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Studio 2009 already stable?
Thread poster: Jose Ruivo

Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 16:58
Member (2007)
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Jan 17, 2010

Hi All,

I got an upgrade license from Trados 2007 to Studio 2009 early when Studio 2009 was released. However, I was so disapointed with Studio instability that forgot about it and went on using other CAT tools.

Presently, considering there's already been an SP1 released, can anyone tell me if Studio is stable and usable, already? (Please, can you compare Studio's stability to other CAT tools, not just to its previous version?)

A couple more questions:

1) do you think Studio has made your work easier or more productive? If so why?

2) what new feature of Studio do you like best?

3) if/when I decide to move to Studio, what should I beware of?

Thanks a lot,
Jose


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
English to German
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Yes Jan 17, 2010

Hi Jose,
I switched to Studio SP1 (including the KB 2913 hotfix) in November 2009.


Presently, considering there's already been an SP1 released, can anyone tell me if Studio is stable and usable, already? (Please, can you compare Studio's stability to other CAT tools, not just to its previous version?)

Definitely stable and usable, as far as I can tell; the stability is equivalent to SDL Trados Suite 2007 (Build 863), which I had been using without any problems.


1) do you think Studio has made your work easier or more productive? If so why?

2) what new feature of Studio do you like best?

Simple answer: AutoSuggest.

I cannot answer your third question, since I don't know anything about your system and requirements.

Best regards,
Ralf

PS It took me about a day to adapt to working with Studio - haven't had any reason to go back to the previous version at all.

[Edited at 2010-01-17 21:29 GMT]


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Pavel Tsvetkov  Identity Verified
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MODERATOR
Studio 2009 is a much better product... when it works. Jan 17, 2010

I postponed buying the upgrade until the release of 2009 SP1. Then read all pertinent information provided by SDL, and carefully followed the threads on this forum - so that to know what to really expect. Finally, I felt reasonably sure that Studio should be stable enough to give it a try.

I uninstalled the previous version of Multiterm (as required), but when I installed Studio, I could no longer use Trados under Word - neither Multiterm, nor Freelance 2007 worked under Word anymore, and this is a serious drawback for me. But that was not the only glitch. When I tried upgrading my translation memories, the result left me with mixed feelings, as on 2 or 3 TMs I got some strange error messages (passwords?...) and the upgrade process failed. On some of them the process was only partially successful. It was difficult/impossible to understand what exactly the problem was.

The interface and process of Studio 2009, in my humble opinion, is not straight forward, and is not easy to understand even for a Trados user of several years/versions behind his back. The problems with Word do not seem to have a fix at this point, and several posted threads here, are mostly inconclusive.

I finally got tired, I felt frustrated and angry, because I have work to do, and cannot afford to sit around and wait for SDL to finally get their software up and running like it should have been months ago.

I reinstalled Windows and v2007 (by means of a Norton Ghost image), and am comparatively happy now. At least I know what to expect of v2007 - with all its shortcomings and inefficiencies.

UPDATE: I succeeded with the second install, although initially I had the same problem as described above. Thanks to the solution proposed by Jerzy Czopik below, I was able to fix it.

Now I have already translated my first file in Studio and I can say this:

1. SDL are finally heading in the right general direction by introducing a single interface and a few interesting new features. However, even if those new feature do speed up work a little bit, unless the product becomes stable and dependable, they will mean nothing.
2. Studio 2009, and especially Multiterm, needs more work, as it still crashes, the interface is buggy, etc. This is all very frustrating, because as a freelancer I MUST FEEL CONFIDENT THAT THE TOOL WILL NOT LET ME DOWN, that I will not lose any work, mess up my databases, or find it impossible to deliver on time.
3. Solutions to problems should not be provided as individual patches which one may or may not find on the support site. Also: some of these cumulative updates, actually break the software instead of mending it.
4. Unfinished products should not be sold at the price at which SDL sells Studio 2009. If I am not mistaken the current version of Dejavu X was initially released 6-7 years ago and it still works better than any of the Trados versions published since. Why? Because they make sure they do not release software which has not been thoroughly tested and bug-free.

In short: Studio 2009 is a much better product... when it works.

