Header numbers in TE
Thread poster: Heinrich Pesch

Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 20:38
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
Apr 20, 2008

This time a customer sent an urgent translation. It was a Word-doc-file. The same text had been translated earlier, but now when applying the tm to the updated text (only new parts were added in between) Trados did not recognise the segments or only a minority.
First it looked as if I would have to translate the stuff anew, but then I noticed, that I could copy most of the missing segments straight from the TM, a txt-file in Notepad. In most cases I had "only" to add tags, there were a lot of tags in the text.
In many instanced TE (or Workbench) did not segment the text properly, even though it were normal sentences with capital letters at the beginning and a full stop with a following space at the end.
And I noticed Trados had segmented the headers together with the leading numbers: e.g.:

14.1 (tab) Agreement

In the TM there were no numbers, so Trados did not recognise the segment.

Now I wonder how this could have been avoided? According to my experience Trados should have ignored the header numbers and concentrate on the text.

Never translate the same sentence twice. But this time the software did not fulfill its promise. I wonder why?
Regards
Heinrich


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Daniel García
English to Spanish
+ ...
Was it a real tab or tag for a tab Apr 20, 2008

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

This time a customer sent an urgent translation. It was a Word-doc-file. The same text had been translated earlier, but now when applying the tm to the updated text (only new parts were added in between) Trados did not recognise the segments or only a minority.
First it looked as if I would have to translate the stuff anew, but then I noticed, that I could copy most of the missing segments straight from the TM, a txt-file in Notepad. In most cases I had "only" to add tags, there were a lot of tags in the text.
In many instanced TE (or Workbench) did not segment the text properly, even though it were normal sentences with capital letters at the beginning and a full stop with a following space at the end.
And I noticed Trados had segmented the headers together with the leading numbers: e.g.:

14.1 (tab) Agreement

In the TM there were no numbers, so Trados did not recognise the segment.

Now I wonder how this could have been avoided? According to my experience Trados should have ignored the header numbers and concentrate on the text.

Never translate the same sentence twice. But this time the software did not fulfill its promise. I wonder why?



Hi,

Was a real tab (it looked like a little arrow) or was it an internal tag for the tab?

I am asking because if you had a tag (like 14.1(tag)Agreement) then that could be the reason why the Workbench was including everything in the sentence (it only saw a tag not a tab).

Daniel


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 20:38
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
They were tabs Apr 20, 2008

In Word the look like arrows. The actual tags are invisible in Word.

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Stanislav Pokorny  Identity Verified
Czech Republic
Local time: 19:38
English to Czech
+ ...
Previous translation in TagEditor Apr 20, 2008

Hi Heinrich,
it seems that the previous translation had been done using TagEditor. So there are two possible ways for you to proceed:
1) Translate the new file in TagEditor
2) Set lower TM fuzzy threshold

Hope it helps.


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 20:38
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
In Tageditor! Apr 21, 2008

I did the translation in Te, but it was all segmented wrong. If I had worked in Word I would have used Wordfast of course. The problem was, that Trados could not segment the stuff properly and I had to past the target segments from Wordpad into TE.

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Margreet Logmans  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 19:38
English to Dutch
+ ...
Automatic lay-out Apr 21, 2008

It could be that Tag-Editor had trouble with this because there was automatic lay-out in the Word-doc.
Simple check: place your cursor after 14.1, press Enter. If Word gives you 14.2, the lay-out is automatic.

Just out of curiosity: why did you not try Word + Translator's Workbench?


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Heinrich Pesch  Identity Verified
Finland
Local time: 20:38
Member (2003)
Finnish to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Customer wanted TE Apr 21, 2008

Margreet Logmans wrote:

It could be that Tag-Editor had trouble with this because there was automatic lay-out in the Word-doc.
Simple check: place your cursor after 14.1, press Enter. If Word gives you 14.2, the lay-out is automatic.

Just out of curiosity: why did you not try Word + Translator's Workbench?


The customer needed uncleaned ttx-files. that's why I used TE. I had to check the tags and most of the time I spent adding tags which would be unvisible in Word.
But I do not understand why automatic layout should make any trouble, all properly formatted Word-docs have automatic layout-features.
I just started this thread because TE is supposed to handle Word-documents better than Word with Trados-plug-in.

Regards
Heinrich


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 19:38
Member (2003)
Polish to German
+ ...
TE does handle Word documents better Apr 21, 2008

But you have to use tags - this is obvious.
All formatting is always represented by tags. Only in the target aplication you do not see tags, because they are properly interpreted by it.
As for your problem: just modify the segmentation rules accordingly in your Translation Memory setup. There is a rule for tabulator - just change the setting so, that it will be always treated as "End of segment".

BR
Jerzy


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Margreet Logmans  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 19:38
English to Dutch
+ ...
I see Apr 21, 2008

I've had trouble with automated layout and TE in the past, maybe because the original documents had been messed up.
Personally, I do all Word-docs in Word+Trados. No problems, but a bit slow with big, long documents.

For now, Jerzy's comments are the most valuable here, I think.


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