those cyclists would scoff at me saying the same thing if we were in a pub because I'm "too darn gorgeous to be taken seriously" (quoting an ex-boyfriend here, not boasting). Or maybe it's just my gender?
Oh so I'm an Oso on that biking forum. I am very curious as to why Oso had to leave in disgrace. Why should anyone have pressured her to give details about herself? I certainly will give no details that will help to identify me here, and I might occasionally disguise an anecdote simply to avoid detection. For example I might write "a biking forum" when in fact it's a forum where people discuss cars. I'll only change details that are not important to the point I'm making. Is that being cagey? I think it's a pity if people refuse to trust what I say because of that, because I'm always in good faith.
What's so terrible about Oso being a woman when others thought she was a man? This is not a dating website, and men and women can be equally good at translating so why on earth would it matter?
I can't help thinking maybe she's still around but under another name!? and reading all this and chortling.
If you are, Oso, I wouldn't mind hearing from you
| | | | Kay Denney
France
Local time: 23:27
French to English
| So we need a non-gendered pronoun | Sep 26, 2014 |
Michael Beijer wrote:
It's just nice to know whether to write ‘he’ or ‘she’ when referring to a person in the forums or KudoZ area, rather than have to resort to awkward he/she constructions, etc. That's all. I would prefer to know a bit more than that, but hey, everyone has a right to their privacy. I do understand that. I would be quite satisfied if people with no info on their profiles and who are active in the KudoZ area would merely tell us whether they are male of female. And yes, I know that there are all kinds of problems with this and that it might be considered sexist, irrelevant, etc. It just makes communicating with people more fun if you have a tiny bit of info about who you are talking to. No big deal really, just nice.
Michael
Time to invent a non-gendered pronoun to refer to people!
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Henry Hinds
United States
Local time: 15:27
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER In memoriam
Well, there you go, Texte, a non-gendered pronoun! But seriously, I don't consider gender, color, national origin, religion and other such factors to be relevant. I do value people's honesty and openness, especially when I myself risk (risk?) honesty and openness. I guess I don't have stalkers because people realize that the mug shot there is actually me, plus now I am well into my seventies. and I admit that I was younger when it was taken.
Yes, the Internet does offer people an op... See more Well, there you go, Texte, a non-gendered pronoun! But seriously, I don't consider gender, color, national origin, religion and other such factors to be relevant. I do value people's honesty and openness, especially when I myself risk (risk?) honesty and openness. I guess I don't have stalkers because people realize that the mug shot there is actually me, plus now I am well into my seventies. and I admit that I was younger when it was taken.
Yes, the Internet does offer people an opportunity to remain anonymous and masquerade, which is not so easy in real life. It also offers many opportunities for dishonesty, which are being exploited every day. Unfortunately the telephone (junk phone calls I get constantly from unidentified people) is also being much exploited. So my mistrust of those anonymous remains, but as long as no money is involved, it is not much of a concern to me.
Mind you, I have never said (and strongly resent the implication that I have ever said) that it was terrible about Oso being a woman when others thought she was a man. All I said was 1).- Oso was not the person he/she represented him/herself to be, and 2).- It is a shame that the person involved chose to be a fraud when she probably could have made it on her own merits. I think many of us truly loved the persona she created, and I'm sure we could have loved her real self as well had she been honest.
Why don't you check out the post and see?
The good thing is that I have been able to stimulate a lively discussion and the fact that we don't all agree certainly makes it interesting. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:27
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
Texte Style wrote: Michael Beijer wrote:
It's just nice to know whether to write ‘he’ or ‘she’ when referring to a person in the forums or KudoZ area, rather than have to resort to awkward he/she constructions, etc. That's all. I would prefer to know a bit more than that, but hey, everyone has a right to their privacy. I do understand that. I would be quite satisfied if people with no info on their profiles and who are active in the KudoZ area would merely tell us whether they are male of female. And yes, I know that there are all kinds of problems with this and that it might be considered sexist, irrelevant, etc. It just makes communicating with people more fun if you have a tiny bit of info about who you are talking to. No big deal really, just nice.
Michael Time to invent a non-gendered pronoun to refer to people!
You have no idea how happy that would make me. There is nothing I hate more than trying to rewrite some long sentence with too many pesky pronouns.
And by the way, I just read your other post and I am starting to see how not divulging one's identity might be a good thing. People do way too much judging based on sex, age, nationality, native language, education, etc. and if it helps you prevent or avoid this that's obviously a good thing.
Michael
| | | | | not Facebook | Sep 26, 2014 |
Some people find it annoying. Some find it unprofessional. Yet others switch from finding it disrespectful to no big deal in two days' time.
Whatever sentiment the use of pseudonyms invokes, I think what we should not forget is that Proz.com is not Facebook. This is not a site where you try to gather as many friends and followers as possible to build up whatever social image you'd like to create for yourself. This is a site by and for professionals - or at least, that's what ... See more Some people find it annoying. Some find it unprofessional. Yet others switch from finding it disrespectful to no big deal in two days' time.
Whatever sentiment the use of pseudonyms invokes, I think what we should not forget is that Proz.com is not Facebook. This is not a site where you try to gather as many friends and followers as possible to build up whatever social image you'd like to create for yourself. This is a site by and for professionals - or at least, that's what it's supposed to be. If your aim is to have 'fun' in communicating with people, well, that's simply not the purpose of Proz. That said, if your only aim was to have fun on the site, then why be annoyed by the fact that people use a pseudonym?
If potential clients don't want to consider working with people who use a pseudonym (which I know is not the case) then that's their business. Between peers I see absolutely no reason why someone should tell me what they are and who they are. It is simply none of my business. If I wish to work with someone or want to refer them because my own schedule is overloaded, then ALL that I'm interested in is whether or not they can do the job. Their name is of no importance.
Aside from the fact that I firmly believe that people should be allowed to defend themselves against stalkers in any way they feel is appropriate, I don't see any reason why 'people with no info on their profile and who are active in the Kudoz area' should 'merely tell us whether they are male or female'? (Let alone HOW that should be done: 'my suggestion is as follows and by the way, I am a man'???)
The purpose of Kudoz is clearly defined on its front page: "The KudoZ network provides a framework for translators and others to assist each other with translations or explanations of terms and short phrases."
Ergo: you ask a question, someone answers. I challenge anyone to disagree with me that the only thing that really matters in that context is whether that person is qualified to answer your question. Whether they have their entire Christian name and all their titles, bells and whistles spelled out as their user name or just a simple pseudonym, whether they are black or white, male or female is totally irrelevant.
What DOES matter is whether the profile behind the name or pseudonym tells the truth about native language, fields of expertise, etc., and we all know that that is more than often not the case. But that is not the subject of this thread. ▲ Collapse
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