[Edited at 2010-01-26 13:02 GMT]


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Jerzy Czopik  Identity Verified
Germany
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Polish to German
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There is some solution for MT problems in Word Jan 17, 2010

Look at talisma.sdl.com for article 3016

From my personal point of view Studio is quite stable, but not that stable as SDL Trados 2007. I must admit I have done some really demanding projects, which go far beyond of what I nhave ever expected from any other CAT tool, so my impresion might be little biased by those projects. A single Word file with 90,000 words is a problem itself, but Studio was really slow with it. But this was the only problem - any search and replace operation took really long. OTOH there were no slightest problems with processing this file.

Studio is a big enhancement in terms of productivity, and this not only because of AutoSugest. The translation process is easier and faster as before. You can create projects of multiple files and you can keep folder structures, which is indeed helpful. You don't have to pay attention to file names and their locations - this will simply be taken care by the program.
And Studio is a big step towards working in line with EN 15038 in easy way.

I do not regret using Studio and would not like to get back to Trados 2007. TBH I am really glad the Word integration will not exist anymore. Working with Word is a headache...


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hellmut1956  Identity Verified
Local time: 17:58
German to Spanish
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Agreeing on Studio Jan 18, 2010

Studio 2009 Sp1 is a wonderful tool that really offers the 25-30% increase in efficiency assuming that...

Due to the fact that Studio is so powerful it demands a fast computer. I had to upgrade my computer anyhow, so I decided to do it right.
I purchased a motherboard with an Intel I7-920 CPU, 6 GBytes of DDR3 memory, a raid 10 system, a powerful graphics card capable to connect 2 24" displays at a time to get a large Desktop in a Windows 7-64 Bit Ultimate environment.
The reason I decided to do so was because of two weaknesses perceived when running Studio on my old system. One was that the 2 GBytes of DDR2 memory where not enough to use the preview functionality for the translation of word documents and the second because the AutoSuggest feature showed its proposal when I was half the way through typing making it close to worthless.

Because I want to have immediate support available when needed I have paid for service contract for Studio. Every penny well spend! I am telling you this because I want to share with you why my son laughed loudly when the support engineer from Trados worked on my computer from remote. He said "Wow is this fast!"

Now I have found that the algorithm from Trados for AutoSuggest needs improvement as it often does not pop-up suggestions it had done some minutes earlier. I am sure this is due to the limitation of computing power available for most users on their computers. It forces them to keep the database footprint too small. A way to overcome this limitation is by heavily using the Term base and enter terms you know will be found often during the translation while you translate. Autosuggest presents terms of the terminology database as the top choice.

A strong problem with Studio and Windows 7 is that it is not possible to install the 2007 Suite which is required to upgrade old TMS. I believe Trados needs to implement the ability to upgrade and downgrade TMs between the new Studio and the old 2007 Suite versions without the 2007 Suite on the same computer. Right now I have Studio and 2007 Suite installed on my mobile computer running XP Pro. The Plus license entitles you to install Studio on your second computer and to keep the old 2007 Suite. Many customers are not willing to upgrade as the repercussion for them is huge. Large accounts have very sophisticated processes and complex setups that would require huge resources to move while using the old version to the new Studio environment. But for freelancers like me Studio is such an increase in efficiency that I got my new system paid with the gain in efficiency just in 4Q2009!


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Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 16:58
Member (2007)
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Not the hardware Jan 18, 2010

Ralf Lemster wrote:


I cannot answer your third question, since I don't know anything about your system and requirements.

Best regards,
Ralf

PS It took me about a day to adapt to working with Studio - haven't had any reason to go back to the previous version at all.

[Edited at 2010-01-17 21:29 GMT]


Hi Ralf,

I was not talking about hardware, but incompatible formats, operations no longer possible etc.

From what I've read in this thread, TM format seems to have changed.

Quite often I have clients asking me for an unclean version of the translated files. Can Studio produce that, in the same format as Trados 2007? I have the feeling it can't...

Thanks,
Jose


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Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 16:58
Member (2007)
English to Portuguese
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The interface problem Jan 18, 2010

Pavel Tsvetkov wrote:
The interface and process of Studio 2009, in my humble opinion, is not straight forward, and is not easy to understand even for a Trados user of several years/versions behind his back.


