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Anyone interested in helping us to convert the Russian forums to unicode?
Thread poster: Andrew Wright

Andrew Wright
United States
Local time: 02:08
English
Jan 30, 2006

Russian forumgoers,

We're in the preliminary testing stages for converting sections of the site to unicode and I'm trying to get an idea of what character set issues affect which languages areas.

If you'd be so kind I'd like an idea of what different character encodings are used for Russian text and how often they come up.

Also, if there is enough interest in testing out unicode here in the Russian forums I can get to work setting that up first thing in the morning.

Best regards,
Andrew Wright

[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2006-01-30 23:16]


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Crio
Russian Federation
Local time: 09:08
English to Russian
+ ...
Great! Jan 31, 2006

I think it is really great idea. Especially since there is something weird with ProZ and encoding autodetection feature of browsers does not work.

Concerning encodings: at present, the most widespread (by far and large) is cp1251 (windows encoding).
In the Internet KOI-8 is still in wide use and Unicode (I think, UTF-8) is rising quickly. I really hope it will become the standard for cyrillic alphabet.
All other are virtually inexistent in the PC world, though I don't know what does Macs use at present.


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 08:08
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
Hi Andrew Jan 31, 2006

We used only Win1251 (Cyrillic Windows) in the Russian forum (only two or three threads were posted in KOI8R by mistake).

Please tell us what should we do and how can we help you.



[Edited at 2006-01-31 09:08]


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Alexander Onishko  Identity Verified
Local time: 09:08
Member (2007)
Russian to English
+ ...
but why ? Jan 31, 2006

Dear Andrew !

There is a Russian saying, which may be translated as "if a motor/machine is running don't touch it and you will not break it"


We use Win1251 and it suites us fine - why to change something ?


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Vitali Stanisheuski  Identity Verified
Belarus
Local time: 09:08
Member (2005)
English to Belarusian
+ ...
questions Jan 31, 2006

Would the implementation of unicode solve the problem of distortion of Cyrillic texts or texts with umlauts etc. ?(Sometimes, Cyrillic texts are distorted in Kudoz and umlauts are distorted permanently in Kudoz (when asking) and in the Term Search).

Would it influence the Kudoz, Job and other mails in some manner?

[Edited at 2006-01-31 11:41]


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Andrew Wright
United States
Local time: 02:08
English
TOPIC STARTER
To answer some questions Jan 31, 2006

I'll address the varous questions posed here in one post.

I'd like to start with Alexander's question, since it's a perfectly good one. While it is true that the Russian forum has the benefit of using a single primary character set, this is not true for the rest of the site in terms of other languages and the multi-lingual nature of KudoZ. It's important for us to set Unicode as the standard for the entire site, it's not practical to just change bits and peices. This is why I want to test things out now, if there are any speed bumps on this course it's better to find them now and get them over with.

Now to answer Vitali's questions that I touched on a little alrady. Eventually we would like to have the entire site converted to unicode, so that ProZ.com can have a single unified character set throughout. And while I'm not familiar with the precise issue with diacritics you mentioned, I can only assume that this is caused by some small discrepancy between character sets so I don't believe it would still occur should everything be in unicode.

- Andrew Wright


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Galina Blankenship  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 23:08
Member (2004)
English to Russian
+ ...
I think it is a great idea! Jan 31, 2006

I am honestly tired of changing the encoding of the site on a regular basis. Whenever I post a question (or view the answer posted by me, or browse the glossaries) I can't always view it in the right encoding bacause I might risk losing all the entered data. It is certainly a lame situation...
I will be happy to assist in this mission.


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Sergei Tumanov  Identity Verified
Local time: 09:08
English to Russian
+ ...
little off - to smile Jan 31, 2006

Alexander Onishko wrote:

Dear Andrew !

There is a Russian saying, which may be translated as "if a motor/machine is running don't touch it and you will not break it"


I know a good English translation of it. Just in case:

Don't trouble trouble
before trouble troubles you
It only doubles troubles
and troubles others too!


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Boris Kimel  Identity Verified
Russian Federation
Local time: 09:08
English to Russian
+ ...
Two things I long to be done Jan 31, 2006

First of all, no page of ProZ has its encoding set explicitly. Though not endorsed officially enabling this could help. My browser definitely won't default to unicode.

The mails coming from ProZ (Kudoz and forum messages) also do not have any encoding specifying headers. It's OK with almost any email client but Outlook 2003. Unicode or not, we could just specify it...

Sincerely wishing a better ProZ.com


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Andrew Wright
United States
Local time: 02:08
English
TOPIC STARTER
Was delayed a few days Feb 2, 2006

Hello again folks,

Sorry it took me so long to get back to this topic, but the Unicode migration scheme used in the Japanese forum didn't work out with Russian character sets, so I've been working hard on the alternate scheme that works for all languages.

In the mean time I have written a utility that will allow old forum posts and topic titles to be converted into unicode via a little help from the viewer. This tool has been released in the Romanian forum for testing and I have personally used it to convert Russian posts into Unicode in a test environment.

All forums will eventually be switching over to Unicode, the sooner the better. But I want to be sure that the majority of people in this forum are prepared for that change before I go ahead and do it. This is a big change, so if some more preperation time is needed then let me know and I will hold off for a little while longer.

Sorry again to keep you waiting all week.

Andrew Wright
ProZ.com Staff


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 08:08
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
Andrew Feb 2, 2006

Could you please explain the meaning of the icons appearing in the thread titles? When should one click on them? For example, I use Win1251 and the thread looks fine for me; should I click the 'text looks fine' icon?



[Edited at 2006-02-02 23:37]


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Andrew Wright
United States
Local time: 02:08
English
TOPIC STARTER
Icons shown too soon Feb 3, 2006

Natalie wrote:

Could you please explain the meaning of the icons appearing in the thread titles? When should one click on them? For example, I use Win1251 and the thread looks fine for me; should I click the 'text looks fine' icon?



[Edited at 2006-02-02 23:37]


Sorry Natalie, that was only supposed to show up once the forum was ready to switch over to unicode completely. For the tool to work effectively it needs the character set in the page to be set to unicode. I'll enable both when you're all ready for the switch.

Andrew Wright


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 08:08
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
Another question Feb 3, 2006

Andrew, I would like to ask when are you planning to switch the KudoZ to Unicode? KudoZ are much more important than forums as in the forums we rarely use two different encodings in the same posting and there has never been any problems with encodings in the forums.

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Andrew Wright
United States
Local time: 02:08
English
TOPIC STARTER
KudoZ to come soon Feb 3, 2006

Natalie wrote:

Andrew, I would like to ask when are you planning to switch the KudoZ to Unicode? KudoZ are much more important than forums as in the forums we rarely use two different encodings in the same posting and there has never been any problems with encodings in the forums.



KudoZ and Jobs are next on the schedule. The reason we're looking at forums right now is that they are the best place to start this project. The KudoZ system is in constant use as new questions come in constantly and hundreds of people are viewing them, if we were to start the change there any mistake or inconsistancy would cause a much bigger problem than here in the forums, which are better indexed and have a much more manageable pace.

Andrew Wright


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Natalie  Identity Verified
Poland
Local time: 08:08
Member (2002)
English to Russian
+ ...

Moderator of this forum
I see, thanks Feb 3, 2006

Then we may start at any time. Please just notify us of the date.

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