I second you opinion about the interface - a few months ago when I tried Studio, I felt like I was leraning how to use a new tool. Considering Ralf has also needed a day to come to terms with the interface, the "issue" seems general.

I'll bear in mind that I'll need confortable free time to learn how to use Studio. Do you any simple instructions for using it, similar to the good old "Trados for Idiots"?

Thanks,
Jose


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Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 16:58
Member (2007)
English to Portuguese
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TOPIC STARTER
Compatibility's a must Jan 18, 2010

Jerzy Czopik wrote:

You can create projects of multiple files and you can keep folder structures, which is indeed helpful. You don't have to pay attention to file names and their locations - this will simply be taken care by the program.


Seems nice. Can you propagate, both what you translate and what you edit, to other files in the project? Idiom workbench allows that!


Jerzy Czopik wrote:
I do not regret using Studio and would not like to get back to Trados 2007.


I absolutelly need to be able to use Trados 2007, for compatibility with clients requests and with colleagues who don't have Studio. It's not an option not being able to do it.
And I'm still suspicious about the conversions between memory formats used by the 2 versions.

Thanks,
Jose


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
English to German
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TTX Jan 18, 2010

Hi again,

I was not talking about hardware,

...me neither?

but incompatible formats, operations no longer possible etc.

From what I've read in this thread, TM format seems to have changed.

Quite often I have clients asking me for an unclean version of the translated files. Can Studio produce that, in the same format as Trados 2007? I have the feeling it can't...

If they deliver a TTX created using the latest version of 2007 (build 863), you can deliver the target TTX and/or the target file.


I second you opinion about the interface - a few months ago when I tried Studio, I felt like I was leraning how to use a new tool.

That's because it is a new tool.


Considering Ralf has also needed a day to come to terms with the interface, the "issue" seems general.

Just to clarify: I did not spend a full day trying to get to grips with the new interface - that took a couple of hours or so (bearing in mind I had seen the interface during the beta test). After about a day I was able to properly work with it, and have not used 2007 since (except for creating or converting TTXs).

Our intern, who had only been using Trados sporadically at university, needed part of a weekend to get to grips with it. (Pretty good, I'd say.) Some long-term Trados users seem to have more problems adapting than new users.

Best,
Ralf


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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
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not a bug, but a "feature" Jan 18, 2010

hellmut1956 wrote:

Now I have found that the algorithm from Trados for AutoSuggest needs improvement as it often does not pop-up suggestions it had done some minutes earlier. I am sure this is due to the limitation of computing power available for most users on their computers.


I haven't upgraded yet, but as far as I know, this is not due to lack of computing power or a bug, but a "feature". The AutoSuggest dictionary isn't populated or updated on-the-fly. You'll have to create a new dictionary from scratch every time you want to have a new phrase included.

Just to make sure: mind the quotation marks around "feature".

Edit: added "due to lack of computing power or".


[Bearbeitet am 2010-01-18 10:20 GMT]


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Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
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English to Portuguese
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TOPIC STARTER
Mixed opinion Jan 18, 2010

hellmut1956 wrote:

Studio 2009 Sp1 is a wonderful tool that really offers the 25-30% increase in efficiency assuming that...


Other than AutoSugest and beiing able to create projects with several files, what guives you that 30% extra productivity?


hellmut1956 wrote:
One was that the 2 GBytes of DDR2 memory where not enough to use the preview functionality for the translation of word documents and the second because the AutoSuggest feature showed its proposal when I was half the way through typing making it close to worthless.


That sounds hawfull... My Vista 32 bits doesn't handle much more than 2 GB of RAM, certainly not 4 GB. My natural upgrade would be Windows 7 - 64 bit, but apparently you can't run Trados 2007 in Windows 7

hellmut1956 wrote:
Because I want to have immediate support available when needed I have paid for service contract for Studio.


I've also bought that, but only because after installing Studio I could not get MultiTerm 2007 to work, and couldn't find help otherwise
Support is OK, although not as fast as I would like - in order to solve my MultiTerm 2007 issue, it took 3 replies from Support; considering you get a reply the next day after your call for support it took me no less than 3 days to solve the problem...


hellmut1956 wrote:
Many customers are not willing to upgrade as the repercussion for them is huge. Large accounts have very sophisticated processes and complex setups that would require huge resources to move while using the old version to the new Studio environment.


You can't blame them, can you? I'm not a large account myself, and I'm not willing to let go of Trados 2007, considering how incompatible the new and old versions are...

Thanks,
Jose


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
English to German
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Various sources for AutoSuggest Jan 18, 2010

Hi,

I haven't upgraded yet, but as far as I know, this is not a bug, but a "feature". The AutoSuggest dictionary isn't populated or updated on-the-fly. You'll have to create a new dictionary from scratch every time you want to have a new phrase included.

Re-creating the AS dictionary is too complex a process to be done 'on the fly' - if you want a specific phrase included, you can simply add it in MultiTerm. Note that the AS function uses multiple sources, with termbase entries generally shown on top of AS dictionary entries.

Just to make sure: mind the quotation marks around "feature".

Interesting. (Note the part of your quote I marked in bold.)


Best,
Ralf


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Jose Ruivo  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 16:58
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English to Portuguese
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Unfair advantage Jan 18, 2010

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Just to clarify: I did not spend a full day trying to get to grips with the new interface - that took a couple of hours or so (bearing in mind I had seen the interface during the beta test). After about a day I was able to properly work with it, and have not used 2007 since (except for creating or converting TTXs).

Our intern, who had only been using Trados sporadically at university, needed part of a weekend to get to grips with it. (Pretty good, I'd say.) Some long-term Trados users seem to have more problems adapting than new users.

Best,
Ralf


I'd think that knowledge of the Beta version (and foundness of the product (?)) might have helped you.
I'm a fairly long term user of Trados - since around 1997 - and I never had a great opinon of the product, so these both perhaps make my adaption harder. I'll propably need a few hours a day, throughout several days, to try, read, and ask questions.

Thanks!
Jose


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Erik Freitag  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
Member (2006)
Dutch to German
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@Ralf Jan 18, 2010

Ralf Lemster wrote:

Hi,

I haven't upgraded yet, but as far as I know, this is not a bug, but a "feature". The AutoSuggest dictionary isn't populated or updated on-the-fly. You'll have to create a new dictionary from scratch every time you want to have a new phrase included.

Re-creating the AS dictionary is too complex a process to be done 'on the fly' - if you want a specific phrase included, you can simply add it in MultiTerm. Note that the AS function uses multiple sources, with termbase entries generally shown on top of AS dictionary entries.

Just to make sure: mind the quotation marks around "feature".

Interesting. (Note the part of your quote I marked in bold.)


Best,
Ralf


Dear Ralf,

yes, I know how this can be overcome by using MultiTerm. I was just trying to explain that this is normal behaviour and not due to insufficient performance of the computer (though you could argue that the AutoSuggest dictionary can't be updated instanteneously because this is too complex a task, hence it ultimately is due to insufficient computer power

By using quotation marks I just wanted to say that this really isn't a useful feature, but a built-in limitation of the software.

This is not a reason for my not having upgraded.

Best regards,
Erik



[Bearbeitet am 2010-01-18 10:37 GMT]

[Bearbeitet am 2010-01-18 10:37 GMT]


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Ralf Lemster  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 17:58
English to German
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"Unfair"? Jan 18, 2010

Jose,
Sorry, you've lost me here - what's "unfair" about my having taken part in the beta test?


I'd think that knowledge of the Beta version (and foundness of the product (?)) might have helped you.

Not much, since the beta test was in spring, and I didn't touch the software for several months - which doesn't help in terms of getting up to speed with it. Not sure what you mean by "fondness" (I suppose) - I know it's an 'in thing' to criticise SDL/Trados, but frankly, I have no reason to as far as SP1 is concerned.

I'm a fairly long term user of Trados - since around 1997 - and I never had a great opinon of the product, so these both perhaps make my adaption harder.

Well, nobody can force you to use it...

Personally, I have no problem whatsoever if other LSPs don't upgrade - after all, I still work with Office 2003 - but I fail to see what's unfair about being able to use a tool properly.

Best, Ralf